Changing "Classes"

[pb4uski]

....Have any of you had a moment when you suddenly realized that you may have changed "classes"? Are you comfortable with this change? Did it impact your motivation to work?

Interesting thread. To answer the OP's question, I don't think I have changed classes... in many ways no but in a way yes.

I grew up in an upper middle class family that lived below their means. Dad had started as a mechanic, was good at it and was promoted into sales where he flourished and made very good money but stayed true to his roots and lived below his means. I always had a sense growing up that he made more than our lifestyle suggested... sort of an upscale millionaire next door type.

So in that sense I have not changed... we live below our means in an upper middle class lifestyle. Why I say yes is that when DW and I started out were were struggling professionals... just before we were married we looked at a $40k condo and could buy it if we could come up with 5% down but we didn't have $2k to our name and didn't want to borrow from family... we wanted to make it on our own... then we worked hard, saved prodigiously, invested wisely and retired at 56. Today, if the monthly credit card bill comes in at less than $2k then I am in my happy dance.

All of that said... I differentiate between wealth and class.. having known very wealthy people who had little class and people of modest means who had lots of class. To me class is a frame of mind... how you carry yourself and the grace and civility with which you treat people... particularly those lower on the social scale.

 

[travelover]

Ah, you were a "trouble maker" eh?

I was a classless trouble maker. Once, while cleaning up after art class, I chastised one of the other kids for abusing the broom by pointing out that the teacher had to ride it home that night. Next day I was in a different art class.

 

[eytonxav]

Trouble maker, I guess I qualify. Patted the 9th grade math teacher on the back of his suit jacket with an eraser. He didn't even send my to the GC, and no detention.

 

[MRG]

What world culture was he modeling?

And did the other kids laugh?

I guess a ticked off wrestler. To this day I have no idea what I actually did, my classmates didn't either.
They were very quiet, probably afraid they were next. I was a bit afraid to walk in there the following day, the guidance counselor must have been sending him a message.

 

[Redbugdave]

When I was working, I always felt pigeon holed because of the job. People judge you by what you do. And many people look down on others by where they stand in the hierarchy of jobs and position. But my job was not my passion and now I am no longer hampered by the job. So, in terms of class I feel I am on even ground with everyone I meet whether job related or not. I don't see things in terms of who is better than who or upper or lower class.

 

[Lsbcal]

When I was working, I always felt pigeon holed because of the job. People judge you by what you do. And many people look down on others by where they stand in the hierarchy of jobs and position. But my job was not my passion and now I am no longer hampered by the job. So, in terms of class I feel I am on even ground with everyone I meet whether job related or not. I don't see things in terms of who is better than who or upper or lower class.

+1

My sentiments too.

 

[Gumby]

I've never had any class either.

 

[Redbugdave]

I've never had any class either.

Now that can be taken a couple ways...funny stuff!

 

[FIYes]

I always considered myself middle class and I guess that was true. I think in terms of outlook and values I was middle class, while in terms of income I was probably lower middle class. For a number of years our income was just my teacher's salary as DH did not work.
I was surprised recently when our niece referred to our neighborhood as working class. Then a friend who was not familiar with where I lived referred to my neighborhood as a white trash neighborhood! I live on a street that is a bit of an oasis in a declining area and see my neighborhood as middle to upper middle class, but that is probably not true...perhaps bohemian vibe would be more accurate.
Oh well, I am in the happy class and that is important to me.

 

[2017ish]

...
Oh well, I am in the happy class and that is important to me.

That is the essence.

 

[socca]

Just because we live middle class doesn't mean we are in the fuller sense of middle class concerns and pressures.

Good point. Although I may appear middle class, I have financial concerns commonly found among the upper class (e.g. how to properly manage assets). I certainly didn't have these concerns when I first entered the workforce (no assets = nothing to manage).

 

[RobbieB]

I don't think I am better than other people, never have.

But I know that I have more dough than other people and other people have more dough than me.

Dough is dough and people are people.

 

[Danmar]

I don't think I am better than other people, never have.

But I know that I have more dough than other people and other people have more dough than me.

Dough is dough and people are people.

Agree, Well put. So what does "Upper Class" mean? Just spending or wealth level? This would be my view but "class" is often described as "socio-economic". Understand the "economic" but what about the "socio"?

 

[unclemick]

Major class shift from unemployed slacker to upper crust swell-o-mundo ER about 22 years after being layed off near 50. I slowly came to realize that working was no longer required.

Thanks in great part to this forum's early days.

heh heh heh -

 

[RobbieB]

It's the "socio" that gets people into trouble with their economics.

That's the "middle class trap" and the "keeping up with the Joneses" that gets folks behind the eight ball.

 

[Major Tom]

Understand the "economic" but what about the "socio"?

Try growing up in England, and then you'll understand the "socio" part of it. We're good at that

Reginald D Hunter is a comedian who grew up in the American south. He has lived in the UK for a while now and is quite well-known over there. Much of his act revolves around comparing and contrasting the differences between the UK and the US, from the perspective of an African-American. In this clip, in which he is performing for a British audience, and also covers other subjects, he nails the business of social class, IMO, with one simple quote. The quote comes at around the 1 minute mark, but you should watch the bit before it to understand the context. (Warning, slightly NSFW language) -

 

[Danmar]

Try growing up in England, and then you'll understand the "socio" part of it. We're good at that

Reginald D Hunter is a comedian who grew up in the American south. He has lived in the UK for a while now and is quite well-known over there. Much of his act revolves around comparing and contrasting the differences between the UK and the US, from the perspective of an African-American. In this clip, in which he is performing for a British audience, and also covers other subjects, he nails the business of social class, IMO, with one simple quote. The quote comes at around the 1 minute mark, but you should watch the bit before it to understand the context. (Warning, slightly NSFW language) -

Thanks for posting but blocked for copyright reasons in Canada. UK seems to have a much "richer" history of "class" than the US. I guess it's not too hard to come up with a definition of the "socio" component of "socio-economic" class. Probably would include where you went to school, the kind of job you have, where you lived, clubs you belonged to, how you vacationed, your circle of friends, etc. This just doesn't seem very overt or important in the US, or am I being naive?

 

[Major Tom]

Probably would include where you went to school, the kind of job you have, where you lived, clubs you belonged to, how you vacationed, your circle of friends, etc. This just doesn't seem very overt or important in the US, or am I being naive?

Yes, all the usual markers of social class are there - add how you speak to the list, among many other quite subtle indicators.

It's a broad generalization, but I don't think that Americans are quite so uptight - ooops, I meant discerning about social class, but there is definitely still class distinction based upon social markers.

As a kid growing up in a middle class household in England, I received the strong unspoken message that it wasn't "nice" to talk about social class distinctions, so we didn't. Nevertheless, the attitudes were very much there. I noticed that working class folk didn't seem to mind talking about it, were quite happy to be identified as working class, and were proud of it. Likewise, the upper class were fairly noncholant about the whole thing. They knew they were "well-bred", so why be ashamed? However, it seemed to me that us middle class folk weren't overtly proud of being middle class - we just were.

My explanation for this is that if you are near the top or the bottom, they are fairly well-defined places to be. The middle, though, is rather nebulous. Added to that was the fact that most middle class folk were/are from working class families who worked their way up the ladder a bit. It could be that, historically, they received some push-back from the folk they were leaving behind, to the effect that they were "forgetting their roots". The lesson was to not flout your newly-found middle class status. In fact, my father experienced some good natured ribbing from some of my mother's relatives, for having moved our family to a decidedly middle class area. Perhaps a couple of generations ago, the "ribbing" was more pointed.

I realized that these class distinctions as I am talking about them are not merely social bands, but are also defined by income. It's all rather complicated. You Canadians are refreshingly more straightforward in this regard!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_British_Class_Survey

 

[foxfirev5]

Just an observation but I believe there a lot of people that believe they are middle class but aren't even close. Look at the current tax proposals. Just say'in.

 

[rodi]

Thank you for an interesting discussion.


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