SS Trust Fund to run dry sooner than anticipated

[Independent]

Scams like this should also push insolvency along.

My neighbor was an airline pilot and left his wife for a very young stewardess. They made some babies and then he retired. So now we pay him, his kids and don't forget the young wife SS bennies. This makes sense, no?

I can believe children, but I'm skeptical about benefits for a "young wife". Retirement Planner: Benefits for your spouse

The additional benefits for children and spouse cannot raise the total family benefit above a maximum, which appears to be 175% of the PIA for a high income retiree.
Formula for Family Maximum Benefit

 

[73ss454]

I can believe children, but I'm skeptical about benefits for a "young wife". Retirement Planner: Benefits for your spouse

The additional benefits for children and spouse cannot raise the total family benefit above a maximum, which appears to be 175% of the PIA for a high income retiree.
Formula for Family Maximum Benefit

My neighbor said his wife also gets SS as long as she doesn't earn more than about 15K a year. Yes, he also said there is a max amount and I think in his case it's about 4500 a month or so.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I can believe children, but I'm skeptical about benefits for a "young wife". Retirement Planner: Benefits for your spouse

The additional benefits for children and spouse cannot raise the total family benefit above a maximum, which appears to be 175% of the PIA for a high income retiree.
Formula for Family Maximum Benefit

Firstly you must be married 10 years before any wife (young or old) can claim a spousal benefit.

The "young wife" must be at least 62 to claim any benefit at all. At 62 the spousal benefit is reduced. A full spousal benefit isn't available until the spouse is at full retirement age.

I suppose "young" is relative. If you are 80 with a 62 year old wife then that hussie can be described as the "young wife"

If you die off she can claim a (reduced) widowers benefit at 60.

 

[marko]

Y'know...back when I took my first job 43 years ago, all us young'uns joked that by the time we were 65 there'd be no SS for us..."don't even think about it...it'll be long, long gone!".

Now I'm two years away and guess what? I'm going to get SS.

To me, this is just another scare tactic. I think we'll find a way for SS to continue for years to come.

Right now, I "just want mine"....like everything else lately, let the grandkids pay for it!

 

[73ss454]

The "young wife" must be at least 62 to claim any benefit at all. At 62 the spousal benefit is reduced. A full spousal benefit isn't available until the spouse is at full retirement age.

.

I don't believe this to be true. My neighbors wife is in her 40 and he is 64. He took his SS at 62. He was telling me that as long as she doesn't earn over about 15K she gets SS along with the kids.

 

[marko]

I don't believe this to be true. My neighbors wife is in her 40 and he is 64. He took his SS at 62. He was telling me that as long as she doesn't earn over about 15K she gets SS along with the kids.

Somebody PLEASE tell me this is true/possible!!!!!!!

 

[73ss454]

It's true as long as the kids are under age.

 

[marko]

It's true as long as the kids are under age.

To be clear: a 65-ish guy with a 40-ish wife with minor children. No disability. The wife can claim her own SS??

Does the same hold if there are no children?

 

[73ss454]

Nothing for the young wife if there are no under age children.

Take a look at B3 & B5

Meaning of the letters after a Social Security or Medicare number

 

[rodi]

Somebody PLEASE tell me this is true/possible!!!!!!!

Yes. If the wife is a SAHM and the kids are under 16, the wife can get some SS from her older husband's SS benefit.
The kids can get a benefit till they turn 18, or a few months later if they're still in high school. (It runs to the end of the school year in high school the year they turn 18, or the 18th birthday - whichever is later.)

Retirement Planner: Benefits for your spouse

Retirement Planner: Benefits for your children

The family limit still applies. So the wife's benefit might reduce the kids' benefits. The total limit for the retired person and children is 150-180% of the full retirement age benefit. So, if I read it correctly, a person who retires at 62 gets a reduced benefit. But his/her kids/spouse could get an additional value that is based on the full retirement age benefit.

I had no idea about this till I started reading this forum.

 

[rodi]

To be clear: a 65-ish guy with a 40-ish wife with minor children. No disability. The wife can claim her own SS??

Does the same hold if there are no children?

No. The wife is claiming under his, if she's the caregiver for the kids.
Only works if there are children.

Then when she reaches retirement age she could collect under her own wage history, or the spousal coverage.

If she's 40, and has young ones, they'd turn 18 before she turns 62... so there would be a gap before she could collect spousal benefits at age 62.

 

[73ss454]

Try this.

Social Security Family Benefits Mess

 

[rodi]

Even in the Trump scenario it's capped by the family max. So Ivana & Melia (wives) and Tiffany and Barron (minor kids) would all get reduced amounts.

 

[GrayHare]

Even after reading SSA's descriptions, I'm not clear Who's on First. Which of the following is correct for couples married over 10 years?

A. The younger spouse can claim spousal benefits as soon as the older spouse reaches eligible age.
B. The older spouse can claim spousal benefits as soon as the older spouse reaches eligible age.
C. Both are true.

 

[73ss454]

D. Both are false.

We need some ages and if kids are involved.

 

[GrayHare]

D. Both are false.

We need some ages and if kids are involved.

Surprised such specifics make a difference, but let's say no kids, older spouse is age 60 and younger is 50, both have worked.

 

[73ss454]

You get to keep working.

 

[GrayHare]

You get to keep working.

which means spousal benefits are not possible unless there are kids... wow, the SSA info certainly didn't make that clear

 

[73ss454]

...and the bread winner is 62 or over. Then the whole family gets money with young kids and a wife earning less than around 15K a year.

 

[ronocnikral]

which means spousal benefits are not possible unless there are kids... wow, the SSA info certainly didn't make that clear

I've found the SS handbook to be an excellent resource and pretty easy to navigate.

Here is the answer to when a spouse can begin drawing on SS

1. You either:
   1. Are age 62 or over; or
   2. Have in care (as defined in §312) a child under age 16 or disabled who is entitled to benefits on the worker's Social Security record; and

That's really suppose to be the letter "D" and not "1". Also, you only have to be married 1 year prior to applying for benefits for your spouse to qualify. 10 years is the amount of time you must be married to qualify for divorced spouse's benefits (and that is not computed in the family maximum).

Here is how their benefit is reduced starting at age 62.

A spouse can choose to retire as early as age 62, but doing so may result in a benefit as little as 32.5 percent of the worker's primary insurance amount. A spousal benefit is reduced 25/36 of one percent for each month before normal retirement age, up to 36 months. If the number of months exceeds 36, then the benefit is further reduced 5/12 of one percent per month. There is no reduction for the prior entitlement as a wife or husband.

 

[GrayHare]

Hmm, still not clear. http://www.ssa.gov/OP_Home/handbook/handbook.03/handbook-0305.html discusses injured workers (only?). Much of the confusion comes from text referring to "you" or "your" when it is unclear if those words refer to the spouse or the person seeking spousal benefits.

 

[ronocnikral]

Hmm, still not clear. SSA Handbook § 305 discusses insured workers (only?). Much of the confusion comes from text referring to "you" or "your" when it is unclear if those words refer to the spouse or the person seeking spousal benefits.

in that section, you and your refer to a spouse of an insured worker. Insured worker is the person who's record of work you are claiming benefits on.

Example: DW is 5 years older than me. When she turns 62, i'll be 57. the earliest she can claim a spouse's benefit on my record is when I turn 62, she'll be 66. She will be near FRA at that time and will benefit from waiting ~6 months until she is 67 to take the full 50%.

Example 2: Let's say the example above is flipped. I am 5 years older than DW. When I reach 62, she will be 57. I can begin my benefit, based on my work record, anytime after I reach 62. DW cannot claim a benefit on my work record (or her work record any earlier than age 62 unless I die or we have a baby by immaculate conception). If I take my early retirement at age 62, it is based on my work record and the rube goldberg calculation poops out a number known as PIA (primary insurance amount, benefit at full retirement age). DW's spouse's benefit is based on my PIA. So when she turns 62, she can take 32.5% of my PIA or wait until FRA to take the full 50%, regardless of when I elected to start my benefit. She cannot take a benefit earlier than age 62 (exceptions noted above).

 

[rodi]

Surprised such specifics make a difference, but let's say no kids, older spouse is age 60 and younger is 50, both have worked.

In this scenario
No benefits till the older person starts collecting at retirement age. They can start collecting a reduced benefit at age 62, or wait till full retirement age (66 or 67).
When the younger person reaches retirement age they get the greater of the following: their own benefit, or the 1/2 of their spouses benefit.
And it gets tricky - if they're collecting on the spousal benefit - and the spouse took early retirement (62) - the spousal benefit is also reduced.

There's also a scenario where the younger person collects the 1/2 spousal benefit at 62, but waits to apply for their own benefit (under their own wage history) till age 70. I think... I could be wrong because that scenario likely won't apply to us so I wasn't paying as close attention to this situation and the nuances.

 

[GrayHare]

Thanks, ronocnikral, with your examples I think the confusion is clearing. If I understand correctly: if there are no children, spousal benefits are not available to spouse A unless spouse B is eligible for benefits, and spouse A is at least age 62.

 

[Finance Dave]

Every day I see healthy appearing person "scamming" the disability system. 40 yr olds with normal spines claiming back pain. Don't know just how pervasive this is (ie, don't have hard data on this), but it would appear that the nation of "food stamps" is also a nation of "I can't work, give me a monthly check" for my fibromyalgia". Please refrain from hate-mail, I know there are plenty of people who justifiably need SSDI, but those who don't are robbing the social security system (read: stealing from seniors).

You're right. I've had injuries where I went to physical therapy...and I had guys next to me on the fitness machines telling me how to make sure I didn't have to return to work for months. I WANTED to get back to work asap...ended up being off 3 days for a back spasm issue.