Breaking Point Reached: Bye Bye to Windows

[ejman]

+1 I have recently been trying Linux Mint 18.3 Cinnamon installed side by side with Windows on my Lenovo Laptop. I've installed and reinstalled three times now.

First install failed.

2nd install successful, but Wine did not successfully run any Windows programs I tried (PDF24, LaCie USB security, and eMclient - for email). Several others also woldn't work. These programs were tried because Linux doesn't have available suitable (to my liking) alternative programs - even PDF. Ended up with an online PDF creator on Firefox (somehow you can use Libre office?). Had several freezes and then failure to boot.

Third installation was successful and then immediately failed after updating on wired connection (you can look this issue up on the internet). I must mention that in all installations - wifi failed to work properly and had to wire connect to correct the issue. It did not correct on third installation after updates were downloaded and installed - so uninstalled for third time.

First install was from downloaded software off USB stick. 2nd and 3rd install was from purchased CD from a Linux software distributor. I really wanted to see Linux succeed as I'm having BSOD reboots on the Lenovo since the last update of Windows 10. I just bought an ASUS laptop that went BSOD reboot after the Windows 10 update right out of the box (after installing programs I've used for years now on old Lenovo laptops). Can't find the culprit causing the BSOD following many suggestions on the internet (this is a common problem with Windows 10 updates). Linux always touts itself as a stable OS, but sadly my evaluation is that it really needs to focus on allowing Windows programs to run seemlessly - which I was not able to do successfully.

I've always carried laptops for business for decades and consider myself fairly capable to keep them in working order. The recent Windows 10 update BSOD and my poor evaluation of Linux Mint - leaves me still searching for simple OS that has access to Windows style software (and not having to settle for compromises, or take the long way around the block).

Assuming the live USB with linux try out works OK with your hardware, I think about the easiest way to try the Linux approach on a real world basis is to buy an inexpensive small SSD for $30-$40, replace original HD in the laptop/ Desktop, load linux mint (or your favorite distro) and use it for a while. Small SSD's work just fine as the install is very small compared to Windows. If you don't like it you still have your original HD with Windows, nothing has been reconfigured and you can plop the original HD back in if Linux is not to your liking. The SSD then can be used for backups or whatever.

 

[bjorn2bwild]

........ I think about the easiest way to try the Linux approach on a real world basis is to buy an inexpensive small SSD for $30-$40, replace original HD in the laptop/ Desktop, load linux mint (or your favorite distro) and use it for a while. Small SSD's work just fine as the install is very small compared to Windows. If you don't like it you still have your original HD with Windows, nothing has been reconfigured and you can plop the original HD back in if Linux is not to your liking. The SSD then can be used for backups or whatever.

Yes, I use this approach too.
An added convenience is to use a hard drive extension cable to combine the data and power cables into one plug. On a desktop, the cable can be looped through a back panel - makes it super easy to switch drives, plus extra fast boot-ups with the SSD.

 

[fritz]

Assuming the live USB with linux try out works OK with your hardware, I think about the easiest way to try the Linux approach on a real world basis is to buy an inexpensive small SSD for $30-$40, replace original HD in the laptop/ Desktop, load linux mint (or your favorite distro) and use it for a while. Small SSD's work just fine as the install is very small compared to Windows. If you don't like it you still have your original HD with Windows, nothing has been reconfigured and you can plop the original HD back in if Linux is not to your liking. The SSD then can be used for backups or whatever.

I don't see myself or many others taking apart their laptops to install an SSD (if it's even possible), but maybe an external drive for the Linux OS? Installing Linux in a Windows virtual box would also work, but requires around 4GB ram if you have a lot of stuff loaded on your system (although some say 1GB ram would do). Bootable USB was awful - slow and just a visual of what you'd get with a full installation. Both my current laptops have SSD drives with more than enough ram/free space to side-by-side install Linux.

My point was that installing Linux Mint side by side had requirements that most computer users would not be able to accomplish. Disk partitioning and removal, BIOS changes to disable/enable Windows secure boot. Uninstalling was even more difficult and ubuntu resides in your BIOS after uninstalling side by side in the primary boot selection. Must get into BIOS and move Windows to primary selection or computer will still boot with a messed up ubuntu boot select (where you can type "exit" to get to Windows boot).

All this being said - I still found the Linux OS somewhat unstable (corrupted itself updating software right after 3rd installation). WIFI had to be fixed with each installation, although it was working on the Wiindows side of the laptop. Even the bootable USB had WIFI issues that had to be fixed.

Many of the Windows software programs I utilize are not available in Linux or did not run in Linux Wine successfully. These are what I consider to be basic software programs like PDF creators. Finding alternatives was a real PITA (some were clumsy and poorly maintained), and I felt that in the long and short of it - was not worth it.

I really wanted it to be worth it as I am worried that not too far off, we'll be stuck in a computer world similar to Cable services where you're restricted to proprietary software bought from their own stores. Look at current Google Chrome laptops, or Windows 10S laptops.... Scary!

 

[samclem]

I've thought about buying a used low-end desktop just to try a Linux installation. Maybe that's the most risk-free way to go.


I have the impression that Linux is best for folks who enjoy trying new hacks to enhance performance. They like to install new versions of their BIOS. They enjoy OS updates that promise better ways of doing things, and are willing to have the fun of trying to get their software to work on the new OS--or just try some new software. I am >exactly< the opposite: I loathe every new version of Office and the "improvements" the Wizards of Redmond have devised. I already know how to use the program, >don't< hide the functions under new tabs, etc. Respect your users/customers, don't arrogantly assume you know best.
And, where did File Manager go?

 

[ejman]

I don't see myself or many others taking apart their laptops to install an SSD (if it's even possible), but maybe an external drive for the Linux OS? Installing Linux in a Windows virtual box would also work, but requires around 4GB ram if you have a lot of stuff loaded on your system (although some say 1GB ram would do). Bootable USB was awful - slow and just a visual of what you'd get with a full installation. Both my current laptops have SSD drives with more than enough ram/free space to side-by-side install Linux.

My point was that installing Linux Mint side by side had requirements that most computer users would not be able to accomplish. Disk partitioning and removal, BIOS changes to disable/enable Windows secure boot. Uninstalling was even more difficult and ubuntu resides in your BIOS after uninstalling side by side in the primary boot selection. Must get into BIOS and move Windows to primary selection or computer will still boot with a messed up ubuntu boot select (where you can type "exit" to get to Windows boot).

All this being said - I still found the Linux OS somewhat unstable (corrupted itself updating software right after 3rd installation). WIFI had to be fixed with each installation, although it was working on the Wiindows side of the laptop. Even the bootable USB had WIFI issues that had to be fixed.

Many of the Windows software programs I utilize are not available in Linux or did not run in Linux Wine successfully. These are what I consider to be basic software programs like PDF creators. Finding alternatives was a real PITA (some were clumsy and poorly maintained), and I felt that in the long and short of it - was not worth it.

I really wanted it to be worth it as I am worried that not too far off, we'll be stuck in a computer world similar to Cable services where you're restricted to proprietary software bought from their own stores. Look at current Google Chrome laptops, or Windows 10S laptops.... Scary!

Well, clearly Linux is not for you. I can only relate my personal experience where I've installed Linux mint (XFCE) on three computers. My old HP desktop, my wife's HP Laptop and my Asus laptop. I installed Linux in the HP desktop as dual boot with it's ancient Windows XP, My wife's laptop was dual boot with Windows 10 on the original HD (subsequently replaced with single boot Linux SSD) and My Asus laptop where I also installed Linux on an SSD replacing the original HD with Win 10). I did not have any of the problems you refer to but again, I've only had installation experience with the three computers I mentioned.



Frankly replacing the HD on these two laptops was easy peasy a few screws of the back the SSD's just pops in and done. I don't recall having to make any BIOS changes but it's been a while since I switched over. But I certainly understand that may be a bridge too far for many.

 

[easysurfer]

I've been dabbling around with Linux on and off the past few years to see how doable for me switching over from Windows might be. Finally feel good enough to move over (well mostly) before end of Window 7 security support in 2020.

I'm not a big fan of using Wine nor dual booting. Have tested a few programs I thought about using in Wine but they only half worked. Dual booting, I'm afraid I'd do something silly like while in Linux, mistakenly reformat my Windows area.

Did something kind of cool today. I've been deciding on which distro to use for the future. Came down to between Linux Lite or Peppermint OS. Decided to go with Peppermint. I had my best laptop with Linux Lite installed. Had a test laptop with Peppermint installed. But was pretty straight forward getting Peppermint on the good laptop. Restored from an image of the test one to the good laptop. Works without issue. Don't have to worry about drivers or anything specific to each laptop (unlike if this was Windows with drivers specific to a make and model).

Still drinking that Kool-aid .

 

[ejman]

I've thought about buying a used low-end desktop just to try a Linux installation. Maybe that's the most risk-free way to go.


I have the impression that Linux is best for folks who enjoy trying new hacks to enhance performance. They like to install new versions of their BIOS. They enjoy OS updates that promise better ways of doing things, and are willing to have the fun of trying to get their software to work on the new OS--or just try some new software. I am >exactly< the opposite: I loathe every new version of Office and the "improvements" the Wizards of Redmond have devised. I already know how to use the program, >don't< hide the functions under new tabs, etc. Respect your users/customers, don't arrogantly assume you know best.
And, where did File Manager go?

I'm certainly no techie (68 yr old ex bean counter) But the wonderful thing I've found about Linux is that I don't have to do any updates I don't want to. The software presents a list of updates periodically and a description of what it is they do. One is free to apply them ( a simple click) or not. I've been using linux since 2014 ( when XP support ceased) and I've yet to install a new BIOS version and everything works fine on all three of my computers with Linux. Frankly the only problem I have with Linux is that nobody makes a decent Tax software package that I know of. All the majors (turbotax, Tax act, H&R) have Windows and Mac versions but no Linux.

 

[ERD50]

I've thought about buying a used low-end desktop just to try a Linux installation. Maybe that's the most risk-free way to go.


I have the impression that Linux is best for folks who enjoy trying new hacks to enhance performance. They like to install new versions of their BIOS. They enjoy OS updates that promise better ways of doing things, and are willing to have the fun of trying to get their software to work on the new OS--or just try some new software. I am >exactly< the opposite: I loathe every new version of Office and the "improvements" the Wizards of Redmond have devised. I already know how to use the program, >don't< hide the functions under new tabs, etc. Respect your users/customers, don't arrogantly assume you know best.
And, where did File Manager go?

Some Linux users are like that (some Windows and Mac users are like that). I'm much more like you describe yourself, I don't want to fight all this stuff, and that is why I run Linux.

I've had Xubuntu 14.04 (that release # is YY.MM) on this machine for 4 years, and I just recently installed the 18.04 update. And the main reason I decided to install the updated version is because so little had changed for me, the user. My desktop, looks and acts essentially identical to my old install. I configured everything to be right where it was on my previous version. The install was very simple, and I just pointed it to my old "home" directory, and I was "home".

There were a few minor programs/utilities not supported, but it was pretty easy to find a replacement. Nothing major.

I run the security and bug fixing updates once in a while, maybe every week or two. It is set to give me a pop-up reminder, but I can just click 'later' if I don't want to do it now. It never forces an update on me. And most updates don't require a re-boot. A few minutes, and you are all set, and you can work on it during the updates.

No OS is perfect. T-Al will surely find issues with Apple, and/or with Linux. I've used all three, mostly Apple, and I really prefer Linux. I think the Apple problems bugged me the most, since they do control the HW and the SW, there's just no excuse for some of their brain-dead decisions.

As far as the install issues that fritz reported, I'm similar in experience with ejman. I've installed Linux on ~ 6 machines, with no big hiccups. It helps to check out the hardware on a Linux forum, there are some configs that aren't well supported (like wireless cards that require an unsupported proprietary driver), but even on a few machines that I was given to install Linux (rather than me choosing the HW), that hasn't been an issue for me. I have had to connect wired Ethernet during install, that's pretty common. The often proprietary WL drivers get downloaded later in the install, and I think require a reboot to take effect, so for the install you need to be wired. It's a catch-22, so we just deal with it. Not a big deal. Never had to go back to wired after that.

Again, no OS is perfect.

-ERD50

 

[fritz]

I've thought about buying a used low-end desktop just to try a Linux installation. Maybe that's the most risk-free way to go.


I have the impression that Linux is best for folks who enjoy trying new hacks to enhance performance. They like to install new versions of their BIOS. They enjoy OS updates that promise better ways of doing things, and are willing to have the fun of trying to get their software to work on the new OS--or just try some new software. I am >exactly< the opposite: I loathe every new version of Office and the "improvements" the Wizards of Redmond have devised. I already know how to use the program, >don't< hide the functions under new tabs, etc. Respect your users/customers, don't arrogantly assume you know best.
And, where did File Manager go?

I would agree, although Linux likes to state that they are easy to use, relatively simple to install, and trouble/virus free? for the most part. I have always seen Linux folks as tech happy in-the-know computer junkies that love toiling away with software challenges. I came to like understanding how things work and solving application issues, but after that it's seen as a PITA that I'd rather avoid.

I've had MS office for a long time, but haven't installed in on my last three computers. Switched to Open Ofc, then Libre when they split off from Open Ofc. I don't update very often. Even stopped using CCleaner since Avast bought it and updates it monthly - to sell products. Started using BleachBit.

If all one does is surf the web and email, with some occasional office documentation - Chrome (a Linux OS variant) is safe, reliable, inexpensive and works well. I like it.

I don't even store anything on my computers. All personal data is stored on secured thumb drives (reason for using LaCie public private). There is an open source version Veracrypt portable that works on Linux (LaCie won't), but it's awkward to use and LaCie is so much better/easier.

Good luck with the Linux experiment. I think it might be a better choice to buy a new external SSD. At least you'll have a nice portable drive to reuse when you're through experimenting.

FYI - the original zdnet Linux article mentioned in this thread led to a link for the latest most popular Linux offering - Linux Manjaro. Here's the link. Up for a challenge?

https://www.zdnet.com/article/whats-the-most-popular-linux-of-them-all/

 

[WestUniversity]

After some blue-screen crashes on my HP Envy 17" laptop, and hours spent solving issues (e.g. failure to sleep, restore points problems, intermittent fingerprint reader failure, things stop working after upgrades, occasional very slow performance. etc.) I finally thought about switching to a Mac.

I realized that I was stupid not to consider that years ago. I don't play games and I disabled the touchscreen. The things that bug me most about Windows (constant upgrades, driver problems, inconsistent user interfaces, antivirus apps) are not present or are less of an issue with Macs. The novel-writing software I use is better on the Mac.

So, I'll probably switch soon.

I gave up on PC’s in 2012. Since then I’m all in the Apple ecosphere. My 2012 MacBook Pro is built like a tank. I recently upgraded my RAM and am about to upgrade to a solid state drive. It’s the most trouble free laptop I’ve owned and don’t anticipate ever going back to PC’s...

 

[easysurfer]

I would agree, although Linux likes to state that they are easy to use, relatively simple to install, and trouble/virus free? for the most part. I have always seen Linux folks as tech happy in-the-know computer junkies that love toiling away with software challenges. I came to like understanding how things work and solving application issues, but after that it's seen as a PITA that I'd rather avoid.

....

I think Linux to Windows comparison is similar to those who like driving a stick shift vs automatic. But Windows isn't so automatic anymore like the days of Win XP and 7 as you don't have control of what [-]changes [/-] features will get added whether you want them or not. Plus, not to mention all the updates that can be a PITA in itself.

For me, I'm approaching as what I want as a primary system and secondary. Doesn't have to be all or none but the right tool for the job. Some things I'm going to keep on a Windows machine.

For example, I have this DYMO label Maker that prints out labels that I don't think doesn't have a Linux application. I'm not going to not use that nor try to figure out how to get that to work on Linux but just hook that up to a Windows machine. On the other hand, a few month ago, I was trying to record something streamed on my Windows computer. Couldn't find a good program despite willing to buy a program. Ones I tried couldn't get the audio, video in sync. Or I'd have to buy a powerhouse PC to get that done. Instead, turned to Linux where some author made a program to record what's played on the computer. Works fine, all free and open source... The right tool for the job .

But I do see your point, as I have zero desire to learn how to drive a stick shift.

 

[Dash man]

Took me years to convince DW to switch to a MacBook Pro. She had used Windows before and was always complaining about all the issues that she had with her laptop. I finally just bought her a MacBook Pro and insisted she try it for a week. She hasn’t picked up her Windows laptop since.

 

[fritz]

I think Linux to Windows comparison is similar to those who like driving a stick shift vs automatic. But Windows isn't so automatic anymore like the days of Win XP and 7 as you don't have control of what [-]changes [/-] features will get added whether you want them or not. Plus, not to mention all the updates that can be a PITA in itself.

For me, I'm approaching as what I want as a primary system and secondary. Doesn't have to be all or none but the right tool for the job. Some things I'm going to keep on a Windows machine.

For example, I have this DYMO label Maker that prints out labels that I don't think doesn't have a Linux application. I'm not going to not use that nor try to figure out how to get that to work on Linux but just hook that up to a Windows machine. On the other hand, a few month ago, I was trying to record something streamed on my Windows computer. Couldn't find a good program despite willing to buy a program. Ones I tried couldn't get the audio, video in sync. Or I'd have to buy a powerhouse PC to get that done. Instead, turned to Linux where some author made a program to record what's played on the computer. Works fine, all free and open source... The right tool for the job .

But I do see your point, as I have zero desire to learn how to drive a stick shift.

I learned how to drive using a stick shift Chevrolet Corvair Monza. Once you've learned - it's like riding a bicycle (you never forget).

As mentioned, I've tried Linux ubuntu OS in the past, and my latest attempt was because I've run into issues with Windows 10's most recent updates (BSOD). I've had issues with all of the updates, but the BSOD is new. Others are experiencing this as well, according to internet searches (and this thread).

I'm also not happy with where I think personal computing is going for the average user in the future (controlled by +/- three giant companies that force you to use proprietary hardware/software similar to the Cable companies. Windows 10S was probably Microsoft's 1st shot across the bow in this area. They've really run roughshod over Windows 10 OS (their last Windows software offering?), and don't seem to care how they treat their customers - no flexibility and complete control.

Was really disappointed to run into installation issues with Linux Mint Cinnamon 18.3 (especially the wifi one which apparently is a common issue when searched) - especially since I utilized a CD version from a Linux Distributor on the 2nd and 3rd installs. Nothing like failure or installation issues right out of the box. Both current laptops are more than capable of running Linux software alongside Windows 10. I was also disappointed in Wine's inability to successfully run any of the Windows software I normally use. None of it is complicated stuff - PDF, email client, and security stuff. Citi virtual account number software, which used to work on Linux, is now called garbage on Wine reviews). Add to this the lack of available Linux software to replace them, or the alternatives that were not to my liking, and I'm left still looking for a Linux type of replacement for Windows 10 that will run just about any Windows developed software. I still have hope that one's in the works.

 

[easysurfer]

I learned how to drive using a stick shift Chevrolet Corvair Monza. Once you've learned - it's like riding a bicycle (you never forget).

As mentioned, I've tried Linux ubuntu OS in the past, and my latest attempt was because I've run into issues with Windows 10's most recent updates (BSOD). I've had issues with all of the updates, but the BSOD is new. Others are experiencing this as well, according to internet searches (and this thread).

I'm also not happy with where I think personal computing is going for the average user in the future (controlled by +/- three giant companies that force you to use proprietary hardware/software similar to the Cable companies. Windows 10S was probably Microsoft's 1st shot across the bow in this area. They've really run roughshod over Windows 10 OS (their last Windows software offering?), and don't seem to care how they treat their customers - no flexibility and complete control.

Was really disappointed to run into installation issues with Linux Mint Cinnamon 18.3 (especially the wifi one which apparently is a common issue when searched) - especially since I utilized a CD version from a Linux Distributor on the 2nd and 3rd installs. Nothing like failure or installation issues right out of the box. Both current laptops are more than capable of running Linux software alongside Windows 10. I was also disappointed in Wine's inability to successfully run any of the Windows software I normally use. None of it is complicated stuff - PDF, email client, and security stuff. Citi virtual account number software, which used to work on Linux, is now called garbage on Wine reviews). Add to this the lack of available Linux software to replace them, or the alternatives that were not to my liking, and I'm left still looking for a Linux type of replacement for Windows 10 that will run just about any Windows developed software. I still have hope that one's in the works.

Ah..an old Chevy Monza. I remember that car.

My approach with Linux was to try a distro to play around a bit, then put way, they try again another day. Been doing that on and off past few years. The first few attempts were frustrating. First distro I tried was Puppy but I couldn't figure out how to save files. Then I tried Ubuntu but the distro I had didn't install. Then I tried Linux Mint but that was too slow for the older laptop that I had and at that time, a simple task like creating a shortcut on the desktop seemed too frustrating for me at least, to figure out. Anything new takes some trial and error. I like the suggestions of using a test computer to poke around a bit instead of the one you use all the time.

 

[fritz]

Ah..an old Chevy Monza. I remember that car.

My approach with Linux was to try a distro to play around a bit, then put way, they try again another day. Been doing that on and off past few years. The first few attempts were frustrating. First distro I tried was Puppy but I couldn't figure out how to save files. Then I tried Ubuntu but the distro I had didn't install. Then I tried Linux Mint but that was too slow for the older laptop that I had and at that time, a simple task like creating a shortcut on the desktop seemed too frustrating for me at least, to figure out. Anything new takes some trial and error. I like the suggestions of using a test computer to poke around a bit instead of the one you use all the time.

The Lenovo laptop I installed Linux Mint alongside Windows, was the older of the two we own. If I liked the Linux mint OS (and I was motivated to make it work, given the Windows issues I've experienced lately along with the inevitable Windows future) - I would have removed Windows 10 and moved forward with the Linux learning curve. I understand that I have decades of Windows experience, and it's going to take some time to get into the Linux world. It's just with all the issues, and the lack of software availability (and Wine's poor performance) - I told myself why bother with this one. I'm disappointed, but will not give up my search for a replacement.

 

[easysurfer]

The Lenovo laptop I installed Linux Mint alongside Windows, was the older of the two we own. If I liked the Linux mint OS (and I was motivated to make it work, given the Windows issues I've experienced lately along with the inevitable Windows future) - I would have removed Windows 10 and moved forward with the Linux learning curve. I understand that I have decades of Windows experience, and it's going to take some time to get into the Linux world. It's just with all the issues, and the lack of software availability (and Wine's poor performance) - I told myself why bother with this one. I'm disappointed, but will not give up my search for a replacement.

I say, try different distros until you see one that fits vs Win 10 to see what fits best for you. For example, if you have an older computer, that might point you towards a lighter weight distro. If you want a distro that is even more Windows like than Mint, try out something like Linux Lite. I had version 3.8 on my laptop and there were times I forgot I was on a Linux machine. I have since though decided to go with Peppermint as that's a bit more "Linux like" but still prety easy to use. For me, I'm not trying to fully make Linux like Windows.

 

[ERD50]

... and Wine's poor performance) - I told myself why bother with this one. ...

I basically gave up on WINE. It does work well in some cases, but I wouldn't depend on it. Didn't bother with it when I installed Xubuntu 18.04.

Most people can do just fine with the Linux and cross-platform software. If you really need SW that doesn't play well with WINE, then solo Linux isn't for you (you could use dual boot, or reserve a separate machine or drive with Windows). It's never "one size fits all".

-ERD50

 

[fritz]

I say, try different distros until you see one that fits vs Win 10 to see what fits best for you. For example, if you have an older computer, that might point you towards a lighter weight distro. If you want a distro that is even more Windows like than Mint, try out something like Linux Lite. I had version 3.8 on my laptop and there were times I forgot I was on a Linux machine. I have since though decided to go with Peppermint as that's a bit more "Linux like" but still prety easy to use. For me, I'm not trying to fully make Linux like Windows.

Since retiring 9 years ago, laptop usage is mostly personal as part-time consulting work has wound down and pretty much stopped this year. My Lenovo is just over 2 yrs old, and has 2GB ram and 64GB SSD. Quick booting SSD and meets my needs. New one is 4GB and 64GB. Don't do any real work anymore. Nothing real personal stored on drives. Lenovo has +/- 20GB available for side-loading, and I could reduce C drive (Windows) to a lower capacity if I determined that the Linux OS selected would allow me to achieve my goal - an OS that operates reliably like Chrome, but will allow Windows created software of my choosing to be installed and used with no hassle (Chrome uses Wine).

 

[bberris]

pssst....Chromebook

edit: doesn't look as if there are 17" CB. Have to settle for 15"

Can't you just install Chrome OS on the existing laptop?

 

[explanade]

That was me a month ago.

I'm hoping the switch will be no more difficult than moving to a new Windows machine.

Here's another example of a Windows problem. My HP has a fingerprint scanner, which is a great feature. However, every week or so, it stops working, and I need to reboot. Every time I reboot, Windows has trouble assigning my drive Z to a cloud drive. Even though I tell it to remember my credentials, it doesn't.

With a Mac, the company that writes the OS is the same one that built the scanner hardware. I'm guessing a similar problem doesn't exist.

Apple doesn't build the fingerprint scanner.

Like most tech companies, it uses contract manufacturers but often demand high specs.

For instance, it's difficult to find a Windows laptop with a good trackpad while Mac laptops all have very good trackpads.

Apple specs the component and then writes the drivers for them themselves and tests them.

My HP laptop has a trackpad which I don't bother using. I plug in a wireless mouse. The driver is from Synaptics and it's old, like 10 years old on Windows 10.

However, I wouldn't go with the fingerprint scanner on Mac laptops. There are complaints about the Apple MacBook Pro models with the TouchID reader.

I have a 5 year old MacBook Pro without the TouchID reader. Because of complaints about the keyboards in the models with TouchID, I won't upgrade until they come out with a new design -- though I have no great need to upgrade now.

 

[easysurfer]

Shall I Stay or Shall I Go?

Over the past week or two, I've moved several steps closer in my pursuit to move from Windows to Linux but must admit, I do have some cold feet.

I think will come down to the lesser of two inconveniences.

Actually, I will end up having computers with both. But was 100% certain Linux as my primary. Now about 95% sure.

 

[ejman]

Over the past week or two, I've moved several steps closer in my pursuit to move from Windows to Linux but must admit, I do have some cold feet.

I think will come down to the lesser of two inconveniences.

Actually, I will end up having computers with both. But was 100% certain Linux as my primary. Now about 95% sure.

Well, if your switching to Linux will result in TEOTWAWKI then maybe you shouldn't do it!

 

[Kelor]

https://www.barstoolsports.com/dmv/...-seconds/?_branch_match_id=493049117526219594

When he said he was done with Microsoft, he wasn't kidding. Wow.

"A group of thieves walked into a Fresno Apple Store, snagged several laptops worth $27,000 and ran out the door while pushing people over:"

 

[easysurfer]

Well, if your switching to Linux will result in TEOTWAWKI then maybe you shouldn't do it!

Made me look up the meaning .

Almost bought a cheap computer for about $100 with Win 10 today for the held over programs. Instead, ordered a cheap port replicator four less than $10 for my cheap laptop that has Win 10 installed.

This way, I can put Win 10 on probation before 2020 nears. If somehow I fall in love with Win 10 (don't think so), then I'll reconsider. But actually from what I've learned with Linux thus far, I like using that a lot more. Though there will be some sacrifices, mainly losing the familiarity of some programs.

 

[Camas Lilly]

No comparison

Hands down Mac. If you have never owned one, you probably don't understand. I went from PCs to Mac. I am so annoyed at the remaining PC's in our household. So much maintenance, antivirus, repairs, slowness, etc, etc. I've been a Mac user for over 15 years now.

Macs are virtually maintenance and problem free. Nothing to do but play. The extra $ is worth it and you will come out ahead in the long run.