Chip and PIN credit cards for Europe

[audreyh1]

FWIW, I noticed yesterday that opening a Schwab Investor Checking account for that great ATM card with all ATM fees reimbursed, no foreign transaction fee requires that you open a Schwab brokerage account at the same time, but the brokerage account does not have to be funded at all!

Important little detail........

 

[audreyh1]

About a month ago we opened a Schwab Investor Checking account, and a brokerage account as well, although that didn't have to be funded.

A couple of motivations - I think we will eventually invest in some Schwab ETFs, so I don't mind having the brokerage account. And I decided I really wanted a low-fee back-up ATM card for our Europe trip.

So we'll be using the Schwab Bank ATM card first, and the Fidelity Cash Management card as a backup when traveling in Europe.

By the way - the Schwab ATM/debit card has a chip!

 

[Chuckanut]

Over 400 messages on this topic.

Do you think that is enough for American bankers to get a clue and give us true chip-n-pin cards?

 

[audreyh1]

Over 400 messages on this topic.

Do you think that is enough for American bankers to get a clue and give us true chip-n-pin cards?

That's not how they think. They are interested in maximizing fees, and chip cards with PINs means lower transaction fees for the issuing banks.

 

[explanade]

Yeah I only used my Schwab ATM card.

I transferred money from eTrade to Schwab for my trip. eTrade refunds ATM fees but imposes 1%.

Schwab didn't impose 1% FTF.

Schwa does have a chip but there is no easy way to tell if an ATM has a chip reader.

Next thing will be contactless and ATMs that work with Apple Pay and the like.

I was able to use Apple Pay once on at a London Underground station and at a Boots drug store.

 

[Corporateburnout]

We are traveling to Canada in June. I have a BOFA chip card without a pin with no foreign transaction fees. On my last trip to Toronto a couple of years ago I could not use it in the kiosk at a public parking garage so I contacted the bank and they said they will send me a pin if I requested it. Is this true? Will this bank provided pin work in Canada?

 

[explanade]

I have a BofA Visa with chip but it's strictly chip and signature.

PIN might be for cash advance, not for secure transactions.

 

[Sarah in SC]

About a month ago we opened a Schwab Investor Checking account, and a brokerage account as well, although that didn't have to be funded.

A couple of motivations - I think we will eventually invest in some Schwab ETFs, so I don't mind having the brokerage account. And I decided I really wanted a low-fee back-up ATM card for our Europe trip.

So we'll be using the Schwab Bank ATM card first, and the Fidelity Cash Management card as a backup when traveling in Europe.

By the way - the Schwab ATM/debit card has a chip!

You will LOVE it! I've been telling folks about this forever and it is a great deal! Ours was used from one end of Europe to the other end of Asia, and only one hiccup, in far eastern Russia near Vladivostok, when I neglected to remember the time difference on some funds availability.

Such a fantastic deal, and I hope you have as much ease as we've had with ours. Oh, and don't forget to tell them where you are going! Dummy me forgot about Canada and had to get that fixed over the phone.

 

[gerntz]

That's not how they think. They are interested in maximizing fees, and chip cards with PINs means lower transaction fees for the issuing banks.

I don't think it's the banks' wanting higher fees that's driving this. It higher investment costs for retailers in card reader stations for C&R vs. C&Sign as I understand the situation.

 

[explanade]

Retailers have to invest in chip tech regardless. The credit card companies are shifting liabilties as of October of this year

If a merchant gets hacked after October, they will be liable if they did NOT have POS terminals which support chipped cards.

However, most of the terminals support chip and signature, chip and PIN and contactless (for mobile payment systems like Apple Pay) in one unit and the costs aren't that different.

They do have to spend money because if they only support magnetic stripe credit cards, they could be liable for fraud.

 

[imoldernu]

Received my chip card about a month ago, but have been using the "swipe" until today as no retailers in the area seem to have upgraded.
Checking out at WalMart, the new card reader... (dual swipe/chip) there at the check out... Finding the slot at the bottom of the reader was a nuisance, but what was worse, was when the "window" came up "Card Cancelled".... The checkoout girl tried it several times, but gave up and said my card had been cancelled. (with four people in line looking at this poor bloke who probably had overdrawn his credit limit)

So, I paid with a debit card and we home to call Discover and find out who cancelled my card. "Your card has not been cancelled... it's fine"... Apparently the card has to remain in the reader throughout the transaction until you finalize, instead of the way swipe works... where you press ok after the swipe.

I called Walmart to let them know the employees may need more training. The customer service gal I spoke to was snippy, as if it were my fault.
So much for the courtesy call... I don't think employees give a damn about customers any more.

 

[audreyh1]

We are traveling to Canada in June. I have a BOFA chip card without a pin with no foreign transaction fees. On my last trip to Toronto a couple of years ago I could not use it in the kiosk at a public parking garage so I contacted the bank and they said they will send me a pin if I requested it. Is this true? Will this bank provided pin work in Canada?

Probably not. That PIN is for cash advances.

 

[audreyh1]

You will LOVE it! I've been telling folks about this forever and it is a great deal! Ours was used from one end of Europe to the other end of Asia, and only one hiccup, in far eastern Russia near Vladivostok, when I neglected to remember the time difference on some funds availability.

Such a fantastic deal, and I hope you have as much ease as we've had with ours. Oh, and don't forget to tell them where you are going! Dummy me forgot about Canada and had to get that fixed over the phone.

Definitely notifying all issuers of our travel plans.

I feel kind of guilty. Until I make some investments in the brokerage, Schwab won't be making much off of me.

 

[audreyh1]

I don't think it's the banks' wanting higher fees that's driving this. It higher investment costs for retailers in card reader stations for C&R vs. C&Sign as I understand the situation.

Don't see how as most of them accept debit cards requiring PINs.

And the chip reading - same difference. All retailers have to upgrade anyway.

 

[audreyh1]

Received my chip card about a month ago, but have been using the "swipe" until today as no retailers in the area seem to have upgraded.
Checking out at WalMart, the new card reader... (dual swipe/chip) there at the check out... Finding the slot at the bottom of the reader was a nuisance, but what was worse, was when the "window" came up "Card Cancelled".... The checkoout girl tried it several times, but gave up and said my card had been cancelled. (with four people in line looking at this poor bloke who probably had overdrawn his credit limit)

So, I paid with a debit card and we home to call Discover and find out who cancelled my card. "Your card has not been cancelled... it's fine"... Apparently the card has to remain in the reader throughout the transaction until you finalize, instead of the way swipe works... where you press ok after the swipe.

I called Walmart to let them know the employees may need more training. The customer service gal I spoke to was snippy, as if it were my fault.
So much for the courtesy call... I don't think employees give a damn about customers any more.

That's right. The transaction was cancelled, not the card.

Sorry but

You do have to leave the card in until prompted to remove it, or told transaction accepted, or some such.

 

[AllDone]

We have a Schwab account. How do I explain this ATM card to my hyper-wary husband?

 

[audreyh1]

We have a Schwab account. How do I explain this ATM card to my hyper-wary husband?

Do you have the Schwab Investor Checking account?

The ATM card has no foreign transaction fee and refunds any ATM fees charged by the ATM machine.

Schwab Bank - which is separate from the brokerage.

 

[gerntz]

Don't see how as most of them accept debit cards requiring PINs.

And the chip reading - same difference. All retailers have to upgrade anyway.

But they're reading magnetic strip cards I think,vs. chip cards.

 

[Meadbh]

Received my chip card about a month ago, but have been using the "swipe" until today as no retailers in the area seem to have upgraded.
Checking out at WalMart, the new card reader... (dual swipe/chip) there at the check out... Finding the slot at the bottom of the reader was a nuisance, but what was worse, was when the "window" came up "Card Cancelled".... The checkoout girl tried it several times, but gave up and said my card had been cancelled. (with four people in line looking at this poor bloke who probably had overdrawn his credit limit)

So, I paid with a debit card and we home to call Discover and find out who cancelled my card. "Your card has not been cancelled... it's fine"... Apparently the card has to remain in the reader throughout the transaction until you finalize, instead of the way swipe works... where you press ok after the swipe.

I called Walmart to let them know the employees may need more training. The customer service gal I spoke to was snippy, as if it were my fault.
So much for the courtesy call... I don't think employees give a damn about customers any more.

Imoldernu, I'm sorry you had a bad first experience. Yes, it does seem that a little more staff orientation was required. This is the Standard Operating Procedure that I experience:

1. Indicate that you will be paying with a Visa or MasterCard chip and PIN card, as applicable.
2. The clerk will set the terminal to accept your credit card.
3. Watch the screen on the terminal. Within a few seconds it will say "insert credit card". Insert the credit card into the slot and leave it there.
4. The amount of the bill will appear on the screen. It will ask you if this is correct. If so, press "yes". If not, press "no" and discuss the bill with the clerk. If the bill is correct...
5. At a restaurant, but not at a store or gas station, the screen will ask whether you want to tip, and how much. There are several different formats; percentage, currency amount, or multiple choice.
6. As soon as you have entered the tip you want, the screen will say "enter PIN". This is a four digit number which only you can change. Enter it.
7. Now the screen will say "processing...please do not remove card". Wait.
8. Moments later, the screen will say "APPROVED. Remove credit card". Remove your credit card. The clerk will give you a receipt. If you are in a restaurant, the waiter will bring the wireless point of sale terminal to your table and it will print out two copies of you receipt, one for you, one for the merchant. Your credit card remains in your possession at all times.

If you enter an incorrect PIN, you get to start again. If you enter an incorrect PIN three times, three strikes and you're out. You do not need to get a new credit card. You do need to visit a branch of your financial institution, where you can change your PIN on one of their readers.

As an example, two years ago I went to an unfamiliar gas station and entered an incorrect PIN, three times. My PIN was cancelled and I paid by debit. I then flew to Hawaii, where I used the same credit card repeatedly for two weeks using the magnetic stripe. On my return to Canada, I visited my bank and changed my PIN, after which my credit card worked normally.

I hope that's helpful.

 

[Sarah in SC]

Alldone, you can also get the debit card on a regular brokerage account as well. I chose to get an investor checking account recently, but had the debit card on my plain old joint account for years.

If you want, you can PM me for more specifics on it. In my job I work with Schwab on a regular basis, so am very familiar with their account info.

 

[audreyh1]

But they're reading magnetic strip cards I think,vs. chip cards.

It's just not making a whole lotta sense that upgraded terminals handling chip cards wouldn't handle pins as well since they still have to handle debit cards with PINs. And some of those debit cards have chips now too.

 

[skipro33]

I got a new Amazon VISA card today, even though there was nothing wrong with my original one. I did receive a credit limit increase I asked for a few weeks ago though, so maybe that triggered a new card with security. It's now over $30,000 limit. This one has the chip and detailed instructions on how to use, including diagrams of where to find the slot, what the screens will show each step of the way, etc.

 

[audreyh1]

I got a new Amazon VISA card today, even though there was nothing wrong with my original one. I did receive a credit limit increase I asked for a few weeks ago though, so maybe that triggered a new card with security. It's now over $30,000 limit. This one has the chip and detailed instructions on how to use, including diagrams of where to find the slot, what the screens will show each step of the way, etc.

I think this is just part of the rollout that will happen over the next year as banks convert people to chip cards.

Some of my replacement cards have come with a chip.

Chips don't prevent Internet fraud though - someone can still order online using the old style card credentials. (CVC)

 

[rodi]

I thought I'd update and share my experiences with chip and pin in Europe.

I obtained a PenFed visa prior to our trip.

Everywhere I used it that had a person (gift shops, museums, restaurants) the signature thing printed out. I was convinced it wasn't working.

When we were in Berlin there was a long line to purchase tickets to the TV Tower... and there was a kiosk that seemed to be frustrating people with a very short line. I tried the kiosk (while leaving my son in the longer line, just in case) and sure enough - it prompted for a pin.

Again, in Amsterdam, when purchasing 24 hour transit passes - long line for a person, and a machine that people seemed to be cursing... I tried the machine, and voila - it prompted me for the pin and spit out the tickets.

So - as mentioned previously, the card defaults to signature but on un-attended kiosk machines it prompts for the pin.

 

[audreyh1]

I thought I'd update and share my experiences with chip and pin in Europe.

I obtained a PenFed visa prior to our trip.

Everywhere I used it that had a person (gift shops, museums, restaurants) the signature thing printed out. I was convinced it wasn't working.

When we were in Berlin there was a long line to purchase tickets to the TV Tower... and there was a kiosk that seemed to be frustrating people with a very short line. I tried the kiosk (while leaving my son in the longer line, just in case) and sure enough - it prompted for a pin.

Again, in Amsterdam, when purchasing 24 hour transit passes - long line for a person, and a machine that people seemed to be cursing... I tried the machine, and voila - it prompted me for the pin and spit out the tickets.

So - as mentioned previously, the card defaults to signature but on un-attended kiosk machines it prompts for the pin.

Yep, that's exactly how it behaves. American style, LOL!

I'm encouraged that you were able to use it in the Amsterdam kiosks, and I'll use it next time. Not all transit authorities accept foreign credit cards at their kiosks - Deutsch Bahn at the Munich central train station doesn't. By the time we reached Amsterdam I had forgotten the PIN, LOL.