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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 06-27-2005, 07:59 PM   #21
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Heh heh, yeah Nords, I hear ya, trust me, but I figure we have to work within the confines of the system that we have, and w/o those things we would likely have a lot more trouble than we do with them. Imagine if SS were cut off right now in it's entirety, I would imagine the majority of Seniors would be in outright serious financial trouble. I agree with what you say, but we gotta deal with the reality.

-Pan-
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 06-27-2005, 08:08 PM   #22
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Quote:
Originally Posted by panhead
Heh heh, yeah Nords, I hear ya, trust me, but I figure we have to work within the confines of the system that we have, and w/o those things we would likely have a lot more trouble than we do with them.* Imagine if SS were cut off right now in it's entirety, I would imagine the majority of Seniors would be in outright serious financial trouble.* I agree with what you say, but we gotta deal with the reality.

-Pan-
Hey Panhead! I sold the bike. All done now. Ride while you can man.

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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 06-27-2005, 09:07 PM   #23
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Retired Volunteers add to Roseberg Police effort:* http://www.policechief.org/magazine/...olunteers.html

Grand Jury Lauds Public Safety Savings:* http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...m17report.html

Retired Health Care Workers Spend Their Golden Years Providing Free Primary Care Services
http://www.rwjf.org/reports/grr/021804s.htm

Devoted volunteers provide TLC for retired - not 'mothballed' - Navy vessels on Suisun Bay
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...07/CC70656.DTL

Lake Champlain Maritime Museumís dedicated volunteers play a key role in preserving and sharing the history of Lake Champlain. ...* The annual dollar value of volunteer contributions of time, energy, expertise, and skills is estimated to be almost $120,000; the true value is incalculable!
http://www.lcmm.org/site/get_involved/volunteer.html

And the list goes on and on...
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OT response to John Galt...
Old 06-28-2005, 08:44 AM   #24
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OT response to John Galt...

...Didn't want to Hijack the thread.....

John Galt, sorry to hear your riding days are over. I was in Laconia again this year, it was wet and muddy but still loads of fun as always....
Hope your still fishing !

-Pan-
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 06-28-2005, 09:53 AM   #25
 
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Here's an idea: Instead of making the last chapter

"ER Makes Things Better for Everyone"

make it

"Does ER Make Things Better for Everyone?"

That is, use the chapter to present your arguments that it does, and also present the arguments against. I'd think it would be hard to object to that.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 06-28-2005, 05:34 PM   #26
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Why don't you make the last chapter " ER is not for everyone"? Then describe several people who are working into their 70s, 80s, and beyond. Compare them with someone who ER'd in 40s or 50s. Probably finish up with some version of Mikhail Csikszentmihalyi's (sp?) idea of Flow. That is, if you're actively engaged in something that's difficult, but not impossible, you are probably happier. You should have a reason to get up in the morning; something that you look forward to doing. And you can do that in retirement, as well as in work.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-01-2005, 11:11 AM   #27
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Thanks to all for your counsel. The book went to bed at midnight last night, and it includes a final chapter substantially optimistic yet tempered with editorial reason. You can see from all the opinions here why crazy writers have level-headed editors. Anyway, we stayed friends (I am married after all -- I know how to lose gracefully) and couched the upside of widespread ER in hypothetical and measured tones.

It was fun to go back and forth with her on some of the issues that get aired here all the time -- like why do so many people who could ER, and who say they would love to ER, fail to ER. She couldn't let me say the dominant opinions from the Board here -- that they are a bunch of weak-willed numbskulls who keep gettting sucked into buying more crud and thus can't afford to do it. Put through the editorial filter it came out much more as a 'lifestyle choice' with nothing negative said about the chief rats in the rat race. Probably a good thing

early-retirement.org got the first billing on the Acknowledgments page -- couldn't have done it without everybody here's ideas and input over the past few years-- it's really all of our book that I took the time to write down.

Thx all
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-01-2005, 11:31 AM   #28
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Good Luck Bob,
Hope everything works out the way you planned.
When can we start reading.

JOE
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-01-2005, 03:31 PM   #29
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Did I miss a title? Or have you got one yet?

Good luck and hope you see a million.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-01-2005, 10:50 PM   #30
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

The title is Work Less, Live More -- due out in Oct from Nolo Press. (It was reading here about Get A Life, Nolo's book on regular retirment by Ralph Warner, that put me on to them.)

From the financial p.o.v. I think of it as volunteer work; if it sells like a normal book, it will return something below minimum wage for the hours I put in during the past year, but it has been a lot of fun no matter what happens.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 12:37 AM   #31
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

I love Get A Life and NOLO press seems like good people to me. I am not so big on retirement but I really agree with Financial Independence. Whenever I think of retiring the volunteer work I ponder like Habitat For Humanity or the Heifer Project all involve considerably more energy than I am expending on my current job. Somehow I have to learn to slow down. But doing something you liike and getting paid for it, sounds pretty good to me. I'll be looking for the book when it comes out.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 05:45 AM   #32
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yakers
I love Get A Life and NOLO press seems like good people to me. I am not so big on retirement but I really agree with Financial Independence. Whenever I think of retiring the volunteer work I ponder like Habitat For Humanity or the Heifer Project all involve considerably more energy than I am expending on my current job. Somehow I have to learn to slow down. But doing something you liike and getting paid for it, sounds pretty good to me. I'll be looking for the book when it comes out.
Is the "Heifer Project" another weight loss scam?

I am totally opposed to "Habitat for Humanity" Think it's a terrible idea.
OTOH, they are not using my money to fund it (yet). Just another
leftist liberal feel-good project. "Oh, look what I did. I am a good person"

JG
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 09:17 AM   #33
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRGALT2U

I am totally opposed to "Habitat for Humanity" Think it's a terrible idea.
OTOH, they are not using my money to fund it (yet). Just another
leftist liberal feel-good project. "Oh, look what I did. I am a good person"

JG
OH come on, JG, WHY? Even the recipients have to put in "sweat equity." As a good conservative, you can't knock that. And, as far as I know, the government doesn't fund it, with possible exception of some tax deductions. If we had more stuff like this, ala the Amish, maybe we'd be a better country. If it's privately funded, done by volunteers, with recipients pitching in, what's not to like? And if it makes the volunteers feel good, maybe they'll keep volunteering? Also, I'm sure that somewhere it annoys labor union types. Looks like win/win to me.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 09:18 AM   #34
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

"Habitat for Humanity" is leftist? Maybe, my sister volunteered in a urban area and the recipient acted like the house wasnt big enough. The idea is to get the recipient to work on the house but the person didnt have much for skills and was asked to help clean up and balked at it. It is just another case of people thinking they are entitled. *I think a lot of young middle class live in apartments waiting to save enough for a down payment. Simply giving people a fish and not teaching them to fish wont get you anywhere. *
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 09:28 AM   #35
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Quote:
Is the "Heifer Project" another weight loss scam?
Online dating service... :P

(For bulls...)
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 09:30 AM   #36
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

If the beneficiary cannot help with the construction, give the home to someone else!
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 10:09 AM   #37
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Back to your book. Your last chapter could be a WHOLE book*

I think another point that could be made is that saving is better for society than going into debt to consume (so many tapping home equity for new cars, etc). A sustainable economy is good for all.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 10:33 AM   #38
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yakers
... the Heifer Project...
Isn't this Trombone Al's failed bull sperm investment? If so, I can understand why it is too much work for you (all that moving around to attract the cow).

REW
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 12:47 PM   #39
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ESRBob
The title is Work Less, Live More -- due out in Oct from Nolo Press.

From the financial p.o.v. I think of it as volunteer work; if it sells like a normal book, it will return something below minimum wage for the hours I put in during the past year, but it has been a lot of fun no matter what happens.
If writing paid well then no one would be reading...

Like a good nuke I immediately added the title to my reading list. Ironically the last book I added to my reading list was "The Art of Demotivation" written by Despair, Inc. founder E. L. Kersten.

Interesting ethics debates--
1. Does an ER need a book on ER? Probably not, so it's an entertainment expense. Does that conclusion mean that you should borrow the book from the library instead of buying it? The savings could go to Dory's server account or to Habitat for Humanity or to funding one's LTC expenses.

I finally decided that I'll buy the book and then donate it to my local library. After I've read it, of course.

2. Should a Young Dreamer buy a book on ER? After all, LBYM would advocate borrowing the book from the library but that would drag down sales and discourage editors from publishing future ER books. (Assuming any discouraged penniless scriveners would bother writing them.)

I decided this question has two answers.
(a) A frugal YD would borrow the library book, read it, and then decide whether it's worthless or a keeper. If it's worthless that would imply that Bob wrote a lousy book or that the reader isn't a true LBYM believer. So the reader would probably decide that it's a keeper and buy their own reference copy (after Amazon puts it on sale or offers cheap used copies) to start thumbing through during devotional meetings. Bob, you're gonna have a year or two of slow sales followed by a meteoric acceleration.
(b) Other YD wannabes would buy the book because it would never occur to them to borrow it from a library. They aren't actually YDs-- just the people we know who ask about ER, nod alertly when we explain the concept, and then go buy an SUV. They'll be working for the rest of their lives (and paying our SS) so it's not worth worrying about! Their purchases would keep Nolo from giving up on the book.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRGALT2U
I am totally opposed to "Habitat for Humanity" Think it's a terrible idea.
OTOH, they are not using my money to fund it (yet). Just another
leftist liberal feel-good project. "Oh, look what I did. I am a good person" JG
Let's not feed the troll behavior, folks... and, John, you're (usually) better than this.
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?
Old 07-02-2005, 02:00 PM   #40
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Re: Imagine: Can lots of people ERing make things better for everybody?

Yeah, I did specifically tell people to borrow the book from the library, but I think that was one of the passages the editor 'improved'. I think it ended up as a tip to borrow books and DVDs in general from the library. I think she figured my original wording was a bit like that book that was popular in the early 70's entitled "Steal This Book", (some sort of proto-terrorist screed, I think).

Maybe the next LBYM Manifesto should be entitled "Don't Buy This Book". Hey, if the libraries buy it, that still sells a few books, right?
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