Choosing new warm, lower cost-of-living, place to move

[misshathaway]

I'm not sure that being single changes much?

I was thinking that a couple would have built-in companionship and mutual support at the beginning before they knew anyone. I won't have that probably.

I feel the same way about the choices. We just had the first snowfall here and I wasn't able to get to it until it was soaked with rain. Miserable shoveling. And I'm thinking, wait a minute, WHY do I have to live in a place with hard winters? I can live anywhere. Next thought - how in the world to you choose between the anywheres?

 

[Accidental Retiree]

This is incorrect and provides quite the wrong impression, IMO. Traffic: in and out of San Diego is a nightmare (the 8, I believe). The 5 through all the way up the center of the state can be a quagmire; the 99 in and out of the central valley is a mess; the 15 in and out of CA into NV is another mess; the 5 into Orange County is a horror to drive, and the 405 has been called a parking lot for at least 20 years. The 101 in the Bay Area has traffic even worse than SoCal, and the 280 there is no longer safe from traffic. These are all major arteries within CA and I've only touched on a few (I've driven them all). Driving is always measured in time, never distance.



There is no such thing as off-peak hours in Los Angeles. Many people here "work" in entertainment and all stores are crowded regardless of the time of day (one of my biggest surprises/disappointments since retirement). The density factor in much of this state is unreal. Try going to Disneyland between Xmas and New Year's to get an idea of the degree of overpopulation in CA.



Gas prices for all grades were over $4 in Los Angeles last year with Premium leading the pack at over $4.50 per gallon. Sales tax is over 10% in parts of LA County, not 8%. Yes, property taxes are capped, but all other taxes more than make up for any advantages.



I agree quality of life is subjective, but I've yet to come up with a good reason for any sane retiree to locate to CA. YMMV.

Traffic into and out of San Diego, the Bay Area, Orange County and Nevada only really matters if those are places you actually want to go--we don't--and if you cannot choose your times. There are smaller cities and towns to live in. We're retired, so we have choices.

We're content in our little area. Like W2R, we're homebodies.

The Disneyland area is busy--especially the week between Christmas and New Year's, when I always thought it was tourists who were visiting. I'll concede LA. That is the worst traffic I've ever seen.

I am a sane retiree and I'm staying put at least for now. There are quite a few other sane retirees on this board to keep me company. This has been my home--HOME--for over 40 years, and I've only just relocated back here from NorCal, after spending 10 years exploring and weighing our options.

If we travel and find someplace else we want to live, a place that feels good to us, then we can move there. I am open to it and look forward to seeing the rest of this country once we get my dad in law's estate settled and we can actually get away. However, we are not actively seeking to escape. We just like to have options.

As Haha has pointed out, and W2R has recently confirmed, moving is expensive. Someplace else would have to offer a good reason for us to move.





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[rodi]

LA traffic is awful - not just during certain hours.

San Diego is definitely limited to rush hour(s).... You can head east on 8 with little traffic anytime except about 4pm-6:30pm. Oh - and if it's during SDSU's first week - you want to be in the left lane if you're heading west before 9am... My son has a friend in Crest, we have friends in Julian, and I service my car in El Cajon - so I'm on the 8 enough to know when to avoid it. 5 North is only bad after work. Same with 15 north.

That said - One of my triggers for early retirement was rush hour traffic home on the 805. But it's fine outside of rush hour.

 

[cathy63]

That said - One of my triggers for early retirement was rush hour traffic home on the 805. But it's fine outside of rush hour.

I am with you there! Counting the days until I no longer have to take 805 to Mira Mesa Blvd. The new southbound HOV lane helps somewhat in the afternoon, but not enough.

 

[haha]

If you don't want cold winters and you don't want CA then your choices are limited to southern Arizona, southern Texas, and mid to southern Florida. All of those places are extremely hot in the summer so make sure you visit in the summer to see if you can handle the heat before you commit to a long-term rental or purchase.

This is the whole story, succinctly told. And what people, especially singles, are thinking about when they think of California is usually not some small town in the San Joaquin Valley. In the, US warm in winter and not blistering hot in summer is coastal California between the Mexican border and maybe through Mendocino County. Also part of the Sierra foothills. None of this is cheap.

You don't say where you live in Mass. but if you live in Boston or other attractive city, consider staying put but vacationing in the Caribbean during some part of January to mid March. Boston is hot in summer compared to the West Coast, but it is a long way from Florida temperatures.

Ha

 

[braumeister]

I can live anywhere. Next thought - how in the world to you choose between the anywheres?

You're making this harder on yourself than it needs to be. It's impossible to choose among alternatives without some criteria to judge them by.

So just make a list (or two or three) of your desired characteristics (climate, population, closeness to whatever). Arrange your list(s) by the priority you apply to that characteristic.

Then use those list(s) to look at the various "where to live" websites. Visit those that look interesting.

It takes effort and determination but it's fairly straightforward. You sound to me like you're just throwing up your hands and saying "it's too hard." It isn't.

When you get to the point where you can ask specific questions on forums like this, you'll get much better answers. Best of luck.

 

[FUEGO]

You don't say where you live in Mass. but if you live in Boston or other attractive city, consider staying put but vacationing in the Caribbean during some part of January to mid March. Boston is hot in summer compared to the West Coast, but it is a long way from Florida temperatures.

Not a bad idea. Pack a bag and rent a furnished apartment somewhere in S Florida for a couple months. Rent is relatively cheap in many places and it won't be that cold.

Other than that, I'd suggest identifying 2-5 places, and visiting for 1-2 weeks to each of them to see how you like the place. But rent a house or apartment through Airbnb/VRBO and see what it's like living in the residential area, not the tourist/hotel zone.

 

[Corporateburnout]

I feel the same way about the choices. We just had the first snowfall here and I wasn't able to get to it until it was soaked with rain. Miserable shoveling. And I'm thinking, wait a minute, WHY do I have to live in a place with hard winters? I can live anywhere. Next thought - how in the world to you choose between the anywheres?

We live in MA also and DW doesn't like the snow and the cold weather. We discussed relocating to a warmer area in retirement but we love the area, the amenities and the close proximity to Boston, Providence and Cape Cod then we decided to sell our house and purchased a new townhome where they plow the snow and even shovel our deck and front steps.

The nice things about being retired is that we don't have to leave the house if it's too cold and snowy outside....

 

[Nemo2]

But rent a house or apartment through Airbnb/VRBO and see what it's like living in the residential area, not the tourist/hotel zone.

How about embarking on a variety of house-sitting jaunts?

 

[photoguy]

This is incorrect and provides quite the wrong impression, IMO.

We'll just have to agree to disagree. Either our experiences or our expectations are different. Nobody publishes off-peak traffic stats (that I'm aware of) so all we can do is trade our experiences/anecdotes. I faced horrible horrible traffic during commute hours but did not have a problem when I could choose the time of my travel (except for LA). I just want to give a different view to thread readers.

I agree quality of life is subjective, but I've yet to come up with a good reason for any sane retiree to locate to CA. YMMV.

Visiting/living in other states these past two years has made me appreciate California even more. I do like some other states as well, but CA is a very attractive package (except for housing costs).

 

[photoguy]

I was thinking that a couple would have built-in companionship and mutual support at the beginning before they knew anyone. I won't have that probably.

In some ways doing this as a couple is great as we always have each other for company, but it can also be a bit of a crutch as we aren't forced to meet new people and we can get stuck in a routine (a local minima for you math guys)

One thing that I've found help very helpful is to join activities on meetup. It's very easy to get into a group activity right away and I frequently met other people who were new to the area as well. Most meetup activities are free and you can probably find something that interests you as any reasonably sized city will have a huge number of groups.








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[misshathaway]

How about embarking on a variety of house-sitting jaunts?

I could DO that! What a great idea.

 

[Another Reader]

Unfortunately, the economic recovery and the growth of the tech companies has made traffic much worse throughout the Bay Area. In the last three or four years, it has become like Los Angeles. Anything that I need to do that involves going across town or north has to be done between 9:30 AM and lunchtime. The grocery store parking lot is packed by noon on weekdays. It can take up to three signals to make a left turn at one of the major intersections off 101 at any other time. I only make doctor and car service appointments between 10 AM and noon. I feel like a prisoner in my own house.

The cities are only allowing high density housing to be built. The San Jose City Council touts each new record in units per acre achieved. One member stated they approved a complex with 165 units per acre. Yet there is no public transit.

If I did not live here, I would not move to the Bay Area. If you are willing to move someplace that's overcrowded with decaying infrastructure for a high paying job, it might make sense. Otherwise, it may not.

 

[meleana]

I, believe it or not, always wanted to move to Alaska until I took a trip there and realized how primitive it was.

Then when I visited Hawaii I wanted to move there, until later realized it was too impractical being so far from the mainland.

But steadily as we kept going back to our timeshare in Vermont, I fell in love with the state and I would love to move there- I really think my place is by the lake- but learned of the taxes on Social Security income. What a downer!

My heart is there, but my head says it would be crazy. Even my home state of NY doesn't tax SS benefits.

So- thinking of New Hampshire where we vacation frequently as well and where our only child lives.

Most people I know retire to Florida. Most already have second homes there/ We can;t afford a second home. Also, been to Florida a number of times and not sure we would be happy there.

I know of people who have retired and moved l;l over the place several times in retirement looking for their Utopia only to move back to where they started.

From what I understand most retirees actually stay put, no matter what you read about.

Our issue is our home is off a steep 700 foot driveway in the woods- isolated- no family or real friends in the area. Our friends live in NYC and Long Island where we absolutely hate the idea of living.

Another issue we have is that, due to economic conditions and local issues, our home is barely worth what we paid for it after living in it for 28 years. We are in year 5 of a 5 year remodeling project, since we are unsure if it would even sell when the time comes and it needed it desperately. Might as well enjoy it while we are living in it.

Then there is the problem of since we can't get more money than we paid for it- despite the huge amount of money we have put into it all these years (and it is on 10.5 acres of land) - what will we be able to afford to buy when we do move? No way am I going to move into something that needs work or is not comparable as far as being updated.

These are very real and unsettling things we have to deal with. No easy answers, but I do think traveling to other areas and researching is the only way you can make a rational decision, as well as renting first when you finally do make the move just in case...For us we will have to sell our home before we even rent, because the cost of keeping a house plus renting elsewhere would be too much of a burden.

 

[Nemo2]

I could DO that! What a great idea.

People will, oftentimes not always, advertise for a house sitter during 'off seasons', (when they want to get away); going during these periods would perhaps provide a look at areas when they're not at their perceived 'best'.

 

[braumeister]

So- thinking of New Hampshire where we vacation frequently as well and where our only child lives.

Don't forget to look at the total picture. New Hampshire has one of the highest property tax rates.

 

[W2R]

I, believe it or not, always wanted to move to Alaska until I took a trip there and realized how primitive it was.

Then when I visited Hawaii I wanted to move there, until later realized it was too impractical being so far from the mainland.

But steadily as we kept going back to our timeshare in Vermont, I fell in love with the state and I would love to move there- I really think my place is by the lake- but learned of the taxes on Social Security income. What a downer!

My heart is there, but my head says it would be crazy. Even my home state of NY doesn't tax SS benefits.

So- thinking of New Hampshire where we vacation frequently as well and where our only child lives.

Most people I know retire to Florida. Most already have second homes there/ We can;t afford a second home. Also, been to Florida a number of times and not sure we would be happy there.

I know of people who have retired and moved l;l over the place several times in retirement looking for their Utopia only to move back to where they started.

From what I understand most retirees actually stay put, no matter what you read about.

Our issue is our home is off a steep 700 foot driveway in the woods- isolated- no family or real friends in the area. Our friends live in NYC and Long Island where we absolutely hate the idea of living.

Another issue we have is that, due to economic conditions and local issues, our home is barely worth what we paid for it after living in it for 28 years. We are in year 5 of a 5 year remodeling project, since we are unsure if it would even sell when the time comes and it needed it desperately. Might as well enjoy it while we are living in it.

Then there is the problem of since we can't get more money than we paid for it- despite the huge amount of money we have put into it all these years (and it is on 10.5 acres of land) - what will we be able to afford to buy when we do move? No way am I going to move into something that needs work or is not comparable as far as being updated.

These are very real and unsettling things we have to deal with. No easy answers, but I do think traveling to other areas and researching is the only way you can make a rational decision, as well as renting first when you finally do make the move just in case...For us we will have to sell our home before we even rent, because the cost of keeping a house plus renting elsewhere would be too much of a burden.

Meleana, welcome to the Early Retirement Forum! What a nice initial post. Feel free to post an introduction in the "Hi, I Am..." section of the forum too, so we can get to know you.

I think that a lot of us struggle with trying to figure out where to live once we retire, just as you are doing right now. My beloved (Frank), and I had planned to move to another state as soon as we could retire. We really wanted to get away from here! We spend a lot of time researching possible relocation spots, especially those with low cost of living and low housing prices but not too cold. We visited our favorites several times during our vacations, and selected a town in Missouri that we really liked a lot.

But then, after retiring, we waited for a year to "decompress" before moving, and during that year we found that work was apparently the main reason we wanted to get away. After retirement, getting away from the workplace and leaving that all behind us was no longer a valid reason for us to want to move. Work is no longer a part of our lives, and we never run into people from work around town; they are still at work.

New Orleans has started to recover at least a partially from its Hurricane Katrina devastation, or else we are so used to it that we don't notice it as much any more. So, we changed our minds and decided to stay put. I'm glad we did. New Orleans has a lot of qualities that we like, although crime and hurricanes are still problems here.

I hope you find a good retirement location!

 

[gerntz]

Problem with this thread is the definition of cold. Seems to be anything with high below 70 & low below 40. Me, I think high of 50 low of 30 is nice jacket/sweatshirt weather & 40/20 ain't bad if sunny & not too breezy.

 

[Corporateburnout]

Problem with this thread is the definition of cold. Seems to be anything with high below 70 & low below 40. Me, I think high of 50 low of 30 is nice jacket/sweatshirt weather & 40/20 ain't bad if sunny & not too breezy.

+1.

I love to take walks on a calm sunny day with temps in the mid 30'. Very refreshing. Unfortunately DW does not share the same sentiment. When we go to outdoor malls here she's inside the stores while I'm walking around the mall.

 

[meleana]

Problem with this thread is the definition of cold. Seems to be anything with high below 70 & low below 40. Me, I think high of 50 low of 30 is nice jacket/sweatshirt weather & 40/20 ain't bad if sunny & not too breezy.

Exactly. We like it between 50 and 70, but certainly can tolerate 75-80 with low humidity preferable.

We also don't mind 32-45 if the sun is out and no wind. You can't have everything perfect. No such thing.

 

[meleana]

Don't forget to look at the total picture. New Hampshire has one of the highest property tax rates.

Yes, we do know that, but better than New York from what we have seen so far.

 

[bmcgonig]

Unfortunately, the economic recovery and the growth of the tech companies has made traffic much worse throughout the Bay Area. In the last three or four years, it has become like Los Angeles. Anything that I need to do that involves going across town or north has to be done between 9:30 AM and lunchtime. The grocery store parking lot is packed by noon on weekdays. It can take up to three signals to make a left turn at one of the major intersections off 101 at any other time. I only make doctor and car service appointments between 10 AM and noon. I feel like a prisoner in my own house.

The cities are only allowing high density housing to be built. The San Jose City Council touts each new record in units per acre achieved. One member stated they approved a complex with 165 units per acre. Yet there is no public transit.

If I did not live here, I would not move to the Bay Area. If you are willing to move someplace that's overcrowded with decaying infrastructure for a high paying job, it might make sense. Otherwise, it may not.

There are different parts of the Bay Area of course. I live in S Marin and we don't have those issues at all. But traveling to the S Bay is a tough slog.


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[meleana]

Meleana, welcome to the Early Retirement Forum! What a nice initial post. Feel free to post an introduction in the "Hi, I Am..." section of the forum too, so we can get to know you.

I think that a lot of us struggle with trying to figure out where to live once we retire, just as you are doing right now. My beloved (Frank), and I had planned to move to another state as soon as we could retire. We really wanted to get away from here! We spend a lot of time researching possible relocation spots, especially those with low cost of living and low housing prices but not too cold. We visited our favorites several times during our vacations, and selected a town in Missouri that we really liked a lot.

But then, after retiring, we waited for a year to "decompress" before moving, and during that year we found that work was apparently the main reason we wanted to get away. After retirement, getting away from the workplace and leaving that all behind us was no longer a valid reason for us to want to move. Work is no longer a part of our lives, and we never run into people from work around town; they are still at work.

New Orleans has started to recover at least a partially from its Hurricane Katrina devastation, or else we are so used to it that we don't notice it as much any more. So, we changed our minds and decided to stay put. I'm glad we did. New Orleans has a lot of qualities that we like, although crime and hurricanes are still problems here.

I hope you find a good retirement location!

Yes, thanks. I will definitely do that.

I get that about the workplace thing. We love escaping to other areas because we work. But something else I noticed is when we are at our home timeshare resorts in VT and New Hampshire, I like the idea that there is a community of sorts the week we are there. We see people going about,some familiar faces, there is someone to call if there is an issue, etc. They take care of maintenance. All important for a permanent residence as well as as we age. Here where we live there is no one- just trees and wildlife. Love it- don't get me wrong. But would like a combination.

Then again, while we are able to do things, without a home, I wonder what the heck we would do. We actually like doing things around the house and outside.We enjoy that to an extent. That, and with belonging to a few organizations and some hobbies would keep us busy, as they do now.

We have said the same thing- when we finally retire we need to not jump into anything. We need to decompress and think and reflect.

Big issue we have is any friends or acquaintances we have met at work live far away from us, as we commute and they do as well. So, we never really met anyone in our own town. Just a few through organizations we belong to. But really couldn't break through the clicks and long time residents of the area who know each other since childhood. We grew up in other areas. Even when our son was young, we just didn't have enough time to establish very close relationships with other people. Everyone including us, was so busy working and surviving. I tried to maintain friendships with people from past jobs long distance but it eventually became too hard - again- lack of time- only weekends to try to fit in everything we have to do in life and everyone's lives changed- they moved, whatever. Then. many people have grandchildren now and are busy with their families. We are not in that situation.

On a plane going back home from Arizona once I sat next to a woman and we began chatting about how much we enjoyed Sedona and Scottsdale. I asked her if she would consider living there, since her hometown was Detroit. She responded that she definitely would not want to live there. Surprised, I asked why and she said, "Because then it would no longer be special". She said she would rather visit each year and have something to look forward to rather than living there full-time and everything becoming routine like it is at her current home.

I never forgot those words and I keep them in mind when I think about retirement.

 

[Mulligan]

+1.

I love to take walks on a calm sunny day with temps in the mid 30'. Very refreshing. Unfortunately DW does not share the same sentiment. When we go to outdoor malls here she's inside the stores while I'm walking around the mall.

I am with you, but going to squeeze out a few more degrees... Anything in 40s with bright sunshine and no wind is fine for me to do or play outside....Bring out the wind and clouds...not so much then...


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[bmcgonig]

This is the whole story, succinctly told. And what people, especially singles, are thinking about when they think of California is usually not some small town in the San Joaquin Valley. In the, US warm in winter and not blistering hot in summer is coastal California between the Mexican border and maybe through Mendocino County. Also part of the Sierra foothills. None of this is cheap.



You don't say where you live in Mass. but if you live in Boston or other attractive city, consider staying put but vacationing in the Caribbean during some part of January to mid March. Boston is hot in summer compared to the West Coast, but it is a long way from Florida temperatures.



Ha

I have thought of doing something like this, I.e., taking off for the winter to Mexico, Hawaii or somewhere else that's warm. But at some stage I assume or I'm afraid that I won't be willing or able to make that trek every year. Thus I feel the need to solve the "winter problem" sooner rather than later. I keep being told that the older I get the more difficult it is to move or change environment so I feel like I have to make my move in my 60s (coming up)


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