justin said:We could breed our own cats for food. Catch birds, geese, and rabbits plus the occasional neighborhood stray violating the leash laws.
Please don't forget to invite me over for dinner
justin said:We could breed our own cats for food. Catch birds, geese, and rabbits plus the occasional neighborhood stray violating the leash laws.
Exactly. My casual drug addict cousin gets free medical care for her and her son (no deductible, either). She gets food stamps. She has worked one month out of about the last five years. She gets about 90% of the rent on her 2 bedroom apartment paid by HUD/Section8, a subsidy of a bit over $1000/month. Her son goes to public school, of course. When she works, she has free child care available to her.HaHa said:Remember also that these poverty data are not adjusted for commodities and services received- like food stamps, rent subsidies, various low income medical programs, etc. So even at this level, a level most of us would not want to visit as adults anyway, to pay for an equivalent lifestyle to the povery level would take more than $14,000.
Ha
Sam said:loosechickens and 2ndCor512,
I agree with both of you on the basic neccessity of life. I consider myself a simple person living a simple life. However, I just cannot imagine a budget of 10K for 2 persons in this country. There is a reason (I think) why the goverment publishes the poverty data every year. That data says 14K is the poverty level for a couple (2 persons). Push comes to shove, I think I can do it with 20K for 2 persons in this country. Anything less than that would be depriving, I think.
I guess what I'm saying is show me how it can be done with 10K? IIRC, I think you, loosechickens, live full time in a newer RV. Depreciation alone on that RV is at least 10K annually, no?
loosechickens said:Look, I sure don't really WANT to live on $10,000......I LIKE having money and spending whatever we like, but I never mistake liking something with needing something. We're really lucky that way because we're not really very "things" oriented, don't have expensive hobbies, enjoy making and doing things for ourselves. All this money is really not necessary to our happiness. Sometimes it even seems like it robs us of using our ingenuity to do things like we used to do.....mostly having money seems more like not relevant. We were happy and felt abundance when we had little money and we're happy and feel abundance now that we do. That's all.
free4now said:Moving from an expensive area to a cheaper area can easily cost tens of thousands of dollars to sell your home, scout the new location, and move. It's cheaper for me to rent here in San Francisco for a few years than it would be buy a home and live a few years in some supercheap place like Iowa. Converting to a $10k or $20k or even $30k lifestyle is not something that can be done free or instantaneously, and the cost of that conversion may be more than you save, unless you commit to 5-10 years or more.
free4now said:Interesting thread. When I started reading this I thought the numbers people were reporting were too low. I consider minimum spending the amount below which I'd want to look for work to get more. The minimum that would keep me FIREd.
Something else to keep in mind is that it can be expensive to get into a lower spending situation. Moving from an expensive area to a cheaper area can easily cost tens of thousands of dollars to sell your home, scout the new location, and move. It's cheaper for me to rent here in San Francisco for a few years than it would be buy a home and live a few years in some supercheap place like Iowa. Converting to a $10k or $20k or even $30k lifestyle is not something that can be done free or instantaneously, and the cost of that conversion may be more than you save, unless you commit to 5-10 years or more.
That's a tough one. We've lived all over the world so when we landed in Hawaii we knew we were onto a good deal. Five years later when the Navy exhiled us to San Diego we knew we wanted to get back to Hawaii. (Many of the island's naysayers are kama'aina who've never lived anywhere else, let alone in places with winter.) After spending 15 of the last 18 years here, raising a kid on the island, and finding our "dream house", we don't see any reason to move again.Rich_in_Tampa said:We'd like to downsize to a smaller home, but don't yet know where our longterm retirement locale will be (depends on kids' plans, wife's career and a few other things that are a few years away). And it may well be that we stay where we are.
So while a downsize seems sensible, if we move again 2 or 3 years later it will cost us a bundle. It's cheaper to stay in this oversized house than it is to downsize (not to mention Florida's property tax caps which we'd lose upon moving to another house in the state).
Want2retire said:That was beautifully stated. So many of us trade too much of our time for money. My father died a wealthy man, but found out he had terminal cancer literally the day he was moving out of his office to retire.
But we are all so influenced by Madison Avenue and the psychology of advertising. Do we really NEED all the junk we buy, and end up throwing away a few years later? Obviously not. What many of us need is the capability of retiring a year or two earlier than planned, which we could do if we stopped buying so many impulse items.
I love it! I can totally relate.As an example, we went to visit friends with a house and I sat on the john musing at the linen closet across from me with an open door, and counted 63 towels. We have 4. And I'm sure that the relative level of other stuff is just the same. When your belongings are fewer, it stands to reason that you spend less.
loosechickens said:As an example, we went to visit friends with a house and I sat on the john musing at the linen closet across from me with an open door, and counted 63 towels.
loosechickens said:I wasn't in any way disparaging others' budgets
ashtondav said:These are our expenses for 2 people living in England, aged 52 and FIRE. All amounts calculated in dollars at 2 to the pound
Essentials:
property taxes: $2,400
utilities: $4,000
groceries: $4,000
insurance (cars(2), house, medical): $3,400
car fuel: $2,400
house maintenance/improvement: $4,000
car maintenance/repairs $800
So, a pretty "basic" life for $30,000.
I don't know how they do math in England, but here in the states, that adds up
to $21,000
TJ
teejayevans said:I don't know how they do math in England, but here in the states, that adds up
to $21,000
loosechickens said:well, that certainly wasn't my intent, although it may have come across that way, because I did find them really surprising.
My apologies if any felt disparaged....if it makes you feel better, you can disparage mine for being so chintzy. ;-)
LooseChickens