Too poor to retire; too young to die

[MichaelB]

Sorry! I'm not leading tours of the eating establishments that are our personal favorites, to strangers on the internet. You need to spend a year or two down here exploring the less expensive restaurants on your own. Then you'll figure it out and find a huge number of great places that you like a lot. (Hint: avoid chain restaurants or restaurants that haven't been in business for at least 5 years, like the plague). You'll get to know the chefs and wait staff, and they will treat you like family. Chefs are our local celebrities and have more sway in what goes on down here than do politicians or wealthy businessmen.

So much for Southern hospitality I guess...

I don't think her post was meant the way you took it.

A funny story. We recently attended a wedding. During the reception dinner I was tablemates who has lived 30 years at the same address, near our current home, and pronounced himself a "foodie". I was excited to hear his experiences and recommendations until he told me his two ethnic favorites. I know one, took my grandchildren a year ago and vowed never to return.

W2R makes an important point, the only real way to find a great meal is with first hand experience. Other people's tastes and reviews can help but only when you are certain there is some compatibility.

 

[MichaelB]

Back on topic, the article in OP reminded me of the book "Nickle and Dimed" by Barbara Ehrenreich. Some people are in a bad way despite working hard and appearing to have the ingredients needed to improve their lot. It is not always clear why, nor how to help those that have a hard time making more effective choices.

 

[Gumby]

I remember when I was young, poor and hungry, and how a good meal loomed large in my thoughts. If you are truly poor, after a while you start to feel so beaten down by life that you want to have just one thing that will make you happy, a least for a short time. It might be a prime rib dinner, an expensive pair of sneakers, a family picture from a picture studio or what have you. If you could just have that one thing, your life would not be so unrelentingly bad. The expected joy from your purchase might well prove illusory, but the desire for it is real. (I recommend the Italian movie "The Bicycle Thief" for an exploration of this phenomenon as it applies to food).

Objectively, I know that she'll be better off financially by foregoing the prime rib dinner, and I'll bet that if you ask her, she would agree. It's easy to say that she should always eat as cheaply as possible given her financial situation, but that would take an iron will and self discipline that I certainly don't possess.

And, for context, when the young wife and I eat at a restaurant with table service, the bill is almost never under $21.36 a person.

 

[athena53]

Back on topic, the article in OP reminded me of the book "Nickel and Dimed" by Barbara Ehrenreich. Some people are in a bad way despite working hard and appearing to have the ingredients needed to improve their lot. It is not always clear why, nor how to help those that have a hard time making more effective choices.

Great book- I read it years ago. (Summary: she goes undercover and tries to live in minimum-wage jobs.)

I was reminded of how, in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, very poor families who had been displaced by the hurricane were given Wal-Mart gift cards. The expectation had been that they'd buy food and toiletries. Instead, they spent them on junk food. It may have been a survival-instinct thing: you've lost everything, you get a gift card and the first thing you want to do is buy food- particularly the kind you find comforting.

If you never lived that way (and I haven't, for which I'm thankful), it's hard to understand those decisions.

 

[Elbata]

In my poor days, I used the cover of a pan to cook potatoes. I removed the knob, covered the hole with foil and that was my frying pan.

Being from a middle class background, I lacked the skills for basic survival. Even was ashamed to attend a class because I had no clean clothes.

Now with places like $.99 store I'd be hardly concerned about where my next meal would come from. Also, I've since fasted many times (water only) and one time for 14 days. Going without food for days would not scare me.

We're all so rich now, many living in poverty today would be middle class in 1950. And to compare 1950 to 1900, one's life would be unimaginably good.

Where I live now the avg home is ~$1MM. Mostly first/second generation immigrants. They thrive, just wanting a chance.

Not trying to be insensitive to those as in this article. If one doesn't have basic life skills, one is up ****'s creek. Common sense and rationality we see is often not that common.

 

[Fedup]

This article reminds me why I don't get the LATimes, I mean who pays to read these things anyways.


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[Walt34]

I highly recommend the recent book by Linda Tirado if this sort of thing interests you. It is called Hand to Mouth, and went a long way in helping me understand more about the mindset of those living in poverty.

+1 on the book Hand to Mouth. I bought it last year and then donated it to the library. A bit of an eye-opener about how even having a stable address means so much in finding and keeping a job. The author makes it much more clear why poor people make decisions that on the surface seem so unwise.

I agree. I can't think of a single time in my life that I spent $21.36 or more on one meal. Even if there are leftovers, that's a ridiculous amount to spend on a meal for anyone who has $50K in CC debt.

Yes, with the $50k in cc debt that doesn't make much sense to most of us - but see Gumby's post above. I'm a guy who didn't see the inside of a restaurant until high school and it was a very long time before I'd be willing to spend the money on a restaurant meal at all, let alone one where they have wine glasses on the table. Once in a great while like for a wedding anniversary or similar occasion we'll spring for a $100+ meal for two but we certainly don't make a habit of it.

But I'd never do that if I had outstanding cc debt.

 

[tmm99]

I agree. I can't think of a single time in my life that I spent $21.36 or more on one meal. Even if there are leftovers, that's a ridiculous amount to spend on a meal for anyone who has $50K in CC debt.

OK, I have spent more than that for a meal, but I wouldn't if I had $50K of CC debt. I don't know how their mind works, really.

Sometimes people who have a whole less money than I do shock me by the way they they spend their money. Priorities are definitely different.

 

[Chuckanut]

A funny story. We recently attended a wedding. During the reception dinner I was tablemates who has lived 30 years at the same address, near our current home, and pronounced himself a "foodie". I was excited to hear his experiences and recommendations until he told me his two ethnic favorites. I know one, took my grandchildren a year ago and vowed never to return.

I used to have coworkers who raved about a certain Mexican restaurant in town. I ate there once. Nothing we were served could not be duplicated with boxed this, canned that and bagged the-other-thing purchased at most general purpose grocer stores like a Safeway or Kroger. Yet, this was the 'finest' Mexican food in the county.

 

[NW-Bound]

I have been to restaurants where a side dish of mashed potatoes or steamed broccoli is $10. So, the $21.36 meal for a prime rib is not bad, even for this woman. But in addition to the $100 to see a Frank Lloyd tour, I wonder what other things that she spent money on that she should not.

As I said earlier, I have read blogs of destitute people who spend $5 on a fancy-schmancy toothpaste tube, or buy grocery at Whole Foods. How do we help these people?

 

[Moemg]

IMO a lot of people enjoy that nomad existence until they get to an age that makes it not fun anymore .Sleeping in a camper is fun & interesting at 30 not so much at 79 .

 

[panacea]

Sad, but geez, it sure seems like a bunch of poor choices to me. Doesn't have to be like this.

 

[travelover]

Sadly, I believe that the inability to handle money is just another manifestation of mental illness. And sadly, right now, there is not much we can do to treat it.

 

[Corporateburnout]

$21 meal for someone with 50K in debt and limited resources is too much no doubt but we pay a little more than that per person for lunch, tip included, a few times a week and not at fancy restaurants either.

So for folks that never paid that much for a meal where do you eat? Fast food restaurants?

 

[W2R]

$21 meal for someone with 50K in debt and limited resources is too much no doubt but we pay a little more than that per person for lunch, tip included, a few times a week and not at fancy restaurants either.

So for folks that never paid that much for a meal where do you eat? Fast food restaurants?

Do you REALLY think your only options for a meal under $22 in this country are fast food? You need to get out more!

Maybe Aaron can be your guide.

I agree. I can't think of a single time in my life that I spent $21.36 or more on one meal. Even if there are leftovers, that's a ridiculous amount to spend on a meal for anyone who has $50K in CC debt.

 

[Walt34]

So for folks that never paid that much for a meal where do you eat? Fast food restaurants?

For one person I know a few places where I could get out for $10 or so but not much less than that. It certainly wouldn't be prime rib though, more like a bowl of chili or a sandwich. But we live in the "wealthy" part of WV.

 

[athena53]

Sleeping in a camper is fun & interesting at 30 not so much at 79 .

Especially when your body and the camper start to seriously deteriorate at the same time. ;-)

 

[Alan]

But we live in the "wealthy" part of WV.

Does that mean you don't have a copy of the Road Kill Cookbook in your house?

 

[Sarah in SC]

Does that mean you don't have a copy of the Road Kill Cookbook in your house?

<snort>!!!
Regular lunches out for me are around $15 per person. Cheap would be $10.

 

[Corporateburnout]

Do you REALLY think your only options for a meal under $22 in this country are fast food? You need to get out more!

I have to look hard to find a place in this part of the country. I also neglected to say that I like my Sam Adams and DW likes her glass of wine with the meal so that makes a difference in price. Also we like to tip 25% for a good service

 

[W2R]

I have to look hard to find a place in this part of the country. I also neglected to say that I like my Sam Adams and DW likes her glass of wine with the meal so that makes a difference in price. Also we like to tip 25% for a good service

There are definitely ways to spend a lot at a restaurant if one is determined to do so, I agree! Appetizers, alcoholic beverages, desserts, and extra side dishes can all ratchet the bill upwards quite a bit, as can ordering the most expensive entree on the menu and eating the whole meal all by yourself. Honestly there really is a middle ground between eating like that and fast food.

 

[Texas Proud]

$21 meal for someone with 50K in debt and limited resources is too much no doubt but we pay a little more than that per person for lunch, tip included, a few times a week and not at fancy restaurants either.

So for folks that never paid that much for a meal where do you eat? Fast food restaurants?

I have paid for than $21 for a meal a good number of times....


However, there are MANY places that have lunches less than $10 that are good sit down restaurants... heck, there are a number around here that you can get dinner around $10 (but then have to pay tax and tip)...

I cannot remember paying over $20 for a lunch... I have had them before when mega paid, but not out of my pocket...

 

[LARS]

If I were headed to NO, I'd just allot longer than a couple of days so that I had time to familiarize myself with the restaurants, if that was my goal. Hint: There Are No Shortcuts, when it comes to food. You can try www.nomenu.com if you want, which is New Orleans' most well known food critic, but like most local food critics, some think he is not immune to bribes.

I SURE wouldn't ask a local single woman from the internet that I didn't even know where she eats all the time, unless I was a stalker. The reason I wouldn't do that, is that I would be likely to find just as good places on my own and it's just a little weird, KWIM? Unlike other destinations, in New Orleans there is not just One Good Restaurant - - the whole place is full of 'em.

To paraphrase Shakespeare: me thinks the lady doth protest too much. Or, if you prefer a different angle, but still from the Bard, this is a tempest in a teapot.

No one is "stalking" anyone. Just friendly banter on what are good local restaurants.


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[Corporateburnout]

There are definitely ways to spend a lot at a restaurant if one is determined to do so, I agree! Appetizers, alcoholic beverages, desserts, and extra side dishes can all ratchet the bill upwards quite a bit

But if someone finds enjoyment in it and can afford it why not?

We only live once and can't take it with us.

 

[urn2bfree]

But in addition to the $100 to see a Frank Lloyd tour, I wonder what other things that she spent money on that she should not.

How about her completely unsubstantiated belief that "organic" is healthier?

"Organic" means more expensive. I am shocked how many people have swallowed the notion that it means healthier. This seems to be nothing but marketing, plain and simple.
For those who disagree, don't tell me about your "belief" or your anecdote about how "organic" cured your (eczema, arthritis, irritable bowel, energy level, etc.) or list some litany of the evils of non-organic food. Just show me some actual evidence.



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