TromboneAl asked a question in the gift thread (http://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f27/less-stuff-more-happiness-58909.html#post1134993 ) about giving our daughter holiday gifts. We covered that subject (and a whole lot more) with her in the following e-mail that we sent for her 18th birthday. At the time she was in her first college semester and struggling with classes, NROTC workouts, and her personal spending habits. Now she's finishing fall semester of her sophomore year and things are going a lot better.
Ever since small-kid time she's been encouraged to only give us gift cards or hand-made presents. As she got older that expanded to home-cooked meals and car washes. When she left for college we said that she only needed to send us greetings & love for the holidays.
However my spouse and I spent our college years stumbling through the minefields of our own parents' expectations. That continued well beyond college to a number of other awkward family moments, so this time we decided to seize the initiative and set out the ground rules. Not that we're control freaks or anything-- we're just trying to do for the next generation what we wish had been done for us.
Noble parenting goals notwithstanding, I should point out that it's still a work in progress. So far so good. Zero drama or angst.
We don't exchange holiday gifts but I dump several books on her reading pile every year. (Now that I'm a hotshot blogger, I get review copies of new financial books and I hand them right on down the line.) We pass along freebies that come our way, like a Hawaiiana wall calendar that will make her roommates drool with envy. We send regular reloads of li hing mui mango and Kona coffee and other local cuisine not found in Houston stores.
Some things we do [-]because we worry[/-] for safety. This year when our daughter wanted to visit her grandparents over fall break, she had a choice of a thousand-mile hypercaffeinated Cannonball-Run road trip in a car full of classmates, or of a round-trip plane ticket from Mom & Dad. I still have scars from the former so we were happy to contribute to the latter-- especially because we would've heard about it from her grandparents. When she comes home from college, the Hawaii flight boards at such an early hour that she'd be leaving the college campus at 4 AM. Instead of depending on the kindness of roommates or airport shuttles, we put her up in an airport hotel the night before.
Of course if she chooses to spend spring break wallowing drunkedly among the fleshpots of Padre Island, then she's on her own.
She's living in the middle of America's fourth-largest city, so she knows she doesn't need a car. She "makes do" with ZipCars and friends, and after a rocky start she's finally gotten that under control. When she was eight years old we put together David Owen's "Kid 401(k)" plan to have $5000 in her "My First Car" account when she turned 16 years old. Somewhat to my surprise (I know what I would have done with it at that age) she still has that $5000 laddered in PenFed CDs.
I've heard rumors that Grandma & Grandpa still drop checks on her for birthdays and Hanukkah. Her uncle & aunt may do something similar. She'll have to navigate those minefields on her own-- we still haven't figured them out.
I mentioned a "college profit-sharing plan". The deal is that she put her skin in the game for the NROTC scholarship (and the Navy service obligation) so after graduation we'll gift her some of the money that we otherwise would have had to spend on her tuition. Her side of the deal is that she has to use the windfall to max out her Thrift Savings Plan and her Roth IRA. Hopefully she'll appreciate the deferred gratification of a maxed TSP & Roth IRA contribution at age 22. I doubt I would have.
An unexpected bonus is that her NROTC unit requires her to apply for additional scholarships, and she's already won a couple. $250 here & there is a great self-motivational morale booster. She's also been leading $12/hour campus tours for the Admissions Office. (She's even "on call" for the Hawaii visitors.) What Admissions doesn't realize is that she'd pay them $12/hour for the privilege of bragging on her college to a bunch of high-school kids.
When she graduates, my spouse and I are keenly aware of what the military movers do to household goods. Our daughter's invited to pack anything she wants out of our house to her first ensign's apartment. Of course she's going to take all her bedroom furniture and she's welcome to take any of our other furniture. (If you saw our furniture, you'd understand why we're happy to give it away...) This promise has been a tremendous relief to her as she's watched graduating classmates struggle to furnish their first places. She thinks we're being extraordinarily generous but she hasn't yet realized that (1) there's a weight limit on military moves and (2) if she's going overseas then she'll barely have 400 sq ft to call her own.
Like I said, "work in progress". So far so good. What's worked for you with your young adults?
Ever since small-kid time she's been encouraged to only give us gift cards or hand-made presents. As she got older that expanded to home-cooked meals and car washes. When she left for college we said that she only needed to send us greetings & love for the holidays.
However my spouse and I spent our college years stumbling through the minefields of our own parents' expectations. That continued well beyond college to a number of other awkward family moments, so this time we decided to seize the initiative and set out the ground rules. Not that we're control freaks or anything-- we're just trying to do for the next generation what we wish had been done for us.
Happy birthday!
Your 18th birthday also marks your independence from the family payroll and the end of our $$ gifts at birthdays & holidays. You'll continue to get the monthly iPhone funds from the college budget (on the first of the month) and reimbursement for college expenses (like textbooks that NROTC doesn't pay for) but both of those subsidies will expire when you get your diploma/commission.
The last transfer for your clothing/toiletries budget will happen next month. After that... well... you're a college engineering student now, so nobody will be surprised if you're ragged & stinky. You could always tell them that you're considering joining the submarine force. Or channeling Keith Richards (if you don't recognize that name then look him up!).
Your mother and I aren't sending a very consistent message yet, but you should attempt to live your life as if we're not giving you any more money ever. As you build up your personal property (like your collection of Navy uniforms) then you should consider insuring it with Armed Forces Insurance so that you won't have to call Mommy&Daddy to subsidize a recovery from fire/theft/natural disasters. You already know we're not planning to contribute to your first home, either, because you'll be saving for a down payment or using the special "first home purchase" feature of your Roth IRA. But someday when your kids are teenagers then we're willing to discuss using this home to send them to your ol' high school. Assuming you want your kids to have to deal with your old principal... or that the teachers want to have to deal with your kids.
Of course we'll buy you the plane tickets to visit here anytime. When we get together we'll still take you out for meals and we'll pick up the check, but there's a very good chance that in 50 or 60 years you'll be reciprocating this generosity by helping feed me MY food. As the parents of the bride I think we're paying a chunk of your wedding expenses, a subject to be discussed way later. We'll also spoil your kids with a trip to a Disney theme park once or twice a year, and we'll take them off your hands for an occasional sleepover or grandparents weekend... but we don't want to provide childcare so that you can go to work or stand weekend duty. We want to be "Navy Reserve Grandparents": one weekend a month and two weeks a year. We'd rather not care for the grandkids while you're on deployment, either, but we understand if that becomes necessary.
During this Christmas break (assuming you still want to come home!) we'll spend 20 minutes a day on the following independence tasks:
- transferring your funds over to Fidelity,
- setting up your NFCU CDs,
- splitting out your NFCU account from Dad's account,
- figuring out how to start your own credit history on your own credit card,
- getting an insurance quote from AFI and doing the paperwork,
- going over the college profit-sharing plan after you graduate, and
- your tax returns.
I have a separate lifetime offer for you, not as "Dad" but as "Coach". I've learned a lot of financial management skills over the years (many of them the hard way) and I can share the pros & cons of nearly every major financial decision (including marriage & kids). Your mother and I are more informed than most other adults of our age (with the possible exception of your uncle the CPA) and we're far ahead of anyone in the military. Please feel free to make your own independent decisions without consulting us. But before you sign any paperwork, please also feel free to tell whoever's offering you a good deal that you need to discuss it with your financial adviser-- and then give me a call. I'll show you where to educate yourself, what issues to consider, and what options you might want to choose. I promise not to criticize your lifestyle or your standards, although I may tease you a little.
We're glad the bike tools are helping! Some of my (old-school) ER friends suggested that if your bike needs work then you should just bat your eyelashes at a boy or two and see if they'd do it for you. I suggested that your new tools mean you can charge them $25/hour to show THEM how to keep THEIR bikes clean & maintained. When you come home for Christmas we should also cherry-pick a small starter-tool "home improvement" set. You don't need a packaged tool set-- you could buy a few select tools to someday mail ahead to your first ensign's apartment.
By the way, we don't intend to hurt your feelings or make you go "Aw, man!" with any of the preceding paragraphs. If we evoked those reactions then call us and we'll talk about it.
I've been wondering... do the other midshipmen call you "Nords" yet?
Noble parenting goals notwithstanding, I should point out that it's still a work in progress. So far so good. Zero drama or angst.
We don't exchange holiday gifts but I dump several books on her reading pile every year. (Now that I'm a hotshot blogger, I get review copies of new financial books and I hand them right on down the line.) We pass along freebies that come our way, like a Hawaiiana wall calendar that will make her roommates drool with envy. We send regular reloads of li hing mui mango and Kona coffee and other local cuisine not found in Houston stores.
Some things we do [-]because we worry[/-] for safety. This year when our daughter wanted to visit her grandparents over fall break, she had a choice of a thousand-mile hypercaffeinated Cannonball-Run road trip in a car full of classmates, or of a round-trip plane ticket from Mom & Dad. I still have scars from the former so we were happy to contribute to the latter-- especially because we would've heard about it from her grandparents. When she comes home from college, the Hawaii flight boards at such an early hour that she'd be leaving the college campus at 4 AM. Instead of depending on the kindness of roommates or airport shuttles, we put her up in an airport hotel the night before.
Of course if she chooses to spend spring break wallowing drunkedly among the fleshpots of Padre Island, then she's on her own.
She's living in the middle of America's fourth-largest city, so she knows she doesn't need a car. She "makes do" with ZipCars and friends, and after a rocky start she's finally gotten that under control. When she was eight years old we put together David Owen's "Kid 401(k)" plan to have $5000 in her "My First Car" account when she turned 16 years old. Somewhat to my surprise (I know what I would have done with it at that age) she still has that $5000 laddered in PenFed CDs.
I've heard rumors that Grandma & Grandpa still drop checks on her for birthdays and Hanukkah. Her uncle & aunt may do something similar. She'll have to navigate those minefields on her own-- we still haven't figured them out.
I mentioned a "college profit-sharing plan". The deal is that she put her skin in the game for the NROTC scholarship (and the Navy service obligation) so after graduation we'll gift her some of the money that we otherwise would have had to spend on her tuition. Her side of the deal is that she has to use the windfall to max out her Thrift Savings Plan and her Roth IRA. Hopefully she'll appreciate the deferred gratification of a maxed TSP & Roth IRA contribution at age 22. I doubt I would have.
An unexpected bonus is that her NROTC unit requires her to apply for additional scholarships, and she's already won a couple. $250 here & there is a great self-motivational morale booster. She's also been leading $12/hour campus tours for the Admissions Office. (She's even "on call" for the Hawaii visitors.) What Admissions doesn't realize is that she'd pay them $12/hour for the privilege of bragging on her college to a bunch of high-school kids.
When she graduates, my spouse and I are keenly aware of what the military movers do to household goods. Our daughter's invited to pack anything she wants out of our house to her first ensign's apartment. Of course she's going to take all her bedroom furniture and she's welcome to take any of our other furniture. (If you saw our furniture, you'd understand why we're happy to give it away...) This promise has been a tremendous relief to her as she's watched graduating classmates struggle to furnish their first places. She thinks we're being extraordinarily generous but she hasn't yet realized that (1) there's a weight limit on military moves and (2) if she's going overseas then she'll barely have 400 sq ft to call her own.
Like I said, "work in progress". So far so good. What's worked for you with your young adults?