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Re: Introverted/ Vanguard Alternatives
Old 03-31-2004, 08:08 AM   #41
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Re: Introverted/ Vanguard Alternatives

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Seriously, back a few years when I had never heard anything negative about Vanguard and they could do no wrong, I wondered even then if I should at some point consider some diversity in my trustees. Seemingly Vanguard can handle all the needs I forsaw for many years (and at least a couple of years from now), but even though my investment classes are diversified they are all held by the same company.

Now that I'm hearing troubling things about Vanguard and am about to free a sizeable flow of investment income I'm really starting to wonder about that again.

I don't recall any discussion about splitting investments between investment companies like Vanguard, Janus and the others for the sake of diversity in trustees/holding companies/banks/whatever the correct term is.
I've been a Vanguard die-hard for over 20 years, but I recently moved a significant portion of my savings over to Dimensional Fund Advisors (DFA) after reading about them in Bernstein's book. DFA won't take individuals' money directly, but if you get one of their approved fee-only advisors, you can get an incredible deal on fees: you pay what the $50million+ institutional investors pay, and can get funds like Emerging Markets Value, International Small Company, International Small Value, and US small or micro-cap value , among others, all quasi-indexed and very tax/trading-cost efficient. Also DFA can get you foreign bonds, which Vanguard doesn't have: 2 year global bonds for instance, which is a less-correlated asset class Bernstein recommends. Check them out at www.dfaus.com

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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 01:02 PM   #42
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Re: Introverted

Were these financial results or just project results and time tables? If it were the former, they're basically asking you to bear the brunt of the legal fury should the sh*t hit the fan.

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Three+ years and I still get a nightmare every once in a while. *I worked for a couple of vice presidents that urged you to give very aggressive estimates on results and timetables, then when presented with those liked to double and halve them "just to see what happens". *"Unnecessary stress and lousy results" was my usual answer, to no avail.

Of course, this was also the same company that had a standard policy of putting two people into the same job (with the intent of one staying in it and the other doing something else, either by voluntary action or if not, later by force), thinking that this created a "healthy competitive atmosphere that increases productivity".

Its a wonder I sleep at all without having to go through a "program" first *
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 01:10 PM   #43
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Re: Introverted

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Right Cut-throat. As long as he keeps his mitts off the computers and doesn't harass the fund managers with his nonsense, we should be OK. However, given enough time he could run Vanguard into the ground, so I wish some other company would copy the Vanguard model and compete with them. I wonder why someone hasn't?
Because the old model of funds contracting out to funds management companies is just too profitable. The 1.5% average fee (not including the cost of high turn over) plus unlimited fund sizes are golden gooses that the fund management industry cannot kill.
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 02:09 PM   #44
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Re: Introverted

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Were these financial results or just project results and time tables? If it were the former, they're basically asking you to bear the brunt of the legal fury should the sh*t hit the fan.

Oh, no, just projects. No money funny business that I was ever aware of, outside of padding the heck out of expenses and hacking away at forecasts such that when the execs halved or doubled them, they were still achievable by flesh and blood people.

It was amusing to hear the observation of a 22 year old guy I hired that I brought to a budgeting meeting for learning purposes.

He said "We put together cost estimates and timelines, you double them, then the other guys halve them. We could just cut all you guys out of the equation with the same net results, and the cost savings from reducing headcount would pay for the projects".

Out of the mouths of babes. Then we had a series of long talks about business politics and what to say and not to say. Particularly around the piece that involved me losing my job as a cost savings maneuver.
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 02:12 PM   #45
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Re: Introverted

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Because the old model of funds contracting out to funds management companies is just too profitable. The 1.5% average fee (not including the cost of high turn over) plus unlimited fund sizes are golden gooses that the fund management industry cannot kill.
Not to mention if the idea of low cost buy and hold index investing really takes over the market, without a preponderance of "random" buying and selling the markets wont move and we wont make any money!!!

We are frighteningly dependend on the lack of investment comprehension by the general public leading to their erroneous direct investing activities, and their passive erroneous indirect investing activities through managed funds.

God help us if everyone figures it out...all we'd make are dividends and interest.
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 02:49 PM   #46
 
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Re: Introverted

Hi TH! All I make now is "dividends and interest".

John Galt
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 03:19 PM   #47
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Re: Introverted

I knew I should have put a "winkie" on that one.

Either that or a footnote to all my posts that says "* Note: the above opinions and information are null and void within a 10 meter area of John Galt"
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 04:12 PM   #48
 
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Re: Introverted

Others opinions and observations are null and void
within a 10 meter limit of John Galt. "Abandon hope
all yee who enter here!"

John Galt
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-08-2004, 06:34 PM   #49
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Re: Introverted

Indeed.

You're a fan dancer John...
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Re: Introverted
Old 04-09-2004, 07:09 AM   #50
 
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Re: Introverted

Fan dancer? I don't know about that. I am my own biggest fan though

John Galt
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