Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-05-2014, 06:02 PM   #21
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,385
Quote:
Originally Posted by FUEGO View Post
I'm not up to speed on the latest orthodoxy with respect to the definition of "retired". I thought it meant "not working" and describes someone who has left a career (at the very least).

The "SAHD" part answers the "what do you do all day" question.
Retired means not doing or required to do labor for ones daily bread. If a stay at home Dad is anything like what I read on here, it is very similar to 1950s stay at home mothers. They worked, and worked plenty, just not for a paycheck or for social security credits.

And, if the situation no longer pleases either party to the marriage, there can be a divorce in which the currently non cash earning partner can take a variable share of the surplus and current earnings of the currently earning partner.

Unless the modern working woman and breadwinner is a lot harder than the typical 50s male breadwinner, in case the home partner should become disabled or otherwise unable to contribute, that partner is not on his or her way to sleeping under a bridge. If the earning partner does not see it that way, the courts will, I would imagine even if he stay at home member is male.

When some single man or woman quits their job, their position, security, and power is quite different from that of a stay-home man or woman who quits. To me, what they have done is change job descriptions and bosses, and if the earning partner is very successful, perhaps improved their security position.

Ha
__________________

__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 05-05-2014, 06:32 PM   #22
Moderator
rodi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 8,817
So... since my husband is doing the bulk of the kid-schlepping - when I retire will he still be considered a SAHD, and not retired?

I don't get it.

Our finances are joined. But he would be retired whether I was in the picture or not.
__________________

__________________
rodi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 06:52 PM   #23
Full time employment: Posting here.
jjquantz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 848
Quote:
Originally Posted by FUEGO View Post
Then are you truly FI?
Interesting question. In my case there are two factors that come into play.

1) Because of our past working histories and our current jobs, the impact of DW's continuing to work on our retirement income is much greater than mine. My SS benefit is pretty well set, but hers increases pretty dramatically with several more years of work. In addition, as a late career Fed, she can qualify for a pension if she hangs in there for several more years, my current position has no pension options. Lastly, also because she is a Fed, there is the chance to hang onto her healthcare benefits as a bridge to Medicare - not available to me.

2) We have discussed the fact that we could BOTH retire NOW, if we were willing to have the standard of living that we enjoyed when I was teaching and she had various part time jobs. If she and I continue to work until she can collect the suite of benefits that come with reaching the magic numbers associated with Fed employment, we can enjoy a standard of living that is higher than what we enjoy now. But, the reality is that this is largely dependent on HER employment, not mine. If I retire and she continues to work, the reality is that we still will have a standard of living that is at least as high as our current one.

The risk is that something happens to her and I end up with a lower standard of living - but I would be perfectly happy with that in exchange for the freedom to enjoy life now. DW also realizes that this is just the way the numbers work because of the choices we made when we were raising kids and the luck of the draw when it came to trying to get employed in DC. She got the Fed job, I ended up at a non-profit. It could easily have turned out the other way.
__________________
jjquantz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 07:19 PM   #24
Recycles dryer sheets
Sea Kayaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Vancouver/Gulf Islands/Baja
Posts: 479
I have several months yet to get my story straight, to find a proper "label" to appease the nosey masses when I no longer work come this Fall. My wife is going to keep working for the foreseeable future so I am sure there will be whispered utterances of "kept man" and other such things.

Screw it, I think I'm going with "retired" and enjoy the resulting angst it will generate.
__________________
Sea Kayaker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 07:24 PM   #25
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,385
Since nuance is apparently not popular, I have a suggestion. Everyone is retired. Certainly welfare recipients are retired. Almost everyone today gets some sugar from Uncle, so we are all retired. The guy in front of Trader Joe with his hand out is retired. The psychotic that just passed my building raving about something is certainly retired. After all, his keep such as it is along with his meds are given to him without anything that I can see being required, other than that he do nothing for money.

Work is so yesterday!

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 07:31 PM   #26
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 366
I was not trying to be mean, just what popped into my head upon scanning the article.

I guess every family where the woman stays at home to raise the children. The old normal, traditional family model, is retired. Not FI necessarily but RE, works for me.
__________________
springnr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 07:39 PM   #27
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
REWahoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Texas Hill Country
Posts: 42,107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sea Kayaker View Post
... I am sure there will be whispered utterances of "kept man" and other such things.
If I had retired while my wife continued to work I would have worn the "kept man" label as a badge of honor - even purchased "KPTMAN" vanity plates for my car!
__________________
Numbers is hard

When I hit 70, it hit back

Retired in 2005 at age 58, no pension
REWahoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 07:41 PM   #28
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,420
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
Almost everyone today gets some sugar from Uncle...
Ha
Some more than others.

As for me, in 2012, I paid no Federal income tax on a roughly $100K income due to various tax breaks, deductions, etc... No Fed income tax as in "$0". Does that count as "sugar"?

Alas, that "tax free" status did not persist till 2013. My income dropped, yet I had to pay some taxes due to status changes such as youngest son no longer claimable as dependent, no college tuition credit, etc...

So, work is passé. Nobody works anymore.

No, no can do! Somebody has to work to stock up the supermarkets where I get my food, fill the underground gas tank so I can refill my gas-guzzling RV. And most importantly, somebody has to work at these corps whose shares I am holding for dividends.

I am just glad that I do not have to work anymore. I have worked from 19 till 55, and it's time for someone else to do it.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 07:50 PM   #29
Full time employment: Posting here.
HawkeyeNFO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Inside the Beltway
Posts: 573
Look at all the haters commenting below the story. Proving again that the people here are clearly in the minority. The sheeple likely never get it.
__________________
HawkeyeNFO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 08:35 PM   #30
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,326
These fluff pieces never really give enough numbers, details or assurance of fact checking to find out if the guy is realistically retired for life or is just saying he is.

Most posters here are seem to be pretty realistic if not overly cautious about what it takes financially to ER, but I see a lot of posters on other forums say they will never have to work again with <$500K at 30 or 40 and very little SS to look forward to. Good luck with that amount and any serious, long term illness or car accident that might occur over the next 60 years.
__________________
daylatedollarshort is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 09:07 PM   #31
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,420
As I searched the Web for RV travel blogs, I found interesting stories from people who lived very frugally in RVs while boondocking in National Forests or state campgrounds. Many were older people living on a meager SS, but some were early retirees who either took this lifestyle by choice or necessity. There was a forum where two typical budgets were shown: one at $500/month and another at $1000/month. It may not be the lifestyle that most people pick, but some are doing it.

About financial backup for illness, many of these people go without any insurance and rely on indigent healthcare programs for catastrophic illness. Now with ACA, that worry is gone.

By the way, the guy in the quoted article said that he had a 7-figure networth or portfolio, so he's not the same as the van and RV dwellers I described above.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 09:33 PM   #32
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,385
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
As I searched the Web for RV travel blogs, I found interesting stories from people who lived very frugally in RVs while boondocking in National Forests or state campgrounds. Many were older people living on a meager SS, but some were early retirees who either took this lifestyle by choice or necessity. There was a forum where two typical budgets were shown: one at $500/month and another at $1000/month. It may not be the lifestyle that most people pick, but some are doing it.
Sounds like an excellent life, for a squirrel. Also a whole lot better than some public housing full of bedbugs, for people who just have very little money. I suppose these people have constrained lives, but they are in charge.

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 09:49 PM   #33
Recycles dryer sheets
thefinancebuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 262
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodi View Post
I don't really get that idea that a working spouse means you aren't retired. I work. My husband is retired. Is it only ER that doesn't count? (Hubby is 62). He's filling the role of SAHD... not to mention gardener, contractor/handyman, personal assistant... (Our kids are school age.) But he's retired and would be doing those things (except the PA) if I was retired also.

Is it the SAHD thing that negates the term retired? In the article linked in the OP - the wife isn't working.
The wife isn't working now but will go back soon. The test is whether he relies on her income. Suppose the marriage ends tomorrow and they split the assets in half and contribute equally to child support. Does he have to go back to work to maintain his lifestyle? If yes he's retired. If no, he's not.
__________________
thefinancebuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 09:56 PM   #34
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Orlando
Posts: 3
Hello. I am the person in the news story. One of your members referred me to this site.


Here are answers to some of your comments/questions. Powerplay is correct, my wife is not 100% aboard with the plan. I'd say closer to 90%. To make early retirement work requires very disciplined discretionary spending. She would like more flexibility to spend on wants rather than needs, but she has always been careful with her own spending. My wife worked for a corporate law firm in NYC for 4 years and her salary was more than double that of mine. She has not worked since 2010 and will only seek part-time legal work in the future. I think you can be a stay-at-home-dad and be retired at the same time.


We only need about 3-4% returns on our investments to cover basic living expenses and we can risk investing heavily in equities because of our ages (37 and 35). Two other items the article did not mention. One, I secured a pension from NYC that will kick in at age 57 along with free health care for life. That makes me feel more secure about no longer working. Second, a decent chunk of our retirement assets are in a 457 plan, which is just like a 401K except for one major difference; there is no penalty for withdrawing funds before age 59 and a half. With very little income and tax deductions/credits from two children, that 457 plan is like a big bank account as long as we do not withdraw too much in any calendar year. We are also slowly converting traditional IRA funds to Roth IRAs so that we will eventually have all our retirement assets in Roth IRAs.


I just joined the site and it appears to be very informative. I've enjoyed reading your comments. Thanks.
__________________
maarc1976 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 10:36 PM   #35
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 366
Paul Harvey... Page 2
And now you know -- the rest of the story.
____________________
Hi Marc, welcome and thanks for fleshing out the article. Were not nosy much, ;>) inquisitive maybe.
__________________
springnr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 10:45 PM   #36
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 398
We are often told how difficult it is to be a stay-at-home parent. In fact, there are articles in legitimate publications claiming that stay-at-home parents work 94-hour weeks equivalent to over $100K/yr in the paid labor force (and you can't put something on the internet that isn't totally true). Some argue that these parents - mostly women - should be paid for their sacrifices.

The man in the article (and now the man here!) made a decision to become a SAHD because he believes this is better than remaining in the workforce (admittedly, his wife shares in the parental responsibilities). He can correct me if I'm wrong, but presumably he considers this new role as a SAHD to be a fortunate opportunity. The CBS article considers him to be a non-working retiree.

So if the SAHD is retired because he does not work, does this mean that SAHM's are retired because they do not work?

Excellent article. It takes a lot of effort and financial diligence (and a supportive spouse), but I believe many fathers would like the opportunity to be retired SAHD's. Of course, people often create their own opportunities.
__________________
Shawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2014, 11:06 PM   #37
Moderator Emeritus
Bestwifeever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 16,375
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarc1976 View Post
Hello. I am the person in the news story. One of your members referred me to this site.


Here are answers to some of your comments/questions. Powerplay is correct, my wife is not 100% aboard with the plan. I'd say closer to 90%. To make early retirement work requires very disciplined discretionary spending. She would like more flexibility to spend on wants rather than needs, but she has always been careful with her own spending. My wife worked for a corporate law firm in NYC for 4 years and her salary was more than double that of mine. She has not worked since 2010 and will only seek part-time legal work in the future. I think you can be a stay-at-home-dad and be retired at the same time.


We only need about 3-4% returns on our investments to cover basic living expenses and we can risk investing heavily in equities because of our ages (37 and 35). Two other items the article did not mention. One, I secured a pension from NYC that will kick in at age 57 along with free health care for life. That makes me feel more secure about no longer working. Second, a decent chunk of our retirement assets are in a 457 plan, which is just like a 401K except for one major difference; there is no penalty for withdrawing funds before age 59 and a half. With very little income and tax deductions/credits from two children, that 457 plan is like a big bank account as long as we do not withdraw too much in any calendar year. We are also slowly converting traditional IRA funds to Roth IRAs so that we will eventually have all our retirement assets in Roth IRAs.


I just joined the site and it appears to be very informative. I've enjoyed reading your comments. Thanks.
So nice of you to post here, Marc. You probably have some good insights to offer so I hope you stick around!
__________________
Bestwifeever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2014, 06:03 AM   #38
Recycles dryer sheets
Maenad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Minneapolis 'burbs
Posts: 179
I really didn't care for the snide "his wife has to do without flowers or jewelry" b.s.

DH has given me 1 pair of earrings in the 20 years we've been dating/engaged/married. (We split the cost of our engagement and wedding rings.) Instead, he gives me many other gestures of love and affection every day, that mean a lot more than the obligatory didn't-know-what-to-get-you-so-I-asked-the-nice-lady-at-Jared's.

Here's a hint, CBS morons: some women prefer fiscal responsibility to bling. Having 12x annual expenses currently saved means more to me than diamonds.
__________________
Maenad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2014, 06:22 AM   #39
Moderator
Walt34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 16,539
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maenad View Post
Here's a hint, CBS morons: some women prefer fiscal responsibility to bling.
DW is like that. Last time I spent money on roses, a long time ago, she made it clear that while she appreciated the thought there were better uses for $35.
__________________
I heard the call to do nothing. So I answered it.
Walt34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2014, 06:31 AM   #40
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,619
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarc1976 View Post
Hello. I am the person in the news story. One of your members referred me to this site.
Here's a discussion of the CBS video on you that appeared in March:
Bogleheads • View topic - retired at 37?

And we really know that your daughter's middle name comes from what happened the night of that Jimmy Buffett concert that you and your wife went to.
__________________

__________________
LOL! is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fifteen Brand New Animals mickeyd Other topics 8 12-18-2008 11:14 PM
Craig Named to Idaho Hall of Fame Wags Other topics 13 01-08-2008 06:03 PM
Don't think this will make the headline writer's Hall of Fame gindie Other topics 0 03-04-2007 11:23 PM
Milking our 15 minutes of fame laurence Other topics 9 04-25-2006 08:46 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:38 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.