Nest Thermostat

[GalaxyBoy]

Does anyone have experience with the Nest Thermostat? For those not familiar with it, this is the smart thermostat by the former Apple employee who was instrumental in the design of the iPod and the first three generations of iPhone. I'm impressed by the look and feel of the Nest, having played with the one on display at my local big-box store, and I think it will save me money.

For anyone who actually has the Nest, does it really save you money? What was (or will be) the payback period?

And finally, what's the difference between the first and second generations, besides the look of the design (2G is thinner) and the fact that the 2G is compatible with more types of HVAC systems than the first? Otherwise, it looks like the 1G has similar, if not identical, functionality and it's quite a bit cheaper. The 2G is currently going for $249 and the 1G for $179.

 

[braumeister]

I bought one about three months ago (2G) after reading a rave review of it in the WSJ, and I love it. Too soon to tell if it's actually saving me money, but my gut feeling so far is that it is.

It's just so cool to be able to control the home thermostat from anywhere using my iPhone, and its "learning mode" does seem to pretty effectively pick up your usage patterns.

Another big bonus is that it's so much simpler to set than my old "standard" thermostat, and as for setting weekly schedules on it, there's no comparison. The old one was a pain to set; the Nest is a breeze (I usually do it from my web browser).

Highly recommended!

 

[someguy]

I agree with braumeister. I have a 2G and love it more than I expected. It is incredibly easy to program. It's so nice to be able to quickly and easily adjust the thermostat -- whether it's upstairs in a hot (or cold) office, sitting on the couch, or coming home early or late. I like that you can tell it to learn how fast your house heats and cools, and then when you change the temp it can tell you how long it takes to get there. It even shows you this on the thermostat itself. Also, they just added the ability to run the fan for 15, 30 or 45 minutes per hour, instead of either auto or on.

As far as saving money, I think it does. But that's hard to quantify for sure, especially with the drop in natural gas prices. I'm too lazy to adjust our monthly electric/gas spends for heating/cooling days and for kWh and gas prices for a proper comparison.

 

[GalaxyBoy]

And finally, what's the difference between the first and second generations, besides the look of the design (2G is thinner) and the fact that the 2G is compatible with more types of HVAC systems than the first? Otherwise, it looks like the 1G has similar, if not identical, functionality and it's quite a bit cheaper. The 2G is currently going for $249 and the 1G for $179.

From the Nest.com website, I think I answered my second question:

"If your heating and cooling system was compatible with the 1st generation Nest Learning Thermostat, you won’t see a difference in terms of features or performance with the 2nd generation Nest."

 

[Midpack]

I've seen them on TV. Can't justify buying one to replace our 20 year old 'set-back' thermostat (which has saved us considerably), but our next house will have a Nest | The Learning*Thermostat | Home and a TED 5000 Series energy monitoring system - just because I'm geeky that way. The technology is cheap enough nowadays...

 

[ERD50]

I guess it depends on your conditions, but I think I save the most amount of money with the plain old, simple mechanical dial thermostat (1950's Honeywell style).

In the winter, if I am cold, I turn the heat up a bit. When I'm to the point of more than comfortable (with socks, slippers, sweater, etc), I turn it down.

When we go out, I turn it down. When we go to bed, I turn it down. I turn it up when I take a shower, as I like the warm air blast to push the humidity out of the bath, and I don't like the cold air flow when I'm showering.

With forced air heat, the house warms really fast (and you can always position yourself near a vent if you need a quicker warm up). My schedule is far too fuzzy for any device to decide these things better than I can. My shower times vary all over, and if I'm doing something active in the house, I can be fine at 63F (or less). But maybe the next day I'm sitting and reading at that time - then I'll usually need it warmer to be comfortable. Often we are fine with a low temp when cooking, plenty of heat from the oven, and we are active. How is a device going to track all that?

It becomes second nature to just adjust it throughout the day. It's no effort really, and no batteries in a thermostat to worry about (like many of the fancy ones need).

It aggravates me a bit that there are govt rebates for some of these things, but I get no credit for doing it manually, and most likely far better!

That said - I did see a remote thermostat on This Old House recently. That might work well for us. Our thermostat is on the 1st floor, and in summer, esp when it isn't super hot out, the AC will run, cool off the downstairs, that cool air sits down there, but it keeps getting warmer and warmer upstairs. I'd take the wireless unit upstairs with me at night, and keep it downstairs with me during the day. That would probably be better than leaving the blower on all night (which I've done, and does help to keep the house even).

-ERD50

 

[bltkmt]

I am so intrigued by these Nest thermostats, but we have four "zones" in our house so we would need four of these to replace our existing thermostats...too much $$ for this cheapskate. Our HVAC system is only 2 years old...will stick with the Honeywell programmables we have.

 

[Midpack]

I guess it depends on your conditions, but I think I save the most amount of money with the plain old, simple mechanical dial thermostat (1950's Honeywell style).

In the winter, if I am cold, I turn the heat up a bit. When I'm to the point of more than comfortable (with socks, slippers, sweater, etc), I turn it down.

When we go out, I turn it down. When we go to bed, I turn it down. I turn it up when I take a shower, as I like the warm air blast to push the humidity out of the bath, and I don't like the cold air flow when I'm showering.

With forced air heat, the house warms really fast (and you can always position yourself near a vent if you need a quicker warm up). My schedule is far too fuzzy for any device to decide these things better than I can. My shower times vary all over, and if I'm doing something active in the house, I can be fine at 63F (or less). But maybe the next day I'm sitting and reading at that time - then I'll usually need it warmer to be comfortable. Often we are fine with a low temp when cooking, plenty of heat from the oven, and we are active. How is a device going to track all that?

It becomes second nature to just adjust it throughout the day. It's no effort really, and no batteries in a thermostat to worry about (like many of the fancy ones need).

It aggravates me a bit that there are govt rebates for some of these things, but I get no credit for doing it manually, and most likely far better!

That said - I did see a remote thermostat on This Old House recently. That might work well for us. Our thermostat is on the 1st floor, and in summer, esp when it isn't super hot out, the AC will run, cool off the downstairs, that cool air sits down there, but it keeps getting warmer and warmer upstairs. I'd take the wireless unit upstairs with me at night, and keep it downstairs with me during the day. That would probably be better than leaving the blower on all night (which I've done, and does help to keep the house even).

-ERD50

You can buy a Honeywell 5-2 programmable for $25 Honeywell 5-2 Day Programmable Thermostat with Backlight-RTH2300B at The Home Depot, even the cheapest non-programmable thermostat isn't much less. You can always override a programmable, so there's no downside I can think of.

And the "plain old, simple mechanical [non-programmable] dial thermostat (1950's Honeywell style)" thermostats now cost $40 Honeywell Round Heat/Cool Thermostat-CT87N at The Home Depot.
​

The lithium ion batteries in a programmable last more than 10 years. A programmable never forgets, and it can change temps when you're not home/awake, extending your set-back savings periods - you can't do that manually. It's remarkable that you're able to 'do it far better [than a programmable] manually.'

 

[ShortInSeattle]

I was concerned by some of the Amazon reviews that stated that when a nest "glitches" it may set your furnace on full blast and be difficult to shut off. Very bad if you plan to take any trips.

It's pretty snazzy though.

 

[eytonxav]

Although the circular look is nice looking, and while not a biggie, if you are replacing a more conventional rectangular design thermostat (eg Honeywell), you might end up having to repaint your wall if the nest doesn't cover the old footprint, which may or may not be a big deal for some depending on your wall finish and whether the wall was painted to its current color under the old thermostat.

 

[someguy]

The nest (at least G2) includes a rectangular panel large enough to cover up the old footprint. I had to use it to cover screw holes because I didn't want to spackle. I think it's paintable although its default color isn't too far off my wall color so I haven't painted it yet.

Also, unless I'm having a brain fart, the Nest G2 runs off power from the furnace (24V, I believe), so there is no user-replaceable battery. I assume there is a small lithium or rechargable to retain power in outages.

 

[ERD50]

You can buy a Honeywell 5-2 programmable for $25 Honeywell 5-2 Day Programmable Thermostat with Backlight-RTH2300B at The Home Depot, even the cheapest non-programmable thermostat isn't much less. You can always override a programmable, so there's no downside I can think of.

And the "plain old, simple mechanical [non-programmable] dial thermostat (1950's Honeywell style)" thermostats now cost $40 Honeywell Round Heat/Cool Thermostat-CT87N at The Home Depot.
​

The lithium ion batteries in a programmable last more than 10 years.

But my current thermostat will probably outlive me, and several 10 year lithium batteries, so that is $25 plus that I don't need to spend (hey that's $1 a year I can 'blow' on fun stuff at a HSWR of 4%!!! ).

A programmable never forgets, and it can change temps when you're not home/awake, extending your set-back savings periods - you can't do that manually. It's remarkable that you're able to 'do it far better [than a programmable] manually.'

As I said, conditions may vary for others, but I don't see where any of the auto stuff would help me, I think it would hurt. As I said, the heat is turned down when I leave and before bed, and not turned up until we wake up (sometimes not even then). It's habit, I don't forget, and I have no need to adjust it when I'm away (its already turned down). I don't think it's remarkable, I think it would be remarkable for a device to follow my changing schedule better than I can. How is it going to know I want the heat on for a shower at 10AM one day, but 5PM the next, and 3PM the next? Or that we are going out to dinner today, and would like the heat up while we relax before we go out, instead of turned down while we cook dinner? Or that I'm going to bed at 11PM tonight, and 1PM tomorrow? Heck, I don't know these things until the happen - and then I adjust the thermostat!

Yes, the auto ones have manual over-ride, but in my case, manual is all I need. I think I'd spend more time over-riding one than just setting it.

-ERD50

 

[Sue J]

The Nest has been on This Old House, twice. It was installed in the Cambridge House in the Fall, 2012 season and then I saw it again on an Ask This Old House episode where they went out to a viewer's home and installed it and did a very good demo on the features.

It can be programmed manually, on the unit, or via a web page. The part I really liked was being able to see the usage, hour by hour, online.

I would love to get one of these but we have a new programmable thermostat that came with our HVAC system in 2011. If that one dies, I'd get the Nest.

 

[Katsmeow]

I like the idea of being to program it from a web page.

In our house we have 3 Honeywell programmable thermostats (they were here when we bought the house). We have on HVAC unit, but have 3 zones.

Can the Nest handle that type of setting up - multiple zones but one HVAC?

What I don't like about the Honeywell is that you have to program at the unit and it is time consuming and one of the thermostats is in an inconvenient location where there is furniture underneath it so it is hard to get to. Being about to program from a web page would be so worth it.

 

[Texas Proud]

I am so intrigued by these Nest thermostats, but we have four "zones" in our house so we would need four of these to replace our existing thermostats...too much $$ for this cheapskate. Our HVAC system is only 2 years old...will stick with the Honeywell programmables we have.

I have been interested in zoning my house.... but not with different HVAC systems.... how is yours zoned

Did you retro fit or installed during construction?

 

[dmpi]

Call me old school but I prefer the 100% mechanical ones that contain that evil substance called mercury. I've used newer ones but I have had LCD fade away after a few years of use.

 

[braumeister]

I like the idea of being to program it from a web page.

In our house we have 3 Honeywell programmable thermostats (they were here when we bought the house). We have on HVAC unit, but have 3 zones.

Can the Nest handle that type of setting up - multiple zones but one HVAC?

Sure, you can have up to ten of them, and even have them in two different houses, all controlled from the same online interface. There's a lot of information on the nest.com website.

 

[jimnjana]

I bought one for our home earlier in the year. I plan on buying them for our vacation rentals as well. I like the idea of being able to control the temp in between rentals. I was surprised how easy it was to install.

 

[pb4uski]

Call me old school ....

You old school codger.

You asked for it.

 

[Katsmeow]

Sure, you can have up to ten of them, and even have them in two different houses, all controlled from the same online interface. There's a lot of information on the nest.com website.

I went and read up on it and you can use it with a single HVAC system that is zoned.

But there is a long list of routers that aren't compatible with it and my Netgear router is on there. Maybe if the router dies at some point I'll get a router that works with it and revisit the issue then.

 

[Katsmeow]

I have been interested in zoning my house.... but not with different HVAC systems.... how is yours zoned

Did you retro fit or installed during construction?

The house we bought a year or so ago has 3 zones although it is only one HVAC system. My understanding is that dampers are used when there is a single system.

 

[Texas Proud]

The house we bought a year or so ago has 3 zones although it is only one HVAC system. My understanding is that dampers are used when there is a single system.

I have been looking in to doing this at our house....

Does it work well?

Do you have multiple return airs?

What is your smallest zone and if it is the only one running, does the air flow increase a lot?

 

[Katsmeow]

I have been looking in to doing this at our house....

Does it work well?

Do you have multiple return airs?

What is your smallest zone and if it is the only one running, does the air flow increase a lot?

It works reasonably well. The changes between zones need to be temperature changes. That is, it is fine for Zone 1 to be set on AC at 78 (my office for example) and for Zone 2 to be set at 74 (my daughter's room for example). What gets the system confused though would be for Zone 1 to be set on heat and Zone 2 to be set on AC.

The smallest zone is probably 3 rooms and I haven't noticed the air flow increasing a lot if it is the only one running.

When we bought this house, my son's room at one end of the house was on the same zone as my office (other end of the house). Because of the length involved his room was always hot. So the AC guy went in and changed the zoning so that my son's room was on the same zone as the kitchen and breakfast room which were next to his room. It works better for zones to be reasonably together. However, DH and my daughter both like it cold and I like it warmer. So his study and her room are on a zone together even though my study is closer to her room. My study is zoned with rooms that usually people aren't in all that often since I like it warmer.

 

[Malcolm2]

We did a recent house renovation and while upgraging the technology portion considered a Nest. Instead went with a Ecobee for a variety of reasons. One reason is the learning feature of the Nest seemed annoying and the footprint was a little too retro to fit in with the sleeker look we needed. Have been very happy with the Ecobee- wifi with free web interface, simple but elegant. We are away frequently and like the easy way to schedule vacations and check in on the status from afar.

 

[calmloki]

A guest was very jazzed about his Nest - he and his wife have a getaway home and they enjoy being able to decide to go to that home, call and tell the Nest to start cooling or warming the house at an appropriate time so that it is perfect when they walk in the door. We do just fine with a stat that I set for a chosen temp and then turn on or off at will.