Zsa Zsa

[Nemo2]

Zsa Zsa Gabor. Dead at 99. What a gal!

 

[audreyh1]

She had been on life support for the previous five years. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zsa_Zsa_Gabor

Ugh!

 

[NW-Bound]

According to the Wikipedia article cited above, she had been partially paralyzed since 2002 after an auto accident. Then, she survived several strokes and underwent multiple surgeries for different causes, including a leg amputation. The last five years were spent with feeding tubes.

It was not smooth sailing for her since the age of 85.

 

[Amethyst]

I think dying sounds preferable to "living" such a nightmare.

According to the Wikipedia article cited above, she had been partially paralyzed since 2002 after an auto accident. Then, she survived several strokes and underwent multiple surgeries for different causes, including a leg amputation. The last five years were spent with feeding tubes.

It was not smooth sailing for her since the age of 85.

 

[NW-Bound]

A person must have a strong will to live to last that long under these conditions.

People like you and me will be gone long before it got so bad.

 

[razztazz]

According to the Wikipedia article cited above, she had been partially paralyzed since 2002 after an auto accident. Then, she survived several strokes and underwent multiple surgeries for different causes, including a leg amputation. The last five years were spent with feeding tubes.

It was not smooth sailing for her since the age of 85.

Makes you wonder why many of us here are so concerned with getting just the right amount of exercise and eating just the right diet. Terrible horrible things can still go wrong and no amount of whole grains or interval training will save you. Fantastic physical resilience will keep that beating and beating and beating. Keeping you prisoner in the ultimate house of horrors.

Merry Christmas Everyone!

 

[NW-Bound]

Makes you wonder why many of us here are so concerned with getting just the right amount of exercise and eating just the right diet. Terrible horrible things can still go wrong...

Things will go wrong at the end no matter what one does. Keeping healthy via diet and exercise serves to delay that end.

And when it finally comes, one's will to live will decide how much he/she can stick it out.

 

[razztazz]

Keeping healthy via diet and exercise serves to delay that end.

You must have spent some time teaching 1st grade. All those things people do to "delay the end" only work when they work and there is no way of knowing if they will work on any one specimen's case. And in fact they might be the cause of death. It's like religion. That's how statistics work. Argue if you want. You can do anything you want. And anybody can grow up to be president.

Again, Merry Christmas

 

[mamadogmamacat]

Well, we seem to have rolled rather quickly off the topic of poor Zsa Zsa. What struck me about her life was not only it's very difficult last years, but her troubled relationships, especially with Conrad Hilton, the father of her only child. How sad.

As far as diet and exercise delaying our ends, that is not something i would ever claim. However, following a reasonable such regimen does make me feel more energetic in the moment.

 

[ls99]

She was a great housekeeper, after every husband kept the house.

A charming fellow Hungarian, the original famous for being famous. Never met her, she traveled in a different league.

 

[ERD50]

She was a great housekeeper, after every husband kept the house.

A charming fellow Hungarian, the original famous for being famous. Never met her, she traveled in a different league.

I'm curious about the impression from a Hungarian. When I was in Budapest for a few weeks, I don't recall ever coming across any reference to the Gabor sisters. Did anyone in Hungary care?

The Magyars certainly adored Liszt (though I really appreciate Bartok), and there was the guy who developed the approach to antiseptic surgery at about the same time as Joseph Lister, Semmelweiss (with a street named after him, IIRC). And Harry Houdini, quite a few others.

Now I see that Eva (2 years younger) died in 1995, but her ending seems to have come quicker. Sounds like Eva had a tough road for many years. Sad.

-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

You must have spent some time teaching 1st grade. All those things people do to "delay the end" only work when they work and there is no way of knowing if they will work on any one specimen's case. And in fact they might be the cause of death. It's like religion. That's how statistics work. Argue if you want. You can do anything you want. And anybody can grow up to be president.

Again, Merry Christmas

Hmm... So, eating/drinking/smoking/being a sloth all one wants makes no difference to one's longevity? That would be nice.

If I take care of myself, I may live till 70. If I didn't, I might have croaked at 50. That's what I call "delaying the end".

So, all my restraints were for naught, and I could just have indulged? And my self-control effort could have even killed me? Interesting!

 

[audreyh1]

As far as diet and exercise delaying our ends, that is not something i would ever claim. However, following a reasonable such regimen does make me feel more energetic in the moment.

Right - it's key for current quality of life. But it's not going to protect you against several sudden or serious health events. Crashes or other accidents, brain tumors, several cancers that healthy lifestyles don't prevent, genetics that cause certain diseases no matter how hard you work at being healthy. In general, being healthier can help quality of life as you age, but it doesn't prevent many diseases and doesn't prevent most accidents.

 

[mamadogmamacat]

Based on observation of very many friends and family over the years, genetics is a much bigger driver on longevity. Now quality of life is a totally different story, and in that is where the value of diet and exercise lays. A very big deal, to my mind, especially as we get older.

 

[mamadogmamacat]

beat me too it, and better said as well

 

[NW-Bound]

We all know people who smoke and do not get lung cancer, and non-smokers who do get it. That's genetics.

But suppose your friend is diagnosed as pre-diabetic, do you suggest that he changes his diet to "delay the end", or just keeps on eating sweets like the luckier people who can get away with it? Is there anything he should do at all, or nothing matters anyhoo?

 

[audreyh1]

Of course is someone is diagnosed with a disease where their health can be improved by lifestyle changes, they would be wise to make those changes if they care about their health and quality of life.

But there are lots of diseases that are not lifestyle related, and accidents can impair health just as seriously as any disease.

 

[NW-Bound]

But there are lots of diseases that are not lifestyle related, and accidents can impair health just as seriously as any disease.

It does not mean one should not do to minimize the risks where one can, trying to "delay the end". Accidents can kill anyone, but that does not mean a daredevil on a motorcycle does not have higher risks than you and I do.

Just because we can be wiped out by an asteroid or just get run over by a bus does not mean we don't bother to run FIRECalc, right?

I don't really know what people are saying here.

I never think that I will live to 100. Not even 80. But if I drink a bottle of booze a day, I am pretty sure that liver cirrhosis will get me before too long. Anyone disagrees with that?

 

[audreyh1]

It does not mean one should not do to minimize the risks where one can, trying to "delay the end".

Just because we can be wiped out by an asteroid or just get run over by a bus does not mean we don't bother to run FIRECalc, right?

I don't really know what people are saying here.

Where is this all or nothing coming from? I'm not saying that.

I think some of us are just pointing out that sometimes you just don't get a break, even if you are "good". So don't expect that all bad outcomes can be avoided. Sure - some can, but not all.

We're not saying don't bother staying healthy because you can't prevent bad outcomes 100%. We just pointing out that you can't prevent bad outcomes 100% by staying healthy.

 

[NW-Bound]

We just pointing out that you can't prevent bad outcomes 100% by staying healthy.

No need to point that out. It's obvious that life is never fair!

Two people eat the same diet. One got high blood pressure, the other doesn't. The unlucky one has to do extra precaution to stay alive. That's all I was saying.

 

[ERD50]

Based on observation of very many friends and family over the years, genetics is a much bigger driver on longevity. Now quality of life is a totally different story, and in that is where the value of diet and exercise lays. A very big deal, to my mind, especially as we get older.

Absolutely. I can't grasp that anyone would deny this. (edit - after seeing the other posts, this is NOT directed at audreyh1)

Who of us cannot look around, and see older people who have remained relatively slim and fit, versus those who are obese and unfit? Who has the better quality of life? One gets up from a chair easily, and can engage in activities, the other struggles and has to give up a lot of things.

I'm not much for exersize, but I do enough to maintain some level of flexibility and fitness, and I could lose a few pounds, but not too bad. I see people far younger than me who can't even do the things I do easily.

Any of us might get hit by the proverbial bus any day, regardless (* but see note below). But until/if that happens, I will put some effort into staying reasonably fit so that I can better enjoy the time I do have left.

NOTE: Sure, getting hit by a bus is largely independent of how fit we may be, but not totally. Many lesser accidents that happen might be prevented, or lessened if one is reasonably fit. I do some stretches and things that mean I'm a little less likely to fall, and if I do fall, I might recover myself and avoid a worse injury. Carrying excess weight makes everything harder, and more dangerous. Even the proverbial bus, a fit person might just get out of the way a millisecond faster, making the injuries less severe.

No guarantees, but on average, a reasonably fit person is likely to have a better quality of life than someone who is way out of shape. I like having the odds in my favor, and will put in some effort to help that. I'm not going to train for marathons or anything (not to get too far adrift, but I suspect that is actually counter-productive), but I do think a small amount of effort towards maintaining some fitness/flexibility has big rewards.

-ERD50

 

[audreyh1]

This may be true. But I've seen a very healthy, fit, slim, active older person get hit with brain cancer and now has to be wheeled around in a wheelchair. So you just can't prevent everything.

Just like accidents - you may be able to prevent most of the ones caused by you. But you don't have much control over the people around you, or equipment failure, or many other things that are in no way your fault.

 

[NW-Bound]

Ask any doctor, and he/she will tell you that treating a patient who is diabetic, has high blood pressure, and is obese is a lot tougher than someone who is otherwise fit and trim. The unfit patients have more or worse side effects from the medicine or treatment, and take a lot longer to recover. The treatment could be for an accidental injury, a surgery, a flu, or what have you.

 

[audreyh1]

Ask any doctor, and he/she will tell you that treating a patient who is diabetic, has high blood pressure, and is obese is a lot tougher than someone who is otherwise fit and trim. The unfit patients have more or worse side effects from the medicine or treatment, and take a lot longer to recover. The treatment could be for an accidental injury, a surgery, a flu, or what have you.

So?

I'm not saying that's not true. But in some cases it simply may not matter if the disease or injury is bad enough. Healthy people are fallible too.

 

[NW-Bound]

OK. I give up.

It sounds like a lot of people want to use the fact that life is inherently unfair to avoid doing things that they can to improve their odds. I guess it is human nature to avoid doing the hard things, by claiming that it does not matter.