Oil Spill

[DallasGuy]

I don't think anyone thinks they shouldn't be held accountable. The issue seems to be whether punishment should be meted out before or after a fair and impartial trial...



Statements like this are why we have laws against vigilante justice.

To those that think this is vigilante justice, remember that BP actually agreed to the $20 billion escrow account to pay for the damages. They could have fought that in the courts for sure....just like Exxon has done for years. Sure, pressure was put on them, but they were in no way forced to do it. Perhaps you'd like to characterize it as a "shakedown" as Joe Barton did yesterday...something even most of the people in in own party has condemned.

 

[jimnjana]

Oil spill,

Don't know if this has already been discussed, but has anyone heard or read a discussion of why the crude coming out of the well head is brown, not black? I ask this because a retired oil guru was being grilled on one of the am shows (Al Roker I belive) a few weeks ago. He couldn't make his point fast enough before commercial break, and I believe he was saying that the flow was not 100% crude, but included alot of mud etc. He was trying to give an explanation when he was cut off. Not trying to downplay impact of the spill, just trying to understand it.

 

[frayne]

The media doesn't want to hear anything that might just be reasonable about the event, it just doesn't sell advertisement.

 

[Rustic23]

a long time ago, I got water in the oil of a car. It looked a lot like the stuff in the gulf. I just assumed the color was because it was emulsified.

 

[Emeritus]

The media doesn't want to hear anything that might just be reasonable about the event, it just doesn't sell advertisement.

They especially like ads from BP and other oil companies.

 

[Westernskies]

They especially like ads from BP and other oil companies.

Like the yellow pages like lawyers ...

 

[Brat]

ARCO had a program where they taught managers & executives 'crisis management'. The focus was on leadership. When I reviewed the program materials I thought it excellent.

Frankly Hayword looked a little glassy-eyed during the hearing, almost as if he were on medication.

The 'crisis management' program above emphasises the importance of adequate rest as the exhausted and sleep deprived do not make good decisions. Hayword should be relieved from duty until he is able to execute his responsibilities at the level this circumstance requires. At a minimum he needs more sleep.

Obviously BP wants to control information about the circumstances that led up to the spill because there will be litigation between the parties and the Feds about who pays how much and possible criminal charges. A Congressional hearing is no place to conduct fact finding.. Kabuki theater. I don't object to the dodge and weave during the hearing.

 

[lets-retire]

Hayword should be relieved from duty until he is able to execute his responsibilities at the level this circumstance requires. At a minimum he needs more sleep.

This was done before the weekend. Hayword is now only in charge of the clean up instead of all operations in the US.

 

[Emeritus]

Obviously BP wants to control information about the circumstances that led up to the spill because there will be litigation between the parties and the Feds about who pays how much and possible criminal charges. A Congressional hearing is no place to conduct fact finding.. Kabuki theater. I don't object to the dodge and weave during the hearing.

Since the time of the Titanic Congressional hearings have been used to drag information out of recalcitrant wrongdoers. Its the only way to nail down the facts before the purjurors get together to coordinate the lies.

 

[ziggy29]

Its the only way to nail down the facts before the purjurors get together to coordinate the lies.

Sounds rather accusatory to me without proof, bordering on libelous even....

 

[Emeritus]

Sounds rather accusatory to me without proof, bordering on libelous even....

Spend some time on the ford explorer firestone tire problem and you will get a clear idea. Every police officer in the world knows that you always get the suspects in and question them before they have a chance to coordinate their stories.

 

[Leonidas]

Spend some time on the ford explorer firestone tire problem and you will get a clear idea. Every police officer in the world knows that you always get the suspects in and question them before they have a chance to coordinate their stories.

Yeah, but the objective in a real interrogation is to get the truth. Congress seems more concerned about creating sound bites to woo the ill-informed electorate.

 

[Westernskies]

Yeah, but the objective in a real interrogation is to get the truth. Congress seems more concerned about creating sound bites to woo the ill-informed electorate.

Why wait for the truth? In his world, the verdict is already in.

 

[Milton]

I'm amazed that many people think that BP should not be severly punished for this. I couldn't care less if the US uses them to fund a stimulus package...BP deserves everything they get! It's about time that the punishment meets and even exceeds the crime!

Fixed for you.

BTW: to the best of my knowledge, no criminal charges have been brought, let alone proven.

 

[Emeritus]

Yeah, but the objective in a real interrogation is to get the truth. Congress seems more concerned about creating sound bites to woo the ill-informed electorate.

the witnesses control the sound bites

 

[Westernskies]

the witnesses control the sound bites

In your dreams, counselor. Do you think anyone DC is going to miss a chance to make the poor bastards they summoned to the hill look bad, and vindicate themselves in the process?

Question= "We have convened this Congressional [-]sideshow [/-]inquiry to discuss your propensity for wife-beating. Do you still beat your wife?" "Answer the question yes or no!"
Answer= sound bite.

 

[Gumby]

Actually, Emeritus has a point. A well-prepared witness will never fall for the "yes or no" trick. Rather, he or she will have pre-filed testimony, written by a team of the company's lawyers, consultants and business strategists. The witness also will be equipped with a set of prepared talking points -- mini speeches on various topics that have been polished and vetted by the testimony team. If the question is anywhere in the vicinity of one of the canned talking points, the witness will launch into his or her speech. Demands to answer yes or no will be politely ignored -- "I can't answer that Senator" is always a good one.

In a sense, the witnesses will be like a political candidate at a debate -- they don't answer the questions, they give speeches. Similarly, the senators are not asking questions for the sake of learning the answers. It's all about the speech they give before they get to the question. Anyone who doesn't see that it is all kabuki theatre -- on both sides of the table -- has not been paying attention.

 

[Westernskies]

Actually, Emeritus has a point. A well-prepared witness will never fall for the "yes or no" trick. Rather, he or she will have pre-filed testimony, written by a team of the company's lawyers, consultants and business strategists. The witness also will be equipped with a set of prepared talking points -- mini speeches on various topics that have been polished and vetted by the testimony team. If the question is anywhere in the vicinity of one of the canned talking points, the witness will launch into his or her speech. Demands to answer yes or no will be politely ignored -- "I can't answer that Senator" is always a good one.

In a sense, the witnesses will be like a political candidate at a debate -- they don't answer the questions, they give speeches. Similarly, the senators are not asking questions for the sake of learning the answers. It's all about the speech they give before they get to the question. Anyone who doesn't see that it is all kabuki theatre -- on both sides of the table -- has not been paying attention.

So, everyone knew about Joe Barton's apology to BP in advance?

 

[Gumby]

Regardless of how you feel about its contents, Joe made his speech just like the rest of them. I'm certain his comment/apology was not extemporaneous. He just underestimated the blowback he would get.

And I'm sure some people knew what was coming. It is a meme that had been percolating in certain corners of the political world.

 

[Emeritus]

In your dreams, counselor. Do you think anyone DC is going to miss a chance to make the poor bastards they summoned to the hill look bad, and vindicate themselves in the process?

Question= "We have convened this Congressional [-]sideshow [/-]inquiry to discuss your propensity for wife-beating. Do you still beat your wife?" "Answer the question yes or no!"
Answer= sound bite.

I've been a witness in congressional hearings. That Doesn't happen.
Its more of
"your company is directly responsible for the deaths of 11 people Is that correct?
Every witness gets to make statement.
The sound bites are generally refusals to answer.

 

[Bestwifeever]

And how often do we never hear an actual answer to a question asked in any public arena--no matter what the question is, the "best" (best for them, not for us maybe) prepared people segue right into a statement that typically has nothing to do with the question but is the information they want to get across. No sound bites that make them seem suspicious in those cases.

 

[Texas Proud]

Actually, Emeritus has a point. A well-prepared witness will never fall for the "yes or no" trick. Rather, he or she will have pre-filed testimony, written by a team of the company's lawyers, consultants and business strategists. The witness also will be equipped with a set of prepared talking points -- mini speeches on various topics that have been polished and vetted by the testimony team. If the question is anywhere in the vicinity of one of the canned talking points, the witness will launch into his or her speech. Demands to answer yes or no will be politely ignored -- "I can't answer that Senator" is always a good one.

In a sense, the witnesses will be like a political candidate at a debate -- they don't answer the questions, they give speeches. Similarly, the senators are not asking questions for the sake of learning the answers. It's all about the speech they give before they get to the question. Anyone who doesn't see that it is all kabuki theatre -- on both sides of the table -- has not been paying attention.

Did you watch the news? Most of what I saw was a Senator saying 'All I want is a yes or no' or 'Can you not answer with a yes or no'... and then a shot of Hayward NOT answering with a yes or no (only a few seconds) ... and then onto another of the same... the news never really showed anything except him looking tired and at his watch once...

 

[Rustic23]

Off and on I watched a couple of hours, maybe more. I was not impressed by any of the congressmen questioning Hayward. They were grandstanding for the cameras. Dingle in particular was pitiful! He would ask questions that Hayward would not have know the answer to, and then mumble in the microphone.

While I have my doubts if BP is the cleanest company in the stack, to ask him questions and demand answers as if he were on the well appears stupid. And he would have been crazy to answer them any other way than what he did. Like several on this board, they considered him guilty from the time he sat down.

I also found it amazing that a congressman would expect him to know the day to day operations on every rig BP is drilling. It is as dumb as holding President Obama responsible for the actions of some Second Lt. in Iraq.

 

[Gumby]

Did you watch the news? Most of what I saw was a Senator saying 'All I want is a yes or no' or 'Can you not answer with a yes or no'... and then a shot of Hayward NOT answering with a yes or no (only a few seconds) ... and then onto another of the same... the news never really showed anything except him looking tired and at his watch once...

I did not watch these hearings. While I have not testified like Emeritus, I have prepared witnesses (and their testimony) for Congressional hearings, and I have watched a number of them. As a general rule, nobody ever answers yes or no. And the senators don't really care; they just want to make the witness look bad for not answering. You would have better luck locating the Loch Ness monster than learning the truth about anything as a consequence of Congressional hearings.

 

[kumquat]

Since the time of the Titanic Congressional hearings have been used to drag information out of recalcitrant wrongdoers. Its the only way to nail down the facts before the purjurors get together to coordinate the lies.

What happened to "due process", "innocent until proven guilty" etc. Isn't any of that part of an "ethics" class?