Running can be good, but not too much

[RunningBum]

I'm a patient person, but he pressed all the wrong buttons - smug, had to be right all the time. How dare someone consider themselves superior to other people (as he manifestly did), just because their hobby happens to be running. I hope that is not the case with any of the runners here.

A.

That guy sounds like an ass. It's fun to compare races and share running stories with other runners, but not to put down non-runners. Besides, I got humbled in a Spartan race last summer when the Cross Fit addicts and gym rats pretty much kicked my butt.

 

[nash031]

Here is a link to an article I printed out a few years back along similar lines:
Endurance Sports: Studies on Older Endurance Athletes Suggest the Fittest Reap Few Health Benefits - WSJ

I'd say there's some BS in that article. For example, no health benefit to running faster than 8mph? Some folks can run 10mph and have it take the same effort it takes others to run 6 or 7. How is that reflected? Answer: it's not. They should've based it on RPE, Heart Rate, Heart Rate Variability, or something other than speed.

 

[supernova72]

I'm 54 and been running since I was 27 ish. Started "late" in that regard compared to most seasoned runners. Most would say I'm barely a runner since I do three days a week at 3miles, 4miles, 5miles so 12M a week unless training.


Used to do 3-4 races a year including half marathon. I've found once I ramp my miles up when training more injuries were happening. I just did one race last year.


As hard as it is on the body I have not found a cardio that comes close in regards to results and efficiency (how much time it takes, great workout). I've tried biking, spin classes and swimming laps. Yes, at some point I will have to give it up but I'm not looking forward to that day.


One thing I do different from most is my pacing. I might be a bit faster than a jogger but am not a "racer". A 3M run I shoot for a 7:20 pace if I'm feeling good. 4M pace is 7:30, 5M 7:40. I have to be feeling real good to meet those goals however. If it's hilly, hot, or I'm just not feeling it (which is 50% of the time) I can end up in the 7:50-8:00 pace very easily.

What has helped my body the most especially how back is squeezing in a Yoga class once a week.


My last half M was a 1:38 in 2013 so I'm not getting awards that is for certain. I never rain cross country so I don't know what is feels like to run a 6:00pace I'm not in that form right now but would like to get back there soon.

 

[Lsbcal]

That guy sounds like an ass. It's fun to compare races and share running stories with other runners, but not to put down non-runners. Besides, I got humbled in a Spartan race last summer when the Cross Fit addicts and gym rats pretty much kicked my butt.

And then are some of those teenagers breezing past us older guys.

 

[supernova72]

I'm 54 and been running since I was 27 ish. Started "late" in that regard compared to most seasoned runners. Most would say I'm barely a runner since I do three days a week at 3miles, 4miles, 5miles so 12M a week unless training.


Used to do 3-4 races a year including half marathon. I've found once I ramp my miles up when training more injuries were happening. I just did one race last year.


As hard as it is on the body I have not found a cardio that comes close in regards to results and efficiency (how much time it takes, great workout). I've tried biking, spin classes and swimming laps. Yes, at some point I will have to give it up but I'm not looking forward to that day.


One thing I do different from most is my pacing. I might be a bit faster than a jogger but am not a "racer". A 3M run I shoot for a 7:20 pace if I'm feeling good. 4M pace is 7:30, 5M 7:40. I have to be feeling real good to meet those goals however. If it's hilly, hot, or I'm just not feeling it (which is 50% of the time) I can end up in the 7:50-8:00 pace very easily.

What has helped my body the most especially how back is squeezing in a Yoga class once a week.


My last half M was a 1:38 in 2013 so I'm not getting awards that is for certain. I never ran cross country so I don't know what is feels like to run a 6:00pace I'm not in that half M form right now but would like to get back there soon. Maybe if I ER--- Ha.

 

[supernova72]

I'm 54 and been running since I was 27 ish. Started "late" in that regard compared to most seasoned runners. Most would say I'm barely a runner since I do three days a week at 3miles, 4miles, 5miles so 12M a week unless training.


Used to do 3-4 races a year including half marathon. I've found once I ramp my miles up when training more injuries were happening. I just did one race last year.


As hard as it is on the body I have not found a cardio that comes close in regards to results and efficiency (how much time it takes, great workout). I've tried biking, spin classes and swimming laps. Yes, at some point I will have to give it up but I'm not looking forward to that day.


One thing I do different from most is my pacing. I might be a bit faster than a jogger but am not a "racer". A 3M run I shoot for a 7:20 pace if I'm feeling good. 4M pace is 7:30, 5M 7:40. I have to be feeling real good to meet those goals however. If it's hilly, hot, or I'm just not feeling it (which is 50% of the time) I can end up in the 7:50-8:00 pace very easily.

What has helped my body the most especially how back is squeezing in a Yoga class once a week.


My last half M was a 1:38 in 2013 so I'm not getting awards that is for certain. I never ran cross country so I don't know what is feels like to run a 6:00pace I'm not in that half M form right now but would like to get back there soon. Maybe if I ER--- Ha.

____

oops. should have read the story FIRST. They say over 7mph is bad too...

 

[robnplunder]

Having done a lot of physical sports growing up, my knees cannot take anymore pounding. I do bicycle thingy in the gym these days. I never liked running or jogging anyways and I know now why .

 

[Bestwifeever]

Good...now I don't feel so lazy.

I've switched up my exercise routine lately. Instead of doing low impact aerobics five days a week, I now do two. The other three days I jog three miles in 40 minutes. When I'm really feeling energetic, I lift light weights as well.

When/if I develop knee issues, I'll scale back on the walking/jogging.

I'm impressed with the jogging! You are on fire getting all healthy and fitting into your skinny jeans.

 

[supernova72]

I'd say there's some BS in that article. For example, no health benefit to running faster than 8mph? Some folks can run 10mph and have it take the same effort it takes others to run 6 or 7. How is that reflected? Answer: it's not. They should've based it on RPE, Heart Rate, Heart Rate Variability, or something other than speed.

+1 on that fast pace being bad? WTH. Cheers.

 

[ERhoosier]

VERY controversial area. Much data sharply contradict original article's conclusion.
Interestingly, an earlier Danish study (same research group?) published data that "fast intensity cycling" exercise led to longer life in both men and women. Also found a dose response so "fast" cycling led to longer life than "average" cycling, and "ave" longer than "slow" cycling. Same researcher also published data back in 2007 that fast walkers showed more health benefits than slow walkers.
The Benefits Of Exercise: Its All About Intensity
Main researcher (P Schnohr) said that intensity should be individualized.
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To stick with running as the exercise, an even larger (55k subjects) and longer (15 yr follow-up) multi-center US study found both all-cause mortality and cardiovascular mortality did NOT increase with longer & faster running (7.6+mph, 20+mpw, 3+hrs/wk). No additional benefit was seen over less running, but no harm either.
http://content.onlinejacc.org/article.aspx?articleid=1891600&resultClick=3

And I strongly second nash's point about speed being meaningless as a measure of intensity. Even in the same person. After the Holiday layoff (inc too much food/drink) my typical 30min 5k run bumped my ave HR to over 140. After a few 15-20+mi weeks my 30min 5k ave HR is 10+ bpm slower (same course/conditions).

 

[LOL!]

The article didn't say that the runners who ran fast and longer just got hit by more cars and died.

I like to run in my old age, but I don't run faster than a 10 min/mile pace and mostly slower.

 

[Lsbcal]

... After the Holiday layoff (inc too much food/drink) my typical 30min 5k run bumped my ave HR to over 140. After a few 15-20+mi weeks my 30min 5k ave HR is 10+ bpm slower (same course/conditions).

I've never monitored my HR over 40+ years running. My current excuse is: how would I interpret the result?

Recently I've even stopped monitoring my pace but with my Vivofit I should check it out as I now have a pretty accurate distance measurement in the hills. I've read that the Vivofit can also be used with an HR strap.

 

[ERhoosier]

I've never monitored my HR over 40+ years running. My current excuse is: how would I interpret the result?

Recently I've even stopped monitoring my pace but with my Vivofit I should check it out as I now have a pretty accurate distance measurement in the hills. I've read that the Vivofit can also be used with an HR strap.

Not sayin' everyone should be using HR monitors or that HR is a perfect measure of anything. Even amongst elite endurance athletes, HR is highly individualized.
I only mentioned HR here as a rough idea of relative effort (fitness) for same task in same individual (me). When I'm in good shape my ave HR for given pace/distance/course/conditions is quite consistent. My HRs are clearly higher when I haven't been working out regularly for >2-4 weeks.

 

[ERhoosier]

I grew to dislike one runner intensely after having to share a small office with him. He thought being a Runner made him incredibly special. Because I had muscular legs and appeared fit, he assumed I, too, was a runner, and made a number of remarks indicative of how superior the two of us were to people who didn't run. I didn't disabuse him...I just silently despised him, especially when he would haul out a giant bag of potato chips, dump a half-pound of them onto a spread napkin, and monotonously crunch, crunch, crunch his way through them for 45 minutes. Every single day, he would remark that the reason he could eat all those potato chips was because he Ran......

Amethyst

Excellent point! There was a time when most distance runners seemed to believe that running allowed them to eat whatever they liked. Many think the apparent excess bad outcomes observed with high volume running in some studies may reflect these bad dietary habits rather than a negative effect of 'too much' running.

Someday I need to learn how to use multiple quotes in the same post

 

[athena53]

I've never monitored my HR over 40+ years running. My current excuse is: how would I interpret the result?

I got a Polar FT7 when I joined a company with a wellness program. Workouts had to be electronically monitored and uploaded to qualify for incentives (which included significant savings on your share of company health insurance premiums).

I loved it when it worked. I ran the same sprint triathlon in 2011 and 2013 (ages 58 and 60) and cut 5 minutes off my time for the 12-mile bicycle portion of it in 2013. I'm convinced it was because I was working out with a HRM and it kept me from slacking off. If it got below 120 bpm, I'd increase the intensity of my aerobic exercise. Sadly, the chest straps kept failing. It would show on the display that it couldn't find my heart rate, or that it was zero , or it would stick at 90 while I was huffing and puffing, making my way uphill on a bicycle. I got sick of replacing chest straps at $40 each every few months.

On the subject of overeating and calorie burn: I LOVED watching the calorie burn for sprint triathlons and 35-mile bike rides. They were typically 1,200-1,700 calories. I'd go home and post the results on FaceBook, then feast on vegetarian chili with pasta, my favorite post-race meal.

 

[ERhoosier]

I got a Polar FT7 when I joined a company with a wellness program. ... Sadly, the chest straps kept failing. ...

I also have an FT7 and agree the HR strap is not the best. I've had much better luck with Garmins and Sigmas.

 

[Sea Kayaker]

DW and I just got in from a 10k run....55 minutes.

Or, if you prefer, we just knocked a few minutes off our lifespan.

 

[RunningBum]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/06/upshot/no-more-running-probably-isnt-bad-for-you.html

A closer look at the study. Basically it points out that the sample size is small, and the major point is based on 2 deaths of the 40 strenuous runners. Had there been a 3rd death, there'd probably be a ban on running if we paid attention to this study. Had there been 1 less death, then everyone should run as hard as they can, most likely.

 

[nash031]

Like anything, if you have no background in HR, it won't serve you well right off the bat. The rule of thumb is 220-Age for max HR, but most casual runners won't ever get anything anywhere close to that.

I like RPE (rate of perceived exertion). For most of us, it can be summarized as follows:

Easy - Conversation with little difficulty
Moderate - Conversation getting 3-4 words out before a breath
Tempo - Can't sustain conversation, a word or two
Hard/5K race - should start blacking out around the edges of your eyes if you're doing it right.

For HR, I'm 37, my max HR these days is probably in the neighborhood of 185-187. Younger, I'd be up around 191. If I'm going at 5K pace, I can sustain as high as 181. Most of my early season easy stuff is 150-160. Endurance building runs 160-165ish, tempo up to 171. Any intervals and such I'm higher than that, 176-178 a lot.

I've been using HR for more than a decade, and it takes time to get your HRs down to exertion, and then you have to remember that HR lags exertion by minutes, which is key, especially on the bike where you can blow your legs up pretty quick while your HR lags.

Anyway, just some HR stuff. I say, "no time like the present." The sooner you can tie a HR to an RPE, the sooner it becomes a useful pacing tool in your racing/training... then you can have fun with Lactate Threshold Rate (mine is 176-178 depending on the time of year!) and all the goodness that comes with it!

 

[ERhoosier]

Agree HR is a useful tool, but not perfect. HR can also be affected by non-exertional factors like emotion, climate, pain, dehydration, etc. And many monitors can have technical issues producing false readings. There are some gifted athletes who prefer not to use HRMs for most of their training.

---------
----- NEVER begin an exercise program without medical clearance.

 

[nash031]

Definitely. Perceived exertion may be lower when your heart rate is higher when you're overtrained, stressed, sleep-deprived... it's imperfect, but it's a lot less subjective than other measures. I mix and match training with HR, pace, and "by feel", but I almost always race by feel.

 

[zinger1457]

I recently switched from a Polar FT4 HR monitor to a GPS watch with HR monitor and find it's a great improvement. The one I use is made by Papago (model 770) but most of the manufacturers make them now. I have found the HR monitor on the Papago to be a lot more accurate then the Polar I used, it never seems to drop out or give crazy readings. What I like about it the most is that it collects all the GPS and HR data for your workouts and you can download it to their web site where it presents everything in nice graphs and shows a google type map of your route. I also like being able to glance at my watch at any point during a workout (jog, hike, bike) and to be able to see exactly how far I've gone up to that point, the current pace I'm going at, and my HR. To me it's a huge improvement over the basic HR monitor that I used for so long.

 

[athena53]

I have found the HR monitor on the Papago to be a lot more accurate then the Polar I used, it never seems to drop out or give crazy readings.

Thanks! I may want to get one before I start the charity bike rides in the summer since I sold the FT7 on e-Bay (minus the flaky strap).

 

[Helen]

I recently switched from a Polar FT4 HR monitor to a GPS watch with HR monitor and find it's a great improvement. The one I use is made by Papago (model 770) but most of the manufacturers make them now.

I have a Polar FT7 and have noticed the chest strap flakes out on occasion. Overall I've been very happy with it, it's simple and therefore easy to use. When I bought it I decided to go with a basic model to see if I'd use it much. I have, I especially like using it on long and strenuous day hikes and backpacking trips as well as when jogging at the gym.

I'm starting to look at new monitors as I am sure a lot has changed since I bought the FT7. I'd like to see what features are available and think about what will be useful for me. I will research the papago 770.

Maybe I'll start a new thread or bump an older one on HR monitor features.

 

[Choices]

I live with a runner, that's enuff for me. Never have liked running unless being chased. I take some aerobics and weight lifting classes, walk when the snow/ ice is gone.
I like to think I am built for comfort rather than speed.