Paris / Rome Trip

[ferco]

Plan to travel to Paris ( 4 days ) and Rome ( 4 days ) via Trafalgar ( AAA) in a few weeks. What are some "must sees" and what things should we avoid ? Any other travel suggestions pertinent to Paris / Rome.

 

[rodi]

I've only been to Paris once (visiting it again this summer). My fav's were the full bell tower tour of Notre Dam - seeing the gothic gargoyles up close was cool. (Not sure if they still offer that tour. Also Sacre Cour. If you have the energy to climb up inside the dome to the cupola up top - it's an amazing view - higher than the Eiffel Tower.

It goes without saying that the Louvre and Musee D'Orsay are must sees.

For Rome - the obvious: Coliseum, Forum, Panthean and Vatican. Not sure if it's still true - but you need to buy tickets to tour the Vatican museum to get to the Sistine Chapel. Even if you don't want to see statuary with prudish fig leaves applied after the fact - it's worth it to see the chapel. I enjoyed climbing up to the top of St. Peters dome.

 

[audreyh1]

Im looking forward to the Musee des Moyen Ages (Museum of the Middle Ages) in the Latin Quarter of Paris.

And we plan to visit the Musee de l'Orangerie (at the edge of the Tuileries Gardens) which houses Monet's famous water lilies painting. This because we are going on a day trip to Giverny to see Monet's gardens in person later in our trip.

Shockingly, I plan to skip the Louvre on this my first visit to Paris.

 

[Chuckanut]

Montmartre district of Paris is very interesting.

Take some time to walk around and visit some of the parks. Don't spend all your time in the museums. It's easy visit a big city like Paris, and never see the city because one is always in the famous museums.

Edited to add: Also, find a good walking tour that covers a topic you like. For example: WW2 Paris, or Paris and Art, or Underground Paris or ? Hopefully, they don't have any Haunted Paris walks.

Look for the small plaques on walls memorializing the policemen who died fighting the Nazi's in the uprising that took place when people found out that Allied troops were days away from liberating Paris.

In Rome look for small restaurants emphasizing regional foods. Italian food varies by region, and Italian food is not the same as Italian American food.

 

[audreyh1]

I'm kind of burned out on the really large art Museums. After Rijksmuseum in Amsterdam and the Kunsthistoriches museum in Vienna, I'm taking a break this year. Heck, I'm still tired from our Uffizzi visit in 1994!

Personally, I prefer the historic buildings, especially the palaces, and I love the parks and scenic walks or hikes. I do love the treasury museums though - those can be amazing.

You could spend a week in Vienna and do nothing but museums. The way I tend to do museums it takes me all day for a large art museum. If we return to Vienna I might set aside a two days to visit one large museum each day, but no mas!

 

[utrecht]

If I was going to be in Paris for 4 days (which I have been), I would take one of those days and go to Normandy. Its something you will never forget.

 

[Marita40]

I'll be in Rome next week! A couple of hotels that I like, both in the center of everything: Hotel Prati, Hotel Due Torri. I think you can't go wrong with a couple of walking itineraries ala Rick Steves to see the major sites (Trevi, Piazza Navona, Pantheon, Colosseum, Campo di Fiori, the Vatican and St. Peter's, the Roman Forum/Palatine, Castel d'Angelo, Quirnale, the Latern, Paul Outside the Walls, Maria Maggiori, the Caravaggio churches, Piazza del Popolo, Borghese Gardens, Spanish Steps, Corso). Most of these are in easy walking distance of each other. Frankly, if I had only 4 days I'd skip museums, especially if the weather is nice. It is far more interesting to me to stroll through the city taking in the sights, sounds, people watching, eating, etc.

 

[2B]

Since you are doing a Trafalgar tour you probably have most of your time already booked. You will probably have optional tours available. You really just have to plan around your "free time" which will be limited. I second the Rick Steves suggestion but you will probably only have a few half days avalable. Both Rome and Paris are cities that are there to "see." You can easily spend your free time at a street cafe or strolling through various gardens.

Versailles is very impressive. It's a great day trip although your tour company will probably only have a half day visit available. The Louvre is where you can see all those paintings and statues you saw in your high school books. The Mona Lisa is very disappointing. It would take a lifetime to see all of the Louvre if you include all of the other wings. I liked the Orsay better but I like Impressionists.

Rome is full of dead peoples' places. You'll go with the tour flow. Hopefully, you will be staying in a downtown hotel so you can just walk the tightly packed historical area on your own to enjoy the ambiance. If you plan ahead, it would be worth getting tickets to the Borghese Gallery if you are museum oriented. It has a fine collection of Renaissance artwork. Check out their website to see if you are interested. Tickets have to be bought way in advance.

 

[Gumby]

The standard sights in each place are what they are; your guidebooks can describe them in glorious detail. The list below are a few things "out of the ordinary" that the young wife and I have enjoyed.

Paris

1) Have lunch or dinner on the Île Saint Louis, which is right next to the Île de la Cité in the middle of the Seine. After dinner, walk the circumference of the island. Sit on the quai, eat ice cream and watch the world go by. Île Saint-Louis

2) Go to the Marché aux Puces de St. Ouen, which is the original and largest flea market in the world. All sorts of interesting things and people to be seen. You can get there easily on the Metro. Marché aux Puces de St-Ouen

3) Visit the Paris Catacombs. It is both humbling and fascinating. Six million souls, all alike in death. The Resistance hid out there during WWII. The entrance is at Place d'Enfert-Rocherau. Catacombs of Paris

4) Visit the Musée de Cluny, which was a Roman bath, then medieval abbey and now a museum. They have interesting exhibits, including 600 year old tapestries. Musée national du Moyen Âge


Rome

1) Tour the catacombs, and then San Clemente, which is three churches built one atop the other, and all atop a Mithraic temple. This is the tour we took. Rome Catacombs Tour & Basilica di San Clemente | Dark Rome Tours

2) Visit the Largo di Torre Argentina, which has the remains of four Republican era temples and is where Julius Caesar was assassinated. It also has hundreds of stray cats, who sometimes will let you pet them if you need a feline fix. Largo di Torre Argentina.

3) Visit the Forum Boarium, the former cattle market of Rome, where there are two very well preserved Republican era temples and the church of Santa Maria in Cosmodin, on whose front porch sits the Bocca della Verità made famous in the Audrey Hepburn film "Roman Holiday". Forum Boarium
Bocca della Verità

4) Walk to the top of the Janiculum hill. The panoramic view of Rome from the Finnish embassy is fantastic. On the way, stop at Bramante's Tempietto located within the courtyard of the church of San Pietro in Montorio. Also stop at the strikingly beautiful, white Giancolense Ossario Mausoleo, which is a monument to the Garibaldini who defended Rome against the French in the siege of 1849.
Janiculum
San Pietro in Montorio
Gianicolense Mausoleum Monument (Mausoleo Ossario Gianicolense)

 

[rodi]

Gumby - I'm taking notes based on your post. For my Paris visit this summer. We'll have a week in Paris (among your 9 weeks in Europe overall) - so hopefully I'll be able to check out some of your items.

 

[urn2bfree]

Paris-

Get a museum pass (they come in different lengths). They allow you to skip the very very very long lines and get into tons of sites and museums across Paris. Also with a pass you might try a museum for 30 minutes which you would otherwise skip if you had to,pay for full admission at each one. We had a blast at the Pompidou one evening when I think we would have skipped it otherwise.

Study up on which museums are closed on certain days and which are open at night on certain days. Night hours Re a less crowded time to visit and give you more schedule flexibility.

Versailles only runs their beautiful fountains on Sundays, I think. The grounds of Versailles (which are huge) are the real attraction more than the palace.

A DO NOT MISS site not yet mentioned (I think) is the stained glass cathedral of Sainte Chappelle -breathtaking and unforgettable.

Rome-

Walk. Walk. Walk. A fantastic city for discovering things on foot.

But beware. That short distance on a flat map may be quite a bit longer up and down and around the hills that make up the Roman city landscape.

The Pyramid of Rome located at the southern part of town and the cemetery for non- Catholics in which jt is located is a wonderful and peaceful place. (Keats is buried there)

The Pantheon is a DO NOT MISS attraction.


Beware of thieves and pickpockets in both places. Europe in general has nothing like our inner city threat of violent crime problems, but instead are plagued by sneaky small handed thieves (cute children who distract you as they rob you), and those who will not hesitate to take anything you put down unattended for even a second.





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[NW-Bound]

There are so much to see, and you do not have that much time, particularly when you are on a tour already. So look at tour guides and pick what suits your fancy.

... what things should we avoid ?

Be VERY careful about pickpocketers. That's true throughout all large European cities. We never had a tour and had to manage our own belongings, and so far have not lost anything, though we had attempts made on us in Nice and in Brussels. I keep an eye on our belongings all the time, and stay constantly alert of any attempt to divert my attention. For example, when resting on a bench at a rail station, I would rest my leg on my bags lest a thief sneak away with them while I looked around. A friend of mine got his bag stolen when he put it on the ground by his feet while he was standing at the hotel counter to check in.

Again, the European pickpocketers are truly legendary and have honed their craft to a fine art.

 

[Eagle43]

Only one trip to Paris. Loved it. We must have walked 10 miles/day. Did the Louvre, Versailles, and the usual tourist sights. Saw a show at Moulin Rouge. Took a a side trip to Normandy. We liked the cafe life. Sit outside with a carafe of wine (or cup of coffee) and watch the pedestrians. I shall return.

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[2B]

The OP is going to be with a tour so most of the suggestions won't be actionable. The nice thing about a tour is they will see the basics and learn how to get around. It will set the stage for going back when they can really enjoy their visit.

Get a museum pass (they come in different lengths). They allow you to skip the very very very long lines and get into tons of sites and museums across Paris.

Paris can be one of the most cost effective Museum Passes in Europe. Plan out what you want to see. Be careful not to get the one that includes metro passes. The carnet available are more cost effective and easier to use. The reopened Picasso Museum has dropped participation in this pass so don't be afraid to see other museums not covered.

Versailles only runs their beautiful fountains on Sundays, I think. The grounds of Versailles (which are huge) are the real attraction more than the palace.

A DO NOT MISS site not yet mentioned (I think) is the stained glass cathedral of Sainte Chappelle -breathtaking and unforgettable.

The Paris Museum Pass is more easily justified on the high ticket price to Versailles if several other museums will also be seen. The longer passes are easier to justify. It is always important to do the math on any pass like this. Fountain operation is very seasonal. In high tourist season, I believe it runs a couple of times per week but not necessarily every fountain runs. Less touristy times get less fountain operation. Even when things run, they don't run long.

Sainte Chappelle is also covered by the pass. It's inside a high security zone around their version of SCOTUS. It's like going through airport security so leave your pocket knife at the hotel.

Beware of thieves and pickpockets in both places. Europe in general has nothing like our inner city threat of violent crime problems, but instead are plagued by sneaky small handed thieves (cute children who distract you as they rob you), and those who will not hesitate to take anything you put down unattended for even a second.

I carry a decoy wallet in my back pocket that has some wipes, some tissue and some used gift cards to look like credit cards. I'll sometimes carry up to 10 euro to give me an excuse to pull it out to buy small items. I've had several attempts made on it but it is still intact. I figure if they see what they expect to see they will assume it has my money and credit cards in it.

I used to work for a European based company. I was astounded at how many of my peers from the US would be robbed at the airport. Some of the stories were funny beyond belief. Usually, they weren't aware how or when their pockets were picked. We were all given very specific instructions on how to avoid pickpockets. I had an upper executive with the company ask me after I had made several trips without issue why my coworkers from the US didn't follow instructions. He was clearly upset because of all the work that was involved in getting their passports replaced and getting new credit cards for them. I said it would be inappropriate for me to call them idiots.

 

[Gumby]

Sainte Chapelle is indeed breathtaking. I almost put that in my list.

 

[Nemo2]

Again, the European pickpocketers are truly legendary and have honed their craft to a fine art.

My stratagem of having a beat up bag, and looking like the guy who might hit you up for a quarter, has worked...................thus far.

 

[audreyh1]

The OP is going to be with a tour so most of the suggestions won't be actionable. The nice thing about a tour is they will see the basics and learn how to get around. It will set the stage for going back when they can really enjoy their visit.



Paris can be one of the most cost effective Museum Passes in Europe. Plan out what you want to see. Be careful not to get the one that includes metro passes. The carnet available are more cost effective and easier to use. The reopened Picasso Museum has dropped participation in this pass so don't be afraid to see other museums not covered.

The Paris Museum Pass is more easily justified on the high ticket price to Versailles if several other museums will also be seen. The longer passes are easier to justify. It is always important to do the math on any pass like this. Fountain operation is very seasonal. In high tourist season, I believe it runs a couple of times per week but not necessarily every fountain runs. Less touristy times get less fountain operation. Even when things run, they don't run long.

Sainte Chappelle is also covered by the pass. It's inside a high security zone around their version of SCOTUS. It's like going through airport security so leave your pocket knife at the hotel.

I carry a decoy wallet in my back pocket that has some wipes, some tissue and some used gift cards to look like credit cards. I'll sometimes carry up to 10 euro to give me an excuse to pull it out to buy small items. I've had several attempts made on it but it is still intact. I figure if they see what they expect to see they will assume it has my money and credit cards in it.

I used to work for a European based company. I was astounded at how many of my peers from the US would be robbed at the airport. Some of the stories were funny beyond belief. Usually, they weren't aware how or when their pockets were picked. We were all given very specific instructions on how to avoid pickpockets. I had an upper executive with the company ask me after I had made several trips without issue why my coworkers from the US didn't follow instructions. He was clearly upset because of all the work that was involved in getting their passports replaced and getting new credit cards for them. I said it would be inappropriate for me to call them idiots.

So I guess you had better make sure passports are well put away right after passport control and before exiting baggage claim.

Any more tips for us retired travelers? The specific instructions would be nice.

Is does help when you are traveling in pairs.

I like the decoy wallet idea.

 

[2B]

So I guess you had better make sure passports are well put away right after passport control and before exiting baggage claim.

Any more tips for us retired travelers? The specific instructions would be nice.

Is does help when you are traveling in pairs.

I like the decoy wallet idea.

I am humbled by what sounds like you asking me for advice on traveling.

When getting on the plane, I always were a shirt with either one or two pockets. These are usually with a button or zipper. I stick both of our passports in here after passport control because they want them at the hotel. B&Bs don't care.

By the time we get on the plane, both of us have put our back up US cash (~$100 each), debit cards, credit cards, trip itinerary, passport copies and emergency contact information in our undergarment wallet. I'll carry the small amount of euro bills in my shirt pocket and euro change in my backpack (left over from past trip). If I plan on getting cash when landing, I'll also carry my debit card in the shirt pocket.

When traveling, I don't put any bills in my pants pockets. I've gotten my DW to wear pants with pockets so I no longer have to carry her lipstick. I've gotten her to not bring a purse. When she gets some local currency cash, she'll usually also carry it in a shirt pocket but not always. She never has that much on her. It's just spending cash for minor things. I'll make sure she has cash in her undergarment wallet for a taxi if she gets lost or separated. I'll pay for bigger items like meals. Fortunately, we no longer have to buy things for everyone when we go on a trip.

Passports definitely need to be protected. They are a mess to replace on a trip. At best you'll spend half of a vacation day sitting at the US Embassy. If there isn't an embassy where you are going to be, plan on a detour to one before you try to leave.

 

[Nemo2]

We walked 11 hours one day in Rome.....couple places thus far not mentioned are the Castel Sant' Angelo (Mausoleum of Hadrian) opened 139 AD, and the Altare della Patria......(also, of course, if only/mainly for their "Oh yeah, we were there" value, are the Trevi Fountain and the Spanish Steps).

 

[audreyh1]

I am humbled by what sounds like you asking me for advice on traveling.

When getting on the plane, I always were a shirt with either one or two pockets. These are usually with a button or zipper. I stick both of our passports in here after passport control because they want them at the hotel. B&Bs don't care.

By the time we get on the plane, both of us have put our back up US cash (~$100 each), debit cards, credit cards, trip itinerary, passport copies and emergency contact information in our undergarment wallet. I'll carry the small amount of euro bills in my shirt pocket and euro change in my backpack (left over from past trip). If I plan on getting cash when landing, I'll also carry my debit card in the shirt pocket.

When traveling, I don't put any bills in my pants pockets. I've gotten my DW to wear pants with pockets so I no longer have to carry her lipstick. I've gotten her to not bring a purse. When she gets some local currency cash, she'll usually also carry it in a shirt pocket but not always. She never has that much on her. It's just spending cash for minor things. I'll make sure she has cash in her undergarment wallet for a taxi if she gets lost or separated. I'll pay for bigger items like meals. Fortunately, we no longer have to buy things for everyone when we go on a trip.

Passports definitely need to be protected. They are a mess to replace on a trip. At best you'll spend half of a vacation day sitting at the US Embassy. If there isn't an embassy where you are going to be, plan on a detour to one before you try to leave.

I do/will carry a purse, I travel with my iPad mini and like to have it with me most of the time. I don't carry any money or cards or IDs in it. In the past I've carried a bulkier shoulder purse tucked under my arm that can also hold a jacket, scarf, umbrella, etc. it has one zipper on top that tucks under the arm and no outside pockets. I don't put it down.

We carry our IDs and most of our cards and cash in undergarment wallets. Anything in our outside pockets - just stuff needed for the day - is attached with lanyards.

 

[growerVon]

If you're a classic rock fan, look up Jim Morrison's grave in Paris.

I was fortunate to tag along with DW on a business trip to Paris a couple years ago. I used the Rick Steve's travel book for Paris and it included many walking tours. My highlight of the trip was an all-day Normandy D-Day Beaches tour. Caught the early train out to Carentan and hit both US-sector beaches plus Pointe du Hoc. A-mazing!

Another highlight was being able to experience the "lost ring" scam. This was on my way to the Military History museum & Napoleon's tomb. I'd read about it & others and it was fun to watch it develop, knowing all along how it'd resolve. Thanks to the Russian I took in H.S. I always have a great out that befuddles most scammers, door-to-door magazine subscription sellers, and pollsters alike: "Nyet, ya ne ponimayou tebya!" (No, I don't understand you!)

 

[audreyh1]

I do/will carry a purse, I travel with my iPad mini and like to have it with me most of the time. I don't carry any money or cards or IDs in it. In the past I've carried a bulkier shoulder purse tucked under my arm that can also hold a jacket, scarf, umbrella, etc. it has one zipper on top that tucks under the arm and no outside pockets. I don't put it down.

We carry our IDs and most of our cards and cash in undergarment wallets. Anything in our outside pockets - just stuff needed for the day - is attached with lanyards.

I think what I'm trying to describe here is a called a tote bag, except that it zips closed. Apparently carrying a nice version of that kind of bag is common among Parisiian women. I don't think my old "Amsterdam" bag is going to cut it.

I will be wearing scarves too. I usually do in Europe.

 

[2B]

I think what I'm trying to describe here is a called a tote bag, except that it zips closed. Apparently carrying a nice version of that kind of bag is common among Parisiian women. I don't think my old "Amsterdam" bag is going to cut it.

I will be wearing scarves too. I usually do in Europe.

I've heard of backpacks being stolen along with purses. I think the thieves target the classic American woman's purse because of the habit of women to carry their entire lives in it. The male equivalent is the wallet in the back pocket. The pickpockets know where the most likely profitable grab is going to be.

Americans stick out in Europe and there's no way we can disguise it without buying new wardrobes and avoiding tourist sites.

DW and I were on a river cruise and 3 out of about 60 couple were pickpocketed before the cruise left port. I have no clue how many were hit before their 3 days in Paris were up.

 

[photoguy]

I've never had issues with pickpockets -- I'd like to think that's because I'm so alert :-> but it's probably due to looking like a bum or student.

We also use the hidden money belt and then a separate wallet with just cash for the day. Our backpacks/bags have a feature where the zippers can be clipped shut to make it harder for someone to open it without you noticing -- one can also use twist ties for this purpose.

At restaurants/trains etc, I never lose contact with my bag. I have the straps wrapped around my leg so I will notice if someone tries to take it or i sit with the bag on my lap. Haven't had to wear the backpack on my front (I'd try to avoid someplace that crowded).

At my old mega-corp (well known SV company) they told people not to travel with company logos showing as that would make you a target. Kinda stupid since they gave things like branded backpacks.

 

[tinlizzy]

I carry a little bi fold wallet with a chain, secure it in my purse, then tuck it in a purse pocket. Someone can cut my purse but the wallet won't fall out. If I don't want to carry a purse I hook the chain to a belt loop and tuck it in my pocket.

I think the most useful tip I read and used was to take a bicycle cable and lock. We used it to secure our luggage to the railings on trains so we wouldn't have to worry about dozing off. We also used in to lock our belongings in the armoires (we wrapped the cable thru the door handles and padlocked it tight) in the older hotel rooms. Our hotel room was broken into in Geneva and they got absolutely nothing because we locked the armoire.


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