Vaccine Trials

[gerntz]

Are any states still holding up the Vaccine , many were wanting to review the data and have their own approvals.

"Still" could only be today since states didn't have any until today to hold up. And if any states are holding up, why would they be sent any?

 

[ransil]

"Still" could only be today since states didn't have any until today to hold up. And if any states are holding up, why would they be sent any?

googled it


California Governor Gavin Newsom said at a press conference last week, another factor will come into play: what he called the “speed of trust.” “You have to have confidence in the efficacy of the vaccine, confidence that we’re not rushing to judgment in terms of its distribution and its accessibility,” said Newsom. His comments came while announcing that his state is convening a scientific review panel to double-check the U.S. Food and Drug Administration’s data regarding any eventual coronavirus vaccine before it is available to Californians. In the following days, leaders in Washington, Oregon and Nevada announced that they were joining California’s team; New York laid out a similar plan in September.

 

[Gumby]

New York started administering the vaccine this morning. https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/1...egins-its-most-ambitious-vaccination-campaign

The vaccine shipments arrived in California late yesterday and as soon as they arrive at the hospitals, they will be dispensed. Gov. Newsom said last evening that the state review panel had done its work and the vaccine was approved for distribution. https://www.kcra.com/article/covid-...ers-everything-else-you-need-to-know/34799742

I don't know your motive, but there is no need to politicize this.

 

[JoeWras]

There were some words between politicians, but it seems to have dissipated and things are moving along with all states. Thank goodness.

 

[jollystomper]

I haven't seen an update on the Moderna vaccine approval timing. Thought it was just a week behind Pfizer. Anyone?

ON TV they said Moderna should be approved by the end of this week

The FDA has a hearing this Thursday, Dec. 17th, open to the public, to discuss the emergency use authorization of the Moderna vaccine. Details: https://www.fda.gov/advisory-commit...mmittee-december-17-2020-meeting-announcement

 

[Ronstar]

I read that the initial shipments in Illinois are going to hospitals, and they will vaccinate the health care workers first. I think it will take several shipments just to cover the health care workers. First shipment of 109,000 doses is supposed to be delivered today.

 

[gerntz]

New York started administering the vaccine this morning. https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/1...egins-its-most-ambitious-vaccination-campaign

The vaccine shipments arrived in California late yesterday and as soon as they arrive at the hospitals, they will be dispensed. Gov. Newsom said last evening that the state review panel had done its work and the vaccine was approved for distribution. https://www.kcra.com/article/covid-...ers-everything-else-you-need-to-know/34799742

I don't know your motive, but there is no need to politicize this.

Bravo.

 

[gerntz]

The FDA has a hearing this Thursday, Dec. 17th, open to the public, to discuss the emergency use authorization of the Moderna vaccine. Details: https://www.fda.gov/advisory-commit...mmittee-december-17-2020-meeting-announcement

 

[gerntz]

I read that the initial shipments in Illinois are going to hospitals, and they will vaccinate the health care workers first. I think it will take several shipments just to cover the health care workers. First shipment of 109,000 doses is supposed to be delivered today.

 

[Mark1]

I thought I would post a link to a paper on the "Safety and Efficacy of the BNT162b2 mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine". It looks like after about 12 days the first dose has started provided protection, based on the two curves diverging on the graph provided.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577

 

[MichaelB]

Here’s the FDA briefing document for the Moderna vaccine https://www.fda.gov/media/144434/download

 

[Freedom56]

This is something that really needs to be monitored. There were four cases of Bell's Palsy among those receiving the Pfizer Vaccine. Now we learn that this was also the case with the Moderna Vaccine. We aren't in a high risk group so we will have to wait before being vaccinate which is a good thing.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/15/fda...in-moderna-and-pfizer-vaccine-recipients.html

 

[aaronc879]

This is something that really needs to be monitored. There were four cases of Bell's Palsy among those receiving the Pfizer Vaccine. Now we learn that this was also the case with the Moderna Vaccine. We aren't in a high risk group so we will have to wait before being vaccinate which is a good thing.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/15/fda...in-moderna-and-pfizer-vaccine-recipients.html

8 out of 73,000 people in the trials got bells palsy. 23 out of 100,000 people in the general population get Bells Palsy. Obviously there is no reason to think the vaccine causes Bells Palsy when it occurs less often in those who got the vaccine than in those who did not.

 

[RetireBy90]

8 out of 73,000 people in the trials got bells palsy. 23 out of 100,000 people in the general population get Bells Palsy. Obviously there is no reason to think the vaccine causes Bells Palsy when it occurs less often in those who got the vaccine than in those who did not.

I agree completely, but even if there is a link it is a temporary condition

A condition that causes temporary weakness or paralysis of the muscles in the face.

Quick search at https://www.bing.com/search?form=MOZCON&pc=MOZI&q=Bells+Palsy

 

[gerntz]

8 out of 73,000 people in the trials got bells palsy. 23 out of 100,000 people in the general population get Bells Palsy. Obviously there is no reason to think the vaccine causes Bells Palsy when it occurs less often in those who got the vaccine than in those who did not.

Thank you for refuting this nonsensible issue. Way too many people immediately jump from "they did A & B happened" to concluding A caused B. It's lack of rigorous logic. But it seems to be the human condition.

 

[ivinsfan]

Thank you for refuting this nonsensible issue. Way too many people immediately jump from "they did A & B happened" to concluding A caused B. It's lack of rigorous logic. But it seems to be the human condition.

Maybe but oddly enough, french polio was a major side effect of the swine flu vaccination. Both a nerve or nervous system thing. I don't know what it means but I do know Bell's palsy is no joke..french polio can kill you.

I'm ready to get the vaccine because of my age.

 

[Freedom56]

8 out of 73,000 people in the trials got bells palsy. 23 out of 100,000 people in the general population get Bells Palsy. Obviously there is no reason to think the vaccine causes Bells Palsy when it occurs less often in those who got the vaccine than in those who did not.

Of the 73K in the trial, 50% received a placebo. The reason for the caution from the FDA is that only one person in the placebo group contracted Bell's Palsy versus seven who took vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer. They also contracted it close after the first or second injection. I'll wait to see what happens to the millions who get injected before committing. Our doctors informed us that we won't be eligible for the vaccine until late summer of 2021. There are other candidates that will be through phase three trials and EUA from the FDA. Our doctor has already informed us that the AstraZeneca vaccine will have to go through another phase 3 trial before they can seek EUA from the FDA. There is also a single shot vaccine from J&J that will be through phase 3 trials in January 2021.

 

[SecondCor521]

Thank you for refuting this nonsensible issue. Way too many people immediately jump from "they did A & B happened" to concluding A caused B. It's lack of rigorous logic. But it seems to be the human condition.

Reminded me of this scene:

 

[Chuckanut]

Thank you for refuting this nonsensible issue. Way too many people immediately jump from "they did A & B happened" to concluding A caused B. It's lack of rigorous logic. But it seems to be the human condition.

+1

Post hoc ergo propter hoc, a true logical fallacy.

 

[JoeWras]

Maybe but oddly enough, french polio was a major side effect of the swine flu vaccination. Both a nerve or nervous system thing. I don't know what it means but I do know Bell's palsy is no joke..french polio can kill you.

I'm ready to get the vaccine because of my age.

Any flu vaccine has a well known, very rare, complication of GBS ("french polio") every year. The swine flu vaccine had a higher incidence. Read the fine print when you get the vaccine, it is mentioned there. During slow news times, the news people usually dig someone out who had GBS during flu vaccine time.

As the CDC says, GBS can also result as a consequence (sequelae) of flu. I'm guessing, but GBS will likely be shown to be a sequelae of COVID disease, among many other conditions.

We'll probably see such things with these vaccines. I'm still going to get the vaccine earliest I can because COVID causes all kinds of long term issues.

Source, from the CDC:
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/guillain-barre-syndrome.html

There have been several studies of the risk of GBS after flu vaccine and CDC monitors for GBS during each flu season. The data on an association between seasonal influenza vaccine and GBS have been variable from season-to-season. When there has been an increased risk, it has consistently been in the range of 1-2 additional GBS cases per million flu vaccine doses administered.
Studies suggest that it is more likely that a person will get GBS after getting the flu than after vaccination. It is important to keep in mind that severe illness and death are associated with flu, and getting vaccinated is the best way to prevent flu infection and its complications.

 

[ivinsfan]

Any flu vaccine has a well known, very rare, complication of GBS ("french polio") every year. The swine flu vaccine had a higher incidence. Read the fine print when you get the vaccine, it is mentioned there. During slow news times, the news people usually dig someone out who had GBS during flu vaccine time.

As the CDC says, GBS can also result as a consequence (sequelae) of flu. I'm guessing, but GBS will likely be shown to be a sequelae of COVID disease, among many other conditions.

We'll probably see such things with these vaccines. I'm still going to get the vaccine earliest I can because COVID causes all kinds of long term issues.

Source, from the CDC:
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/guillain-barre-syndrome.html

Not sure what the head smack was for, a youngish lady that lived just a short ways from me ended up on a vent with French polio after the swine flu vaccine. I'm sure to her and her family it was a pretty big deal. I'll get the vaccine too but let's not act like people discussing side effects are fear mongering, they are a real thing.

 

[JoeWras]

Not sure what the head smack was for, a youngish lady that lived just a short ways from me ended up on a vent with French polio after the swine flu vaccine. I'm sure to her and her family it was a pretty big deal. I'll get the vaccine too but let's not act like people discussing side effects are fear mongering, they are a real thing.

I'm so sorry, sincerely. The head smack was for the tendency of the news to cherry pick the 1 to 3 out of a million case and feature it during vaccine season, in non-election years, when news is slow. It was a smack on the news.

It is a real thing. I think I made that clear per the CDC link, and the form we sign which outlines this. Each of us have to determine if we are OK with the possible risk. Just as we have to determine our relationship with other risks in life (cleaning gutters, driving, biking, etc.)

EDIT: OK, I put driving and biking in parenthesis. Really, those are very dangerous compared to getting a vaccine. People need to understand risk. There is risk in everything! Even when I give a blood sample at my doctor's office... there is risk of infection, which can be compared to injections.

 

[ivinsfan]

I'm so sorry, sincerely. The head smack was for the tendency of the news to cherry pick the 1 to 3 out of a million case and feature it during vaccine season, in non-election years, when news is slow. It was a smack on the news.

It is a real thing. I think I made that clear per the CDC link, and the form we sign which outlines this. Each of us have to determine if we are OK with the possible risk. Just as we have to determine our relationship with other risks in life (cleaning gutters, driving, biking, etc.)

That's OK no problem,I plead guilty to not reading the fine print on vaccines!

Those of us in the high risk group are most likely going to proceed so we can get some normal life back.

But if someone in their 20's decides they won't I can see where they are coming from.

 

[JoeWras]

That's OK no problem,I plead guilty to not reading the fine print on vaccines!

Those of us in the high risk group are most likely going to proceed so we can get some normal life back.

But if someone in their 20's decides they won't I can see where they are coming from.

No problem! I haven't had the COVID vaccine yet (obviously), so I'm just thinking about the fine print on the flu vaccine. My last one mentioned egg allergies and the risk of GBS. I have no idea what the COVID fine print will say.

I'm still getting it. If I don't because of risk, then I better stop crossing busy streets. Sounds like a joke, but it isn't. With the renewed traffic, our daily walks have become precarious with all the traffic out there!

 

[Gumby]

For a variety of reasons, people are inherently bad at evaluating relative risks. Here are a few interesting articles about those reasons.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-inertia-trap/201303/why-are-people-bad-evaluating-risks

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC385301/

https://psychcentral.com/blog/dying...were-really-bad-at-accurately-assessing-risk/