Parents resent our FIRE plan

[pb4uski]

Forget a long period of time... how about for the last 3 years? the last 5 years?

 

[DINKFIRE]

Forget a long period of time... how about for the last 3 years? the last 5 years?

I don't know and I doubt that they know, but they said their FA was fantastic and their portfolio grew a lot since the recession. Last I heard was about half a year ago, that their FA believed the market was due for correction so he/she sold substantial of their portfolio and held in cash await to jump back in at the right moment.

 

[DFDubb]

I'm about your age. I often told my parents long before I ever got married that I didn't want kids. Every person I ever dated I was very upfront about it with. Once my spouse and I got married, my parents were shocked, SHOCKED that we weren't going to GIVE them grand kids. They would say extremely hurtful and passive aggressive things to my spouse, to the point where we just pretty much stopped seeing them/talking to them. We might go by on Tgiving or xmas, maybe once or twice a year outside of that.

It took them 10 years before they finally realized the error of their ways and apologized to us both. Too little too late. Like others, I'm sure their comments stem from a dark place that they don't even even realize that they have in their hearts. You're bigger than I am for putting up with it.

My folks likely will need our assistance in retirement w/o substantial lifestyle changes (still working in mid/late 60's). I might throw a couple bucks at them here and there, but that will be the extent of it.

 

[haha]

It is very easy for me to understand why many couples might forgo childrearing. Same goes for marriage. Children are always a lot of work, often a lot of worries, and all too often the source of considerable unhappiness. Same goes for marriage. It is possible that marriage itself will be less and less common as time goes on.

Even now, it seems that marriage and childbearing-childrearing are mostly based on feelings, not rational thought.

I have been very fortunate with my sons, and I am grateful for this as I know that it is not automatic. It cannot be, as nothing in life is.

Ha

 

[Dtail]

I don't know and I doubt that they know, but they said their FA was fantastic and their portfolio grew a lot since the recession. Last I heard was about half a year ago, that their FA believed the market was due for correction so he/she sold substantial of their portfolio and held in cash await to jump back in at the right moment.

Guess he missed the 20% market return for 2019.....

 

[Telly]

By the last period of the last sentence of the original post, I had a solution

A lot of good possibilities have been shared, but this one by pb4uski is clear, fair, and concise. I would make one little edit to it:

.....If I were the OP I would just be clear that I understood that there will be no inheritance but at th same time that my financial plan does not include providing monetary support to the parents should they run out of money and see what happens. .......

I would make the following change:

If I were the OP I would just be clear that I understood that there will be no inheritance but at the same time that my financial plan [-]does not include[/-] will not support providing monetary support to the parents should they run out of money and see what happens.

The change makes clear that the $$$ will not be there at all to support them, it will not be a case of your "choosing not to support them". I think that's fair. I doubt your plan would/should support any of us here at E-R.org should we squander all our dough!

 

[marko]

I'm just trying to get my head around a mentality that says: "Oh! You've done well in life and want to retire early? Well if you do that, we're going to deliberately overspend all our money so that you don't get any! (we'll show you!!)".

What's wrong with these people? Is this some sort of jealousy? Quite twisted IMO.

 

[DINKFIRE]

I'm about your age. I often told my parents long before I ever got married that I didn't want kids. Every person I ever dated I was very upfront about it with. Once my spouse and I got married, my parents were shocked, SHOCKED that we weren't going to GIVE them grand kids. They would say extremely hurtful and passive aggressive things to my spouse, to the point where we just pretty much stopped seeing them/talking to them. We might go by on Tgiving or xmas, maybe once or twice a year outside of that.

It took them 10 years before they finally realized the error of their ways and apologized to us both. Too little too late. Like others, I'm sure their comments stem from a dark place that they don't even even realize that they have in their hearts. You're bigger than I am for putting up with it.

My folks likely will need our assistance in retirement w/o substantial lifestyle changes (still working in mid/late 60's). I might throw a couple bucks at them here and there, but that will be the extent of it.

Thank you for the encouraging words and I'm sorry that you have to go through all that.

[...Mod Edit ...]Even though [Mod Edit...our parents...] never said they are OK with our decision, they don't pest us openly either. They would say so-and-so just had a baby and he/she was a darling. We basically just stop talking about this topic with them and ignore their hints.

 

[Aerides]

At most, if the OP feels obligated to care for his parents in say, 20 years, he could plan for a cottage/extra bedroom, or nice rental apartment in his expenses for those future years. If the parents have a safe clean place to live that's taken care of, then SS + MC should reasonably cover their other expenses. Not a 10k per month lifestyle, but that would be ridiculous.

It would be more than most of us expect to do, but OP perhaps enough for you to remove the wild card from your expenses? Could you add on an in-law suite in your home (if you'd even want to)?

I think I'm with most of the forum members here, going off the little info from your posts: If your parents are, A) ridiculing your ER plans, B) flaunting their spending and their expectation of running out, and C) remotely implying that it will one day be your problem... then I don't think you have quite the relationship that I'd want to even save.

I realize different cultures and upbringings work differently, but my parents are the kind that applauded my efforts to ER, that don't throw money away but I have to encourage them to spend (they still fly coach for international trips, I'm begging them to go business - their response is maybe premium economy next time...), and they'd be horrified to become a burden to us. And we're dinks too, and there's never been a hint that they didn't support that decision.

Best of luck to you, but this is one of those cake-and-eat-it-too things. If you don't want to disrupt the relationship and firmly believe it is a child's responsibility to support his parents no matter what, then I guess you don't get to retire?

 

[MarieIG]

Mom/ Dad while we love you very much we don't agree with your financial decisions and in fact believe that you are spending too much money and jeopardizing your future.

That being said, as you are choosing not to heed our advise, you should understand that we will also make out own decisions. We will not be working to fund your retirement and since we have more modest tastes, have no intention of spending 10k a month in our retirement. And while we would insure that you two do not end up on the street, you may be relegated to room in our home if you go through your savings. (In other words, you are not working to keep them in the style to which they would like to be accustomed.)

Obviously, script may be varied to suit your needs/intentions . . .

 

[easysurfer]

Thank you for your responses so far. It seems easy to say that we are not responsible to support them later on, but it is much harder to do so, especially when have good relationship so far. I don't believe they deliberately trying to make us pay for their elder years, it's just that they are not happy we want to retire early, and not having grand children. It is hard to predict when life will throw a curve ball at you, so if they fall in hardship a decade down the road due to illness, even though they could have ride it out if they keep a healthy saving, we would not be in the right to not help them. To tell them that we won't support them financially will definitely damage our relationship.

Maybe just me, but I'm a bit puzzled (won't be the first time ). I parental/children relationships, is there an expectation of a future inheritance to the children and future financial support of older parents? I'm not asking to be cute (unlike my previous post about get things in writing ).

I believe in independent choices. I wouldn't expect an inheritance from anyone. If so, then awfully kind of them, but not something I'd expect. In the same way, I don't believe it's anyone's obligation to take care a family member. Especially for family who has lived a life of irresponsibility.

 

[Teacher Terry]

Dubb, that’s so sad. I would never jeopardize my relationship with my kids like that. I don’t have a right to be a grandma just because I had 3 kids. People that don’t want kids do not make good parents.

 

[haha]

Dubb, that’s so sad. I would never jeopardize my relationship with my kids like that. I don’t have a right to be a grandma just because I had 3 kids. People that don’t want kids do not make good parents.

Big observation. It takes dedication that cannot be faked or manufactured.

Ha

 

[NW-Bound]

We would never pressure our children into having kids if that is not their wish. It would be ignorance, bordering on stupidity.

And we have been telling our children to save if they don't want to work till they are 70.

It is highly likely we will leave them some reasonable amount of money, but I do not want them to become dependent on it.

 

[Nature Lover]

OP, I would comment my honest feelings - but I think they'd be unfair (we don't really know enough from what you've shared to understand how your parents really feel). If you want to retain your relationship, maybe a real sit down with your parents to discuss why they said the things they did would help "reset" things and provide a better understanding. It would give all of you a chance to get further into their concerns (if they really have them), and your concerns about them, too, if needed. I suspect/hope we all may be over-reacting a bit, but only you would know. Talk of terminating a relationship with parents sounds like a big deal to me. I'd want to dig deeper before making that call.

 

[HarveyS]

sorry, did I miss this somewhere?
Are they your parents or your spouse's parents? I would suggest the person whose parents they are sit with his/her parents and work this out. IMO the son(or daughter)-in-law is in a no-win situation. The child might be able to break even.

 

[gwraigty]

I'm just trying to get my head around a mentality that says: "Oh! You've done well in life and want to retire early? Well if you do that, we're going to deliberately overspend all our money so that you don't get any! (we'll show you!!)".

What's wrong with these people? Is this some sort of jealousy? Quite twisted IMO.

+1

 

[CardsFan]

It is highly likely we will leave them some reasonable amount of money, but I do not want them to become dependent on it.

We are in the same position. While we tell DS to not plan on an inheritance, the fact is, he is likely to inherit an amount to substantially help his retirement. He knows we are comfortable, but I don't think he really knows HOW comfortable. We spend well below what we could, but spend all we want.

To OP: I think you did the right thing by venting here. Sometimes you need to get it off your chest. Now, IMHO, it is time to simply forget it, and let it ride. I would NOT make it an issue and tell them to not count on help if they spend it all (and it sounds like you won't do this).

We all make sarcastic comments (DW would say I do more than I should), and that could be all that it was.

 

[DINKFIRE]

sorry, did I miss this somewhere?
Are they your parents or your spouse's parents? I would suggest the person whose parents they are sit with his/her parents and work this out. IMO the son(or daughter)-in-law is in a no-win situation. The child might be able to break even.

I agree that the son/daughter in-law is in a no-win situation, and they are my in-laws. We had several discussions among ourselves, and my significant other is afraid of having a serious discussion about money with them. I have been discussing early retirement and not having kids with my own parents many times and got their support (although not quite 100%). I was also able to go over their finance with them and made sure they are financially secure.

 

[Yachi]

OP, are you sure your parents understand that you don't need the inheritance to retire early? Their reaction makes more sense if they think you are going to use their money to not work anymore.

 

[ivinsfan]

OP why are you inserting yourself into the financial affairs of both sets of parents? It's not your business, just like your finances are not their business. Some boundaries would help all of you.

If one of my kids asked to go over our finances the answer would MYOB. And I never ask them anything about their own finances.

 

[HI Bill]

Why would you feel obligated to help them out given they are intentionally doing this to themselves, with fair warning? I mean it's one thing if an elder parent needs some help or never had much, but in your shoes I'd move far away from them, let them know you expect them to plan for their lives and you wish them luck and that's all.

I love your advice. It's always spot on! Thanks!

 

[Bestwifeever]

OP why are you inserting yourself into the financial affairs of both sets of parents? It's not your business, just like your finances are not their business. Some boundaries would help all of you.

If one of my kids asked to go over our finances the answer would MYOB. And I never ask them anything about their own finances.

Yes. If my daughter-in-law told me or encouraged my son to tell me that they think we spend too much money (we took three big trips last year and remodeled our upstairs and bought a new car, so that sounds like your in-laws, and we know we can afford it) or criticized how we chose to get financial advice, it would be very hard for me to get over it. Stay out of it for your DH’s sake.

You are not young adults who need your parents’ approval, by the way, you are smart cookies who should be very proud of what you have accomplished on your own. Focus on the enjoyment you will get from your early retirement and don’t worry about your in-laws.

 

[DINKFIRE]

OP, are you sure your parents understand that you don't need the inheritance to retire early? Their reaction makes more sense if they think you are going to use their money to not work anymore.

We may not have disclosed to them how much we've saved for our early retirement, but they roughly know how much we make, how frugal we are, and how many investment properties we own without any debt. When they said we shouldn't retire until we could afford their lifestyle, we said we have calculated how much we need based on our own spending history and saved accordingly. When they said they were trying to spend as fast as possible so we shouldn't count on them, we told them it's their money and they should use it to enjoy their golden years to the full extent.

 

[Moemg]

OP why are you inserting yourself into the financial affairs of both sets of parents? It's not your business, just like your finances are not their business. Some boundaries would help all of you.

If one of my kids asked to go over our finances the answer would MYOB. And I never ask them anything about their own finances.

Me too !