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Old 05-14-2014, 09:50 AM   #41
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I have a chip card from PenFed. I use it here in Portugal all the time. It automatically asks for a signature.
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Old 05-14-2014, 09:52 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by audreyh1 View Post
Well, I guess you will have to wait until your try to use an automated machine in Europe?

I read somewhere (did we discuss it here?) that these cards are configured for "signature priority". That is, if a signature can be obtained, the card will prompt for that, only defaulting to PIN if signature cannot be obtained. Kind of annoying that, but probably yet another Americanismo when it comes to dang credit cards!!!!!
That is the way our SDFCU chip & pin worked in Paris. At restaurants the waiter would put the card in the machine, but they seemed surprised when a signature receipt started printing since they saw the chip on the card. When we used it at an automated machine to buy metro tickets, it asked for the pin and worked without a problem. Wish it was pin priority, but it still worked.
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Old 05-14-2014, 10:55 AM   #43
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I read somewhere (did we discuss it here?) that these cards are configured for "signature priority". That is, if a signature can be obtained, the card will prompt for that, only defaulting to PIN if signature cannot be obtained. Kind of annoying that, but probably yet another Americanismo when it comes to dang credit cards!!!!!
Yes, that's the way it works with my Penfed card. Rather annoying, since every place we used it on our first trip had a person there and we always had to sign. So I was a little bit worried.

But on this last trip we bought train tickets in Cadiz from a machine. It asked for the "número secreto"-- which I assumed was the PIN and then it said "número secreto correcta" and printed our tickets.
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Old 05-14-2014, 11:04 AM   #44
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We always thought, No problem, it's got a chip so it should work--we'll just have to deal with the surprized looks from the cashiers and sign the dang slip.

...until the day we went walking on our own and got lost and spotted a gas station ahead so we could just go in and ask the attendant. Until we got there and discovered that all the pumps were automated and there was no attendant. Just the pumps.

That's what is in our future here, when/if the Dems raise the minimum wage to $10. No human persons, just chip-and-pin machines.

We ate at a Burger King in Madrid, too. There were real people there, but they did not handle money. You gave the girl your order and stuck your money or card into a machine. Anybody that tried to give them money, they waved it away and pointed to the slots in the machine.
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Old 05-14-2014, 01:53 PM   #45
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That is the way our SDFCU chip & pin worked in Paris. At restaurants the waiter would put the card in the machine, but they seemed surprised when a signature receipt started printing since they saw the chip on the card. When we used it at an automated machine to buy metro tickets, it asked for the pin and worked without a problem. Wish it was pin priority, but it still worked.
That's good to know. I learned years ago that my non-chip credit card was not accepted by Metro, RER, & SNCF machines in France. I recently got a PenFed credit card w/chip and hope to use it 2 weeks from now to buy my RER ticket from a machine when I exit CDG airport.
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Old 05-14-2014, 03:31 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by audreyh1 View Post
Well, I guess you will have to wait until your try to use an automated machine in Europe?

I read somewhere (did we discuss it here?) that these cards are configured for "signature priority". That is, if a signature can be obtained, the card will prompt for that, only defaulting to PIN if signature cannot be obtained. Kind of annoying that, but probably yet another Americanismo when it comes to dang credit cards!!!!!
That is what it looks like. Used it again today and no PIN required.
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Old 05-14-2014, 03:44 PM   #47
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Let me suggest what might happen as well. Since in many cases there is a minimum purchase needed to require a signature (say $25) it might be a pin is required above it and none below, just like today at Wal-Mart small purchases don't require you to sign on the machine. (But other stores do so its somewhat up to the store and the cost benefit ratio of getting a signature, the same might be true of the extra time to enter a pin).
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Old 05-14-2014, 03:49 PM   #48
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Let me suggest what might happen as well. Since in many cases there is a minimum purchase needed to require a signature (say $25) it might be a pin is required above it and none below, just like today at Wal-Mart small purchases don't require you to sign on the machine. (But other stores do so its somewhat up to the store and the cost benefit ratio of getting a signature, the same might be true of the extra time to enter a pin).
Last week I used my new card in the Chip and Pin slot at the Walmart check out and the bill was $122. I swiped it first, but it detected it had a PIN and I had to put it into the slot at the base of the unit, but no PIN required, just signature.

Largest bill so far in Canada has been $81, and no PIN requested.

ETA

Today our Canadian host paid an $18 charge with his card and PIN was needed. He says he always needs a PIN when buying something.
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Old 05-15-2014, 04:33 AM   #49
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If you are fortunate enough to be able to use USAA, they also have a free chip and PIN on their matercard. It does have a 1% for trans fee, so we are migrating over to PenFed signature visa moving forward as they have a 0% for trans fee.
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Old 05-15-2014, 05:35 AM   #50
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I plan to use the PenFed card for gas rewards and automated ticket machines in Europe.

Otherwise overseas I'll use the BofA Travel Rewards chip and sig card since it earns 1.5% rewards as well as no transaction fee.

We ran across quite a few cashless food businesses in Amsterdam, especially in the train station. I can see why they'd just as soon have no employees handling cash.
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Old 05-15-2014, 05:50 AM   #51
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Last week I used my new card in the Chip and Pin slot at the Walmart check out and the bill was $122. I swiped it first, but it detected it had a PIN and I had to put it into the slot at the base of the unit, but no PIN required, just signature.

Largest bill so far in Canada has been $81, and no PIN requested.

ETA

Today our Canadian host paid an $18 charge with his card and PIN was needed. He says he always needs a PIN when buying something.
Yeah - I think some of these minimum purchase rules are completely different in US versus other countries.
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Old 05-15-2014, 06:00 AM   #52
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US financial institutions just don't want to give up that signature! Is it concerns about customer migration? Or something else? 'Cause the US public has been using debit cards with PINs for years. Maybe the problem is bringing a reader out to the table in a US restaurant so the customer can enter the PIN to complete the transaction. The migration is obviously going to be a loooong one.

The chip and pin issue might not have solved the Target data breach issue (that's not clear), BUT the chip does make it much harder to duplicate the credit cards. From what I read, credit card fraud is waaaaaaay down in Europe. I don't know if it's the chip or the pin.

Still you can't use a chip and pin card for online purchases - I mean it reverts to card number, CVC and expiration date, billing address, so seems like chip and pin credit cards would be just as vulnerable for online abuse if hackers collected the CVC.
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Old 05-15-2014, 06:20 AM   #53
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US financial institutions just don't want to give up that signature! Is it concerns about customer migration? Or something else? 'Cause the US public has been using debit cards with PINs for years. Maybe the problem is bringing a reader out to the table in a US restaurant so the customer can enter the PIN to complete the transaction. The migration is obviously going to be a loooong one.

The chip and pin issue might not have solved the Target data breach issue (that's not clear), BUT the chip does make it much harder to duplicate the credit cards. From what I read, credit card fraud is waaaaaaay down in Europe. I don't know if it's the chip or the pin.

Still you can't use a chip and pin card for online purchases - I mean it reverts to card number, CVC and expiration date, billing address, so seems like chip and pin credit cards would be just as vulnerable for online abuse if hackers collected the CVC.
They have a thing called "verified by Visa " that many companies signed up for and our UK debit. card is registered so you have a password for online purchases. We've bought many things online in the UK using our UK card and get prompted for the password we set up on the card. I like that feature and wish US companies would adopt that standard.
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Old 05-15-2014, 07:02 AM   #54
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For online purchases I use mostly my Citibank master card virtual account numbers that along with the CVC change every time I use the card. I have not had any issues with this card for the last 6 or 7 years.
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Old 05-15-2014, 08:07 AM   #55
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For online purchases I use mostly my Citibank master card virtual account numbers that along with the CVC change every time I use the card. I have not had any issues with this card for the last 6 or 7 years.
This does not prevent someone from using the numbers from one of your real plastic cards for their online purchases. Much credit card fraud happens this way.
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Old 05-15-2014, 08:38 AM   #56
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This does not prevent someone from using the numbers from one of your real plastic cards for their online purchases. Much credit card fraud happens this way.
I agree. It will only prevent hackers from getting the number online which is not as big of a risk, assuming one has a good online malware protection, as getting a hold of your credit card number in a restaurant.
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Old 05-15-2014, 02:34 PM   #57
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They have a thing called "verified by Visa " that many companies signed up for and our UK debit. card is registered so you have a password for online purchases. We've bought many things online in the UK using our UK card and get prompted for the password we set up on the card. I like that feature and wish US companies would adopt that standard.
I use PayPal to buy from any unknown or smaller business site. Only my most trusted retailers see my credit card. I don't usually use a VISA anyway. I wonder if something is available for Fido AMEX.
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Old 05-15-2014, 04:12 PM   #58
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They have a thing called "verified by Visa " that many companies signed up for and our UK debit. card is registered so you have a password for online purchases.
MasterCard and Visa both have that system, and I'm signed up in both, but I do a lot of online commerce and have very seldom been asked to use it by US merchants.
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Old 05-15-2014, 08:06 PM   #59
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I used a chip and pin card from SDFCU at metro terminals without a problem in Paris last year.

I will be in Paris next week and have BoA Chip card.
But I have no PIN assigned (I think)
So how will it work in Metro or toll machines?
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Old 05-15-2014, 09:27 PM   #60
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I'd like to know whether people are getting a good foreign currency conversion rate on their PenFed chip credit cards.

I just found out that Bank of America, which has agreements with specific banks in various countries that allows customers to use those foreign banks' ATMs without incurring ATM fees, has started to charge a 3% foreign currency transaction fee. I guess I'll stick to Charles Schwab.
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