Welfare cheaters

[justin]

Yep, you cant live on $8 an hour. But two people making $8-10 each can get by. I'd think it'd beat sitting home in a lawn chair drinking bud at 10 in the morning. But I guess its easier to try and "work" the system or look for an "angle". *shrug*

This from an ER? Say it ain't so. I'd rather be sitting at home in my lawn chair drinking bud right now than sitting in my office. It is 11 in the morning here though.

 

[Andre1969]

I'll second that. Wish I was home right now, cracking open a Yuengling or something. Plus, I hear it's really nice outside. Not that I know that...we have no windows in our cube farm.

 

[Texas Proud]

Bet she was "living large" on that 20K with a family of 6.....

Not my point... and that was OVER $20 and that was 20 years ago....

The point is that WE were paying for HER having all these kids... WHY?

 

[Texas Proud]

Texas Proud, I've also known women who have had each child by a different man, but this particular one had FOUR by the same guy!  In her defense though, she and her boyfriend did finally straighten themselves out, and they're both working now.

I am glad to hear they did get straight, but the 'system' encourages that you do not have a real family... If there is a man in the house, you can be cut off the dole...

Again, from a long time ago... my sister used to go audit some of the people on welfare in California... she would tell me about how children would be shipped from house to house to keep the kid count up... how she would see 3 or more oil slicks on the drive, showing they had more than the one allowed.. of course, they were moved prior to her coming... and like someone else said, they KNOW how to game the system.. to get maximum benefits.

One last rant... I was in NY for a couple of years... there was one time when the welfare people were standing in line to get something (I can not remember what)... but the new reporter was going down the line asking them about what they had... almost all of them had a cell phone and cable TV... which WE paid for... I do not have cable TV, so why should someone on welfare be able to get it?

 

[samclem]

Tawney,
-Right, I'm not advocating creation of a huge group of poor people in the US. But I'm just noting that there are worldwide market forces at work that cannot be changed by legislation here. Uneducated/unskilled people in the US will not be able to live as wel as the last generation of uneducated/unskilled workers did. The last generation was an anomaly. Look back at the life of a worker (income, even working conditions) of a US factory worker in 1920--I think that is where we are headed for low-skill jobs. And, there's really no alternative, since workers elsewhere can do the unskilled work at much cheaper rates and no US manufacturer can compete unless relative US wages go down. And, before we start encourageing tarrifs and economic disengagement, it would be good to look at the success of that course of action in the past--it is not pretty.

There are three bright spots:
-- On a very long-term level, foreign wages will go up, which will help support higher wages in the US.
-- As foreign workers gradually get more disposable income due to their higher wages, they'l be buying more things from the US This will help US workers.
-- Despite claims to the contrary, low-wage earners in the US are doing better than they have in the past. The median income in the US from 2001 to 2004 (most current year availabe) increased by
1.6 percent after inflation. The mean income decreased 2.3 percent over the same period. That can only happen if low-income folks are earning more, and higher income folks are earning less.

There is nothing wrong with unskilled labor--the guy who pushes a broom or cleans fish in a factory is contributing far more to society than many folks who earn more money. But, the days of working in a US factory and beng able to buy a new car every three years, live in a nice house, and pay for a college education for your kids is probably going or gone already.

As a note--wages for many unskiled jobs in the US would increase if we stemmed the flow of illegal aliens ("undocumented workers"--"hey, I think I misplaced my passport and visa during that hike across the desert!"). In those cases where an industry really can't compete in the worldwide marketplace if they pay higher wages, I think it would be better to allow a controlled guest worker program with tight restrictions than it would be to have the whole factory move to another country. At least we'd still benefit from the ancillary jobs from having the work done here. It would be better than the present situation.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

This from an ER? Say it ain't so. I'd rather be sitting at home in my lawn chair drinking bud right now than sitting in my office. It is 11 in the morning here though.

Not me. I'd be sitting there thinking "budweiser and a crappy lawn chair? not this guy. I'm gonna go work for eight bucks an hour to afford to buy sam adams and a nice chair to sit in."

Last thing in the world I'd be doing is getting strap marks on my ass and drinking rat urine.

 

[lets-retire]

Tawny--My experience with the welfare recipients seems to be much different than yours.  I am in a position to be able to discover slightly more private information about the people I deal with on a daily basis.  AS I said in another post if I find someone who is cheating the system and can prove it to the standard required they are turned in and lose their benefits.  In the Sec 8 housing area of my town there are generally two types of occupants.  Long term occupants fall into two categories, welfare recipients who follow the system and just the poor.  Short term recipients also fall into two categories, welfare recipients who are cheating the system and the slightly better off poor who didn't know about the area before moving in.  In my experience the long term occupants typically are doing the best they can with what they have and don't cause any problems.  There are few long term residents. The short term better off poor occupants discover what the area is like and get out as soon as possible.  The leases are six months so that's how long they stay.  

The welfare cheaters discover they cannot abide by the policies of the landowner and are told their lease will not be renewed and if they violate the policy again they are evicted and lose their benefits.  Seldom do they violate policy again.  The others are arrested, turned into the appropriate agency for action, or otherwise handled and leave.  This is the predominate category of people in the Sec 8 areas I deal with.

The original post:  My sister-in-law had her five children taken from her for extreme neglect.  I adopted one of her kids.  When they were taken from her she was given a choice hysterectomy or be charged with child neglect.  She had already gone through all of the counseling the state could provide and did not change her ways.  The state did everything they could to help her with no improvement.  Her words, "I have five kids I don't need anymore."  She chose the operation, with the advice of a lawyer.  She still receives state support, because she is mentally retarded. Her children are doing very well and have more opportunities now than they ever would have had the stayed with her.  My adopted son was three before he could speak at a 18 month old level.  It took him until 5 years old before he stopped having nightmares and the typical problems associated with alcoholism.

 

[brewer12345]

Yup, people that spend their time worrying about a few welfare cheats, do not understand basic math.  The Savings and Loan scandal in the early 90's went right over their heads and cost $500 Billion. The Iraq war today is another $300 Billion.

Don't look now, but the tab on the war is still running, plus it is starting to look like we may be getting into another little conflagration in Iran.

And if the RE market backs up, there will be enough banks and S&Ls in trouble that we may be shelling out a few buck$.

Welfare cheats? Don't bother me with that small change nonsense.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

By those metrics, we should stop talking about everything else until we wrap our heads around the S&L scandal and the iraqi war ends?

 

[Nords]

Last thing in the world I'd be doing is getting strap marks on my ass and drinking rat urine.

Now that sentence leaves an indelible image!

Who claims poetry is dead?

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Put a little country music in the background, you got yessef a tune.

 

[brewer12345]

By those metrics, we should stop talking about everything else until we wrap our heads around the S&L scandal and the iraqi war ends?

No, but watching Congress waste its time on immigration "reform" that will never happen, gay marriage debates, SS "reform", etc. while there are MUCH bigger fish to fry would be awfully frustrating if I didn't already expect them to spend all their time pissing on each other's heads and remarking about how warm the rain is this time of year.

 

[youbet]

Put a little country music in the background, you got yessef a tune.

Don't even need the music! It's hilarious as-is ........ and fits the source to a tee!

 

[youbet]

It was bigoted and offensive to characterize low-income workers as Bubbas and Earlenes.

Yeah.........  I've always lived and worked in an ethnically and economically diverse area.  I've been most comfortable keeping slurs out of my vocabulary.  You must know some of those folks who try to only refer to African Americans as "Willy" when they're with whites.  Or only tell Polish jokes when there're with African Americans.  And on and on.  Eventually, they screw up and get punched.    

I certainly don't have a slur-free vocabulary perfected.  But I try........

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

My old next door neighbors names were selma ray and billy bob.

Its only a "slur" if I intend it to be, or if its intentionally taken that way.

 

[justin]

My next door neighbor's name is Cletis. He goes by Scotty though.

 

[farmerEd]

Not my point... and that was OVER $20 and that was 20 years ago....

The point is that WE were paying for HER having all these kids... WHY?

We actually aren't paying her to have kids...she had the kids and weare paying so the kids, who really are not at fault here, don't have to live in under a bridge, starve and die of preventable diseases that are easily treated...thats what we are paying for.

If you are worried about wasting government money I think you should be looking up, not down. You'll find a lot more waste.

 

[Texas Proud]

We actually aren't paying her to have kids...she had the kids and weare paying so the kids, who really are not at fault here, don't have to live in under a bridge, starve and die of preventable diseases that are easily treated...thats what we are paying for.

If you are worried about wasting government money I think you should be looking up, not down. You'll find a lot more waste.

Well at least read what I posted correctly... I said we are paying for her having all these kids, not paying her TO HAVE THEM.. a major distinction

And we can all show waste and abuse in the federal government... how about the trillions of dollars that we now owe for prescription drugs.. or the trillions spent to get people out of poverty (the welfare state)... and it is trillions since it started to increase way back in the Johnson administration...

But, I agree... why did we spend so much on Star Wars crap... and we continue to spend money on major weapon systems that do not have an enemy, but this thread is about welfare fraud which does cost a lot...

 

[brewer12345]

but this thread is about welfare fraud which does cost a lot...

Does it? I doubt anyone really knows. Anyone see credible estimates? I'd bet its a far cry from the pork in the last annual budget Congress passed. It is almost without a doubt a fraction of what we piss away in Iraq, let alone the rest of the military budget.

 

[Texas Proud]

Does it?  I doubt anyone really knows.  Anyone see credible estimates?  I'd bet its a far cry from the pork in the last annual budget Congress passed.  It is almost without a doubt a fraction of what we piss away in Iraq, let alone the rest of the military budget.

As they say, a billion here and a billion there... soon you are talking about real money...

NO, it does not even come close to the military waste... and I doubt people know how much it is... I did a quick Google and could not find anything interesting... they said it cost California about $1.5 billion for fraud... do that for all states and the federal government... it adds up.. again, not close to the war effort, the medicare costs, medicaid cost, prescription drugs, SS.... so, should we not do anything about it

 

[Nords]

As they say, a billion here and a billion there... soon you are talking about real money...
NO, it does not even come close to the military waste...

The average Navy AEGIS cruiser costs close to a billion dollars and could conceivably stay in service for 30 years without ever shooting a single round of ordnance.

Is that military waste? A federally-subsidized occupational training program? A casualty/property insurance premium? Or a mobile housing project full of welfare cheaters?

 

[bpp]

That's clearly insurance, not waste. Indeed, the fewer rounds fired the better.

But that's not what people generally mean when they complain about pissing money and lives away in Iraq.

Bpp

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

I'd call it cost avoidance...

 

[HFWR]

Speak softly, and carry a BIG stick...

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Or use the current policy of speaking loudly, mispronouncing half the words, and hitting everybody with the stick.