Oil Spill

[Dawg52]

Look at this crap..............

Oil hitting beaches by the ton - Featured Story - SunHerald.com

It's really hitting home now. Not only is tourism tanking all on the coast, wildlife may be gone for years! And just think, even if this thing is plugged in early August as planned.......we have another full month of this crap flowing into the gulf!

 

[harley]

Avertible catastrophe

Another example how not serious we are about solving this problem.

 

[ERD50]

Avertible catastrophe

Another example how not serious we are about solving this problem.

That article has me seeing red....

Three days after the BP oil spill ..., the Netherlands offered the U.S. government ships equipped to handle a major spill, ... each Dutch ship more cleanup capacity than all the ships that the U.S. was then employing in the Gulf to combat the spill.

... witness the American reaction to the Dutch offer of help. The U.S. government responded with "Thanks but no thanks," --the Dutch government offered the use of its equipment at no charge. Even after the U.S. refused, the Dutch kept their vessels on standby, hoping the Americans would come round. By May 5, the U.S. had not come round. To the contrary, the U.S. had also turned down offers of help from 12 other governments, most of them with superior expertise and equipment --

And why don't we use this superior technology and capacity? Get this...

The voracious Dutch vessels, for example, continuously suck up vast quantities of oily water, extract most of the oil and then spit overboard vast quantities of nearly oil-free water. Nearly oil-free isn't good enough for the U.S. regulators, who have a standard of 15 parts per million -- if water isn't at least 99.9985% pure, it may not be returned to the Gulf of Mexico.

So clean up isn't any good at all, unless it is 99.9985% effective?

Now earlier, we were lectured on this forum that while the regulators may have faults, that is really the fault of the taxpayers who underfunded them. From what I take away from the above, we shouldn't spend one penny on these regulators if they aren't going to use a lick of common sense. It doesn't sound like funding is the problem to me, and it doesn't sound like money is going to fix it.

I'll agree with a comment I read that was posted to that article - BP ought to be making a STINK about this. I'm guessing they are afraid to, for fear of retaliation, but this needs to get out there.

BTW, I blame BP too - they should have had the needed clean-up equipment whether required by regs or not. But that does not let the regulators off the hook for failing their task. And I sure would like to see some real action from those in charge.

-ERD50

 

[Ronstar]

Avertible catastrophe

Another example how not serious we are about solving this problem.

At some point in time, the focus has to change from how to capture the oil to just stopping the leak.

 

[ERD50]

At some point in time, the focus has to change from how to capture the oil to just stopping the leak.

Why can't they keep teams focused on both tasks in parallel?

-ERD50

 

[Westernskies]

The cleanup response is a classic example of what happens when vacuous campaign rhetoric meets a real-world crisis.

 

[travelover]

The cleanup response is a classic example of what happens when vacuous campaign rhetoric meets a real-world crisis.

I agree. I thought the whole drill, baby, drill thing was a little vacuous.

 

[kcowan]

And the reason the Holland has that equipment on standby? Because they want to avert a north sea tragedy like the GOM. Nice to see governments that have foresight!

Good at healthcare too.

 

[ERD50]

And the reason the Holland has that equipment on standby? Because they want to avert a north sea tragedy like the GOM. Nice to see governments that have foresight!

Agreed. And I bet they do it with less funding than our MMS too!

-ERD50

 

[harley]

Agreed. And I bet they do it with less funding than our MMS too!

-ERD50

I've always used De Nederlands as the best example I know of a benevolent dictatorship. Actually they're a constitutional monarchy, but it makes my point so well. All Hail Queen Beatrix!

 

[Westernskies]

I agree. I thought the whole drill, baby, drill thing was a little vacuous.

You're confusing a precursor with a response.

 

[Ronstar]

Why can't they keep teams focused on both tasks in parallel?

-ERD50

You would think after 70 days they would have found a way to do both tasks at the same time. But they have not. What they are doing doesn't seem to be working.

 

[Westernskies]

You would think after 70 days they would have found a way to do both tasks at the same time. But they have not. What they are doing doesn't seem to be working.

Maybe someone with some DC insight could summarize just exactly what the federal response has been, aside from flying in once in a while and making inflammatory speeches?

We know BP is feverishly trying to plug the leak and writing a lot of checks, and the Gulf States are doing whatever they can with what they have to work with, but I'm still a little unsure about what the feds are actually doing to address the clean-up. Whatever it is, the media isn't reporting much about it.

 

[ERD50]

You would think after 70 days they would have found a way to do both tasks at the same time. But they have not. What they are doing doesn't seem to be working.

Based on the article that harley posted, it seems that it is gov't burocracy, possibly protectionism, and rigid nonsensical regulations that are not being modified to the situation at hand that are dramatically slowing down clean up efforts.

If we let the govt apply their same regulations to the leak as they are the clean-up, we'd be in even worse shape. According to their 'logic', a cap that collects 99% of the oil could not be put in place, as it would release more than 15ppm of oil.

-ERD50

 

[ERD50]

Maybe someone with some DC insight could summarize just exactly what the federal response has been, aside from flying in once in a while and making inflammatory speeches?

... but I'm still a little unsure about what the feds are actually doing to address the clean-up. Whatever it is, the media isn't reporting much about it.

I have no DC insight, but I'd say the State Dept does:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...8sy7Aw&usg=AFQjCNELAsrlxEjz293UKqtCdoUCrO-TWg

U.S. Department of State Chart on Deepwater Horizon Oil Spill Response:
International Offers of Assistance from Governments and International Bodies
June 29, 2010 4:12 PM


It's a 4 page pdf, with offers from Countries from Belgium to Vietnam - the offers are mostly from May or earlier, and almost every one is "Under Consideration", even the ones from April 30th.

Reminds me of the line from "Raiders of the Lost Ark" - 'we have people working on it, top people...'

-ERD50

 

[HFWR]

Though I'd never engage in armchair quarterbacking - - I wonder just what the hell the feds are doing...

Sign an executive order, suspend the stupid rules, and get some freakin' clean-up vessels in the GOM, pronto! Sheesh...

 

[easysurfer]

Bugs and Oil?

Bugs could help clean up oil?

CNN.com - Breaking News, U.S., World, Weather, Entertainment & Video News

 

[ls99]

The federal cleanup response is akin to a flock of seagulls. They fly in, crap all over everything, make a lot of noise, then fly away.

 

[travelover]

You're confusing a precursor with a response.

No, I think I have it right. Implicit in the drill, baby, drill argument was that the government should get the heck out the the way because MegaOil knew what they were doing and had any contingencies covered.

 

[harley]

The federal cleanup response is akin to a flock of seagulls. They fly in, crap all over everything, make a lot of noise, then fly away.

Friday Funnies - Reason Magazine

 

[Emeritus]

The federal cleanup response is akin to a flock of seagulls. They fly in, crap all over everything, make a lot of noise, then fly away.

Right EXACTLY who supports the taxes required to maintain a federal cleanup capability

Say it loud and proud
I WANT TO PAY LOTS OF TAXES TO KEEP STUFF AROUND TO CLEAN UP AFTER THE OIL INDUSTRY SCREWS UP

Unless you pay the taxes, there is no federal response

 

[Rustic23]

He's Back! I guess in his efforts to start another troll thread, he conveniently forgot that BP is footing the bill. Well at least $20,000,000,000.00, so far!

Bad! Bad! best way to get rid of a troll is to stop responding!

 

[Emeritus]

He's Back! I guess in his efforts to start another troll thread, he conveniently forgot that BP is footing the bill. Well at least $20,000,000,000.00, so far!

Bad! Bad! best way to get rid of a troll is to stop responding!

Do I need to explain the difference between a "cleanup effort and PAYING for the cleanup effort?

Payments which the president had to squeeze out of them.

BP did not "foot the bill" to provide adequate resources in place, which is why the cleanup is so badly botched.

But they can rely on legions of folks to cover their failures with anti government diatribes

Yes the MMS can be faulted for trusting the liars, cheats and incompetents at BP.

But otherwise all the screw-ups Before, during and after are entirely the responsibility of BP

 

[ls99]

Right EXACTLY who supports the taxes required to maintain a federal cleanup capability

Say it loud and proud
I WANT TO PAY LOTS OF TAXES TO KEEP STUFF AROUND TO CLEAN UP AFTER THE OIL INDUSTRY SCREWS UP

Unless you pay the taxes, there is no federal response

IMHO a couple of red herrings posited here.

The feds just needed to allow all the help offered to come in from the Dutch for example. And waive the exclusionary rules that prevented such help from doing cleanup.

We are already paying a fortune for bureaucrats to shovel paper by the the ton. That is the federal version of disaster mitigation.

Perhaps if all the written drivel that the feds have produced would be dumped into the GOM, they would soak up the spilled oil, then push the stuff in in a pile then light it off. Certainly would reduce amount of oil and a bunch of useless written drivel kept out of the landfill.

To have the feds stand on ceremony of 99.XX clean water to be dumped back into the GOM, after skimming, when a probable realistic amount is maybe 75 to 80. It is still removing vast quantities of floating crud.

Heck it's only been 70 plus days since the BP disaster. Seems any and all means would be undertaken ASAP to work on cleanup.

Here is a novel idea. Stop all foreign aid to everywhere and redirect the funds to cleanup.

Maybe even cut out the president's joyriding on AF1 to golf outings, that in itself could fund a lot of cleanup.

 

[travelover]

He's Back! I guess in his efforts to start another troll thread, he conveniently forgot that BP is footing the bill. Well at least $20,000,000,000.00, so far!

Bad! Bad! best way to get rid of a troll is to stop responding!

I think it is unfair to characterize Emeritus as a troll, in fact, I think it falls in to the category of name calling. He has been consistent in his views and has gone to length to defend his positions, regardless of what you might think of them.

That said, if I had to deal with him in person, every day, one of us would be dead.