Might be heading for divorce...

[gstillson]

Spot on! Not much has changed since the 80s btw - I can tell you that.

I'm completely against marriage now, the financial price you pay (on top of the emotional one) isn't worth it. The laws are messed up, if it was a fair system the person wanting the divorce would pay for wanting to end what's supposed to be a 'till death do us apart' contract. Not the other way around.

It makes sense financially for the somewhat rare case of a person who is otherwise ineligible for SS.

OP, I would try and get happy but realize grass is not always greener etc. I make big attempts to try suggestions from my wife for things I would not normally do and try to maintain a good attitude about it.

We passed a sign on the street for a business which said "My wife wanted a puppy and I didn't. We compromised and got a puppy."

 

[Teacher Terry]

It is healthier for both people to have some separate interests, friends, etc. It can be stifling to be together all the time. I would definitely ask her if she wants to move back to the Bay Area.

 

[pb4uski]

.... We passed a sign on the street for a business which said "My wife wanted a puppy and I didn't. We compromised and got a puppy."

Yup... that's the way works.

 

[Letj]

I must admit that I have a hard time with the "do your thing and I'll do mine". Up until now, we have been like 2 peas in a pod and have always done everything together. I feel strange about the idea of traveling solo for example. But I am heartened to see that it works for a lot of people here. I hope that we can regain our individualities without breaking the bond between us.

This I see as a big red flag. Let her do her thing with her friends even if you’re not the social type and if all you did was stay home and watch TV. I know of what I speak. If my husband insisted that I couldn’t do all the things I do alone or with friends of which he has no interest, I don’t think I could stand for that. Please, if you value your marriage and finances and want to stay together, get used to being on your own while she does her stuff. Maybe express to her that you’re willing to accept that. It might be what she wants to hear.

 

[Letj]

It is healthier for both people to have some separate interests, friends, etc. It can be stifling to be together all the time. I would definitely ask her if she wants to move back to the Bay Area.

I agree. I am always suspicious when I see couples that appear inseparable. My guess is those marriage don’t last as long as the couples who have their own interests.

 

[dvalley]

Yup... that's the way works.

Because you allow it. The media has brainwashed us. Compromises should work both ways not one.

 

[Nemo2]

Because you allow it. The media has brainwashed us. Compromises should work both ways not one.

I think it was (mainly) a joke.

 

[garyt]

The first thing you worry about is the dough?

Nice

 

[FIREd]

This I see as a big red flag. Let her do her thing with her friends even if you’re not the social type and if all you did was stay home and watch TV. I know of what I speak. If my husband insisted that I couldn’t do all the things I do alone or with friends of which he has no interest, I don’t think I could stand for that. Please, if you value your marriage and finances and want to stay together, get used to being on your own while she does her stuff. Maybe express to her that you’re willing to accept that. It might be what she wants to hear.

Who said that I insisted that she could not see her friends? She asks for more space and I am giving it to her. She goes out with her friend(s) 3-4 nights a week and she is going on vacation with them at the end of the month. She'd probably need to move out to get more space.

 

[FIREd]

Because you allow it. The media has brainwashed us. Compromises should work both ways not one.

That's my view as well. A "you do you and I do me" kind of marriage is not going to work for me (and that's not what we agreed to 17 years ago). When we got married, my FIL told me "remember: happy wife happy life". I didn't know if he was joking (and he could not apparently take his own advice because he still got divorced).

 

[FIREd]

I agree. I am always suspicious when I see couples that appear inseparable. My guess is those marriage don’t last as long as the couples who have their own interests.

I have several example of long marriages in my life (we are talking 50+ years) and in every case, the spouses are inseparable and each other's best friend. That is my frame of reference.

 

[Carpediem]

She goes out with her friend(s) 3-4 nights a week and she is going on vacation with them at the end of the month.

Whoa - that would be a red flag to me.

 

[Chuckanut]

I am so sorry you are going through this. I encourage both of you to try and work through this if at all possible. It's not only better for you but for your family if you both can be happy with each other.

However, we hope for the best, but prepare for the worst, so I have three thoughts based upon my unfortunate experience.

1.) You are correct to take the necessary steps to protect your financial health. And what's fair for you is fair for your spouse.

2.) If you feel the need, the best source of counseling that I found was Divorce Recovery groups. I found them far more effective than counselors who can cost $100 or more for a hour of their time. You meet with other people who have gone through or are going through divorce and you will find that it is survivable, and that there is life and good times on the other side of the marriage. Most are offered by churches. If you are religious great, if not, my experience was that I did not find that any of them hit you over the head with a Bible and demand some profession of faith. Cost is usually a contribution of a $5 a meeting. Worth it at 10x the price.

3.) As much as possible, keep the decisions out of the hands of the people in black robes. Try to find a lawyer who specializes in mediation and will guide you both through the legal maze and how to work out an equitable settlement. It's much less expensive than having adversarial lawyers. Both my ex-wife and I agreed at the start that giving the lawyers a big chunk of our assets was not in either's best interest.

Note: Changed arbitration to mediation in #3 above.

 

[Midpack]

Who said that I insisted that she could not see her friends? She asks for more space and I am giving it to her. She goes out with her friend(s) 3-4 nights a week and she is going on vacation with them at the end of the month. She'd probably need to move out to get more space.

Very sorry about your current situation, has to be hard for both of you. I don't have first hand experience, and it's not for everyone, but there is middle ground between divorce and wedded bliss.

I know two couples who have drifted apart, but they don't want to be married to someone else (obviously key) and they're both perfectly happy leading largely separate lives. In one case the wife (still working) is out almost every night, whether with business associates, or her children/grandchildren (another marriage) - but please don't read into it, she comes home at a reasonable hour every night. He spends every weekend Fri afternoon to Sun afternoon in summer away from her on his (large) boat. They get along fine when they are together, and they do socialize together some, but it would appear they're not in love with each other anymore. It's just convenient to have a partner, and again neither of them has a wandering eye. But they're both reasonably happy, and they have no intention of getting a divorce. I don't think finances are a factor, but they're certainly better off financially staying somewhat together. Again, both parties have to be agreeable and not specifically looking for another mate, but I do know two couples who are living separate lives together, and have for decades. Who knows, they might drift back together again.

In the other case I know well, the husband and wife lived very separate lives. They were fine together when out socially, and it worked just fine for them until she passed away (natural causes). He did remarry long after she passed away, but I doubt they ever considered divorce all the while they were both alive.

Separate lives might be worth a try if both are willing before taking the big step toward divorce. FWIW

 

[Rianne]

I have several example of long marriages in my life (we are talking 50+ years) and in every case, the spouses are inseparable and each other's best friend. That is my frame of reference.

I have to ask, do you like your wife? Sounds weird, but the more I read responses I realize my DH and me laugh at similar things, discuss stuff fairly and respectfully and roll with each others habits.

He has his own interests, loves to garden and pull weeds ( I hate it ), he's a bit OCD ( drives me crazy ), he likes to stay home ( I love to go outside and hit the trails with my dog so I go alone ). I can't stand the way he eats sometimes and the way he dresses, sometimes. He yells at the TV, I think he's a moron, sometimes. He's very smart and dumb at the same time. But I realized I like him, as a person. He has a good heart. Somewhere in there, the love got stronger.

You know if your DW still likes you. It is a bridge back to love.

 

[Breedlove]

DW and I have been married 45 years , I married he two days after she graduated HS . We went to college together , suffered the growing pains but never gave up . To say our marriage is perfect would be a lie . Our life is like a game of tennis one serves and the other volleys . But someone must serve and the other must volley . We are no means a psychologist but get involved with her find out what she wants ( serve ) if things are good she will volley . Then the ball is in your court. You go through so many chapters in a marriage.

 

[rodi]

Some thoughts based on comments from various posters to this thread (not the OP)

My sister's divorce was finalized in late December this past year (2017)

- CA divorce is community property. It does not have to be WAR. If there are no kids and both people had careers/income, the divying up should be close to 50-50 of the marital assets. My sister and ex-BIL chose (at my sister's insistence) to email back and forth division of assets negotiations - leaving the lawyers out of it. They saved a lot of billable hours by doing it this way. It came out pretty darn close to 1/2 of the net worth that was disclosed at the beginning of the process. She kept the primary home (that he'd left behind when he left her) but he kept the two rental houses... equity was similar. Bank accounts were split 50/50. She kept her teacher's pension but he had a decent IRA account of similar NPV. They saved a boatload by resolving this via emailed spreadsheets rather than having the lawyers amp things up. Divorce does not have to be WAR, if people can put aside their emotions and resolve it fairly rather than trying to inflict pain.

- It is possible to be completely blindsided.... but hindsight might show one of the spouses was disengaged from the marriage for a while before divorce is mentioned... this is the case for my sister... Looking back - he started checking out of the marriage over 8 years earlier... but at the time he left (with no warning) she was blindsided and didn't see it coming. It's taken 18 months for her to acknowledge there were signs earlier... but the signs were pretty subtle and it was easy to overlook.

- If one person has made up their mind to leave the marriage it is close to impossible to convince them to stay.

- The recommendation for arbitration should probably be a recommendation for MEDIATION. Arbitration can often be expensive and unfair and keeps people at opposition rather than focusing on dialogue to reach a fair resolution. I'm not a fan, especially if it's binding arbitration. But I usually see mediation recommended for figuring out the asset settlement...

 

[Teacher Terry]

You need to find out if she has mentally checked out of the marriage. I was long gone many years before I actually left. By the time I left I was doing the happy dance to being away from a very controlling person who I had come to hate.

 

[Chuckanut]

- The recommendation for arbitration should probably be a recommendation for MEDIATION. Arbitration can often be expensive and unfair and keeps people at opposition rather than focusing on dialogue to reach a fair resolution. I'm not a fan, especially if it's binding arbitration. But I usually see mediation recommended for figuring out the asset settlement...

+1

That is what I meant - Mediation. It's been quite a while since the divorce so I grabbed the wrong word. Can I blame it on spell check?

 

[aja8888]

Divorce does not have to be WAR, if people can put aside their emotions and resolve it fairly rather than trying to inflict pain.
.

i agree here, and it's easy to state this, but I will bet that this kind of arrangement and resolution is far from the norm. Angry spouses feed greedy lawyers and I have seen this more times than I care to believe.

My recommendation for the OP is to try to work out the differences and maintain the marriage. With time, the marriage may flourish again. I would not go back to California and attempt to end the marriage in that legal arena.

 

[braumeister]

- The recommendation for arbitration should probably be a recommendation for MEDIATION. Arbitration can often be expensive and unfair and keeps people at opposition rather than focusing on dialogue to reach a fair resolution. I'm not a fan, especially if it's binding arbitration. But I usually see mediation recommended for figuring out the asset settlement...

Absolutely.
I used to have a friend who was a mediator. His regular day job was as a rabbi, but he probably spent close to half his time mediating all kinds of disputes, but mostly divorces. His clients used to praise him to the skies, and he had far more business than he was willing to handle. A good mediator is worth his or her weight in gold.

 

[FIREd]

I have to ask, do you like your wife? Sounds weird, but the more I read responses I realize my DH and me laugh at similar things, discuss stuff fairly and respectfully and roll with each others habits.

He has his own interests, loves to garden and pull weeds ( I hate it ), he's a bit OCD ( drives me crazy ), he likes to stay home ( I love to go outside and hit the trails with my dog so I go alone ). I can't stand the way he eats sometimes and the way he dresses, sometimes. He yells at the TV, I think he's a moron, sometimes. He's very smart and dumb at the same time. But I realized I like him, as a person. He has a good heart. Somewhere in there, the love got stronger.

You know if your DW still likes you. It is a bridge back to love.

Overall I still like her as a person. I have a feeling that we would remain friends if we separated on good terms.

 

[dvalley]

Women and men are very different creatures, we think very differently - cliche' yes but there's so much truth in it yet most people don't (want to) understand it. I don't want to turn this into a debate and get this locked down but if we can discuss without attacks in another thread I'll point some out that I've found through tons of research and how they've correlated to my own experiences.

 

[FIREd]

You need to find out if she has mentally checked out of the marriage. I was long gone many years before I actually left. By the time I left I was doing the happy dance to being away from a very controlling person who I had come to hate.

The past 3 years (after she retired) were the best ones IMO. So if she checked out, it either happened very recently or she excels at hiding her feelings.

 

[haha]

The past 3 years (after she retired) were the best ones IMO. So if she checked out, it either happened very recently or she excels at hiding her feelings.

It must be asked-might she have met someone else? People don't always fall out of love because something is wrong. People sometimes just fall in love with someone else.

If this is the case and you can tolerate it, it may blow over. Plenty guys enjoy other men's wives, but they often don't want to support them or be stuck with them. It is part of our national belief system that if something is not well, it must have a cause, someone to blame, and a proper and efficacious therapy for it. Not true often enough.