Retire in your 30s and Get Subsidized Healthcare? I don't get it.

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SS initially was not even wage replacement, and just an income augmentation. Then, people rely more and more on it. It is no longer what it was.

This subject came up before, and I spent some time to look at the Australian system, which they came up in 1980 as a fix to their broken system. Everybody has to contribute to a 401k-like system. People who were not able to work or earn little in their lifetime due to various reasons are given a retirement pension but it is means tested. It is indeed welfare.

The money for the welfare pension above comes from the general revenue. That is the big difference with our SS system. Our SS is really welfare in disguise. With the 401k/IRA, if you put in 2x what your neighbor does, you will get out 2x. Not so with SS.

Another thing I like about the Australian system is that your finance in retirement depends on the overall economy, just like with your 401k/IRA. If the business environment is good, your retirement income is good. If it is not good enough to live on, then you apply for the welfare pension.

Nobody gets a guaranteed $100+K pension, while the young people are out of work in a recession. They are all in it together.

SS is definitely NOT a welfare system in disguise. With welfare, there is zero correlation between the taxes one pays and the benefits one receives. Michael Jordan and Bill Gates, should they ever end up needing welfare, will receive a benefit which will not correlate at all to what they paid into the system. Not so with SS. Furthermore, receiving welfare does not require any payment of taxes into the system. The retirement part of SS does require some payment into the system. (Not so much with DI and survivor's, they require something unforeseen and tragic.)

The benefit amount itself is not necessarily a linear one with one's tax payments into the system, but that in itself doesn't make SS welfare.
 
So you're saying there are going to be a bunch of folks in their 60's and 70's on this forum accepting welfare from the government in spite of their seven figure net worths?

I know it's legal, but it really bothers me. Am I overreacting?


I would be outraged myself, except we're already collecting one SS check ourselves and I really like the extra money.
 
I would be outraged myself, except we're already collecting one SS check ourselves and I really like the extra money.

I'll be outraged on your behalf. At least for the next 21 years until my wife can take SS at 62 :)

Then of course I'll switch gears and enjoy that sweet government dole check!!!
Because we've paid into the system and we're entitled to it!
 
Because future retirees won't need any increases? Because the mathematics of inflation will somehow never affect future retirees? Because, I got mine so screw the future? Because you don't have any children anyway? Sorry, it's not at all clear what you mean.

Hi Joeea. I posted "Perhaps it's time to cap or greatly reduce future increases to SS." That's all that I posted, just that sentence and it was in response to comments here about the state of SS. From the 2018 SS Trustees Report (@ ssa.gov)"Both Social Security and Medicare face long-term financing shortfalls under currently scheduled benefits and financing". Per the report, we can raise taxes or reduce benefits, or both.

We should all share the pain, not put it solely on future generations. Shore up the Social Security trust fund now - not wait until it is depleted so much that we must chop benefits by 25% or more in the mid 2030's as projected in the current SS Trustees report. And don't increase anyone's taxes to cover the SS trust fund deficit.

From my point of view, reducing future social security increases is a potentially good solution that should be carefully considered. Reducing future increases to SS benefits (such as COLA adjustments) gives us all time to adjust and plan. Yes, the buying power of our SS benefit will fall a bit over time - but we're told that there isn't enough $ to keep the status quo.

To answer Joeea:
Because future retirees won't need any increases? Because we should all share the burden. See my paragraphs above.

Because the mathematics of inflation will somehow never affect future retirees? There's an unsustainable deficit in the SS Trust Fund. We should all share the pain of fixing this, and not put it solely on future generations.

Because, I got mine so screw the future? That's right!
No, wait - DH and I are both RE and both about 16 years from FRA, so we aren't counting on ever getting SS. (But we paid the max in for years!)

Because you don't have any children anyway? Yeah! Kids - who needs 'em? No wait - We have a child, and nieces and nephews and care significantly about them and future generations. We teach them to LBYM and save for the future.
 
Hi Joeea. I posted "Perhaps it's time to cap or greatly reduce future increases to SS." That's all that I posted, just that sentence and it was in response to comments here about the state of SS. From the 2018 SS Trustees Report (@ ssa.gov)"Both Social Security and Medicare face long-term financing shortfalls under currently scheduled benefits and financing". Per the report, we can raise taxes or reduce benefits, or both.

We should all share the pain, not put it solely on future generations. Shore up the Social Security trust fund now - not wait until it is depleted so much that we must chop benefits by 25% or more in the mid 2030's as projected in the current SS Trustees report. And don't increase anyone's taxes to cover the SS trust fund deficit.

From my point of view, reducing future social security increases is a potentially good solution that should be carefully considered. Reducing future increases to SS benefits (such as COLA adjustments) gives us all time to adjust and plan. Yes, the buying power of our SS benefit will fall a bit over time - but we're told that there isn't enough $ to keep the status quo.

To answer Joeea:
Because future retirees won't need any increases? Because we should all share the burden. See my paragraphs above.

Because the mathematics of inflation will somehow never affect future retirees? There's an unsustainable deficit in the SS Trust Fund. We should all share the pain of fixing this, and not put it solely on future generations.

Because, I got mine so screw the future? That's right!
No, wait - DH and I are both RE and both about 16 years from FRA, so we aren't counting on ever getting SS. (But we paid the max in for years!)

Because you don't have any children anyway? Yeah! Kids - who needs 'em? No wait - We have a child, and nieces and nephews and care significantly about them and future generations. We teach them to LBYM and save for the future.
Last Friday I was talking to a lady older than I. She said the trash place increased their price by $1. That was half her $2 increase for the year. I'm sure she would not mind sharing the remainder.
 
Last Friday I was talking to a lady older than I. She said the trash place increased their price by $1. That was half her $2 increase for the year. I'm sure she would not mind sharing the remainder.


The SS Trust fund deficit is unsustainable. What do you propose?:popcorn:
 
The SS Trust fund deficit is unsustainable. What do you propose?:popcorn:
Currently there is no deficit at all... There is currently a $2.89 trillion (Trillion with a T) Surplus...



With that said there is a PROJECTED Deficit for the SS Trust Fund in the year 2034, which is 16 years from now.... There are a lot of things that can happen in 16 years....


I am a little confused why there is no focus on the $20 Trillion Dollar Federal Debt that we have TODAY. Why is this sustainable?:popcorn:
 
Currently there is no deficit at all... There is currently a $2.89 trillion (Trillion with a T) Surplus...



With that said there is a PROJECTED Deficit for the SS Trust Fund in the year 2034, which is 16 years from now.... There are a lot of things that can happen in 16 years....


I am a little confused why there is no focus on the $20 Trillion Dollar Federal Debt that we have TODAY. Why is this sustainable?:popcorn:




It is pretty easy to project what is going to happen with SS and the trust fund... today... yes, today we know it will fail... and it will fail somewhere between 15 and 20 years...


Now, if you KNEW for sure that you would run out of money in 5 to 7 years (adjusted since you might not do anything if it were 20 years as you might be dead, and SS is supposed to live longer than you) would you adjust your spending today or wait until you ran out of money and THEN do something? Yea, I thought so...


A straw man on the debt... not that it should not be addressed but addressing or not addressing the debt should not affect what needs to be done for SS....
 
It is pretty easy to project what is going to happen with SS and the trust fund... today... yes, today we know it will fail... and it will fail somewhere between 15 and 20 years...


No we don't no what is going to happen at all.... Congress could raise taxes 8 years from now and actually Increase Social Security Benefits.... Who knows, that could be popular with the voters.;)
 
...Now, if you KNEW for sure that you would run out of money in 5 to 7 years (adjusted since you might not do anything if it were 20 years as you might be dead, and SS is supposed to live longer than you) would you adjust your spending today or wait until you ran out of money and THEN do something? Yea, I thought so...

Well, if you think you will die before the money runs out, why not keep the status quo and let the kids figure it out later? :cool:

Heck, they are not even "your" kids, but somebody else's kids too. :LOL:
 
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No we don't no what is going to happen at all.... Congress could raise taxes 8 years from now and actually Increase Social Security Benefits.... Who knows, that could be popular with the voters.;)




If you read, I said it is easy to project.... without anything else happening, such as a tax increase like you say, it will go belly up..


You other post was talking about how there is a big surplus and who knows what will happen in 16 years... like if we did nothing it might not fail... at least that is what I read into your post...


And I agree, something probably will be done before that happens...
 
Some people live on SS alone. You can’t reduce or freeze it. How about making sure it is solvent for the future.
 
Some people live on SS alone. You can’t reduce or freeze it.
It's true with quite a few people. That still leaves a lot who do not live on SS alone.

How about making sure it is solvent for the future.
Raising taxes is the simplest thing to do, but the people who are taxed more don't like it.

Hence, I can see that people who do not live on SS alone will have to do some "sacrifice". :)
 
We all make sacrifices to live in a civilized society. If it was every man for themselves some of the starving people would be robbing to survive due to no other choice.
 
I am a little confused why there is no focus on the $20 Trillion Dollar Federal Debt that we have TODAY. Why is this sustainable?:popcorn:

Because as the holder of the world's reserve currency, it's easy just to create money out of thin air and retire debt. Already been done recently.
 
Because as the holder of the world's reserve currency, it's easy just to create money out of thin air and retire debt. Already been done recently.


Looks like a perfect solution to any Social Security shortfalls also.
 
Shore up the Social Security trust fund now - not wait until it is depleted so much that we must chop benefits by 25% or more in the mid 2030's as projected in the current SS Trustees report.

This is the part I agree with.
 
The SS Trust fund deficit is unsustainable. What do you propose?:popcorn:

By law the SS Trust Fund cannot have a deficit.

The surplus is projected to be completely depleted around 2034. Perhaps that's what you meant?
 
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Looks like a perfect solution to any Social Security shortfalls also.
I don't believe that is allowed under current law. It's certainly a possible action congress could take.
 
We all make sacrifices to live in a civilized society. If it was every man for themselves some of the starving people would be robbing to survive due to no other choice.

Reasonable people agree to some sacrifice. The problem is they don't think their neighbor is sacrificing as much as they do.
 
Being a retired Mod, and collecting my "Mod Retirement Check (Internet police SS, for Fugeo's understanding)", I can say with certainty that this thread is hard work for our illustrious Admin and Mod staff! :LOL:
 
Being a retired Mod, and collecting my "Mod Retirement Check (Internet police SS, for Fugeo's understanding)", I can say with certainty that this thread is hard work for our illustrious Admin and Mod staff! :LOL:


They must be removing a lot of stuff that I do not ever see as I do not think it has even come close to getting out of hand...


But then some things do not bother me that much...
 
They must be removing a lot of stuff that I do not ever see as I do not think it has even come close to getting out of hand...


But then some things do not bother me that much...

As the subject of the OP's ire (or maybe he dislikes the ACA itself??), I have to say I think the crowd has been pleasant here. Maybe the other 90% of the posts didn't make it past the mods! ;)
 
It wouldn't bother me as much if he'd paid 'into the system' for a number of years and then retired in his 50s or even late 40s and then got subsidized. To retire at 33, able bodied, and then avoid paying much of his healthcare costs? Yikes.

I know it's legal, but it really bothers me. Am I overreacting?

Where do you draw the line. A lot of people that get subsidized healthcare are able bodied. They choose to not get an education or a trade, or choose not to work as most in society do. They have different views on life, etc. That is the problem with the government getting involved in all of these programs. They take money by force (taxes), grow the government in size (to manage the program) and spend what is left very inefficiently (by subsidizing those who can, but choose not to).

The truest statement in life, and I believe in the good treatment of others, is "Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he eats for a lifetime". We have become wealthy enough as a society to try and save others from their poor decisions. Much like feeding ducks at the lake, it is not healthy for them and we teach them to not be effective. Its actually a shame.
 
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