ER religious preference

[indymom]

Azanon,
The quotes were to differentiate a certain type of retirement, distinguishing it from the activity of Martha. Retirement could also be leaving the group or even going to sleep.
Don't know too much about hardcore Southern Baptists. BUT am inclined to get cranky about calling what women do who are not employed "not working" (pesky defining quotes again). Raising children, home maintenence, care of the elderly, etc.

 

[azanon]

But I don't think there is anything wrong with spending your golden years in Margaritaville if you so desire, maybe I'm a heritic for that opinion!

Neither do I. But I think that belief is inconsistent with christainity.

Azanon,

The quotes were to differentiate a certain type of retirement, distinguishing it from the activity of Martha. Retirement could also be leaving the group or even going to sleep.

I'm not sure exactly what kind of retirement was meant. I'm only for sure what it didn't mean; the type of retirement that's the subject of this forum.

Don't know too much about hardcore Southern Baptists. BUT am inclined to get cranky about calling what women do who are not employed "not working" (pesky defining quotes again). Raising children, home maintenence, care of the elderly, etc.

So why even bother with this forum? If everything can be argued to be work, then what are we doing here. Yes, techinicallly speaking, even lifting your arm is work. Certainly, doing parental duities can be argued to be work.

Again, i'm only speaking generally so lets get back to generalities. My perception of the bible is that the idea of going from "work" (speaking generally) to just "not pulling your weight" in some way in this world, is unbiblical.

Again, i'm no christain, so I dont have to struggle with this, but IMHO christains highly focused on retirement just for the sake of sleeping in late, playing golf, et al might need to reevaluate their spirituality.

"Work", for a christain, is a way of life. A christain's job ends the day he dies, that much is clear from the bible.

 

[laurence]

eh, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there Az, as Christians we have a duty, but that doesn't mean we have to have a 9 to 5er till we drop. The Bible talks about being good stewards of the land, being good to your neighbor, honoring thy mother and father, etc. There is no commandment on working until you die. The golden rule is do unto others....and Jesus said if you don't remember anything else, remember to love one another. So, yeah there are duties, but a regular job is not one of them. Now the rub comes with, "easier for a camel to fit through the eye of a needle than a rich man get to heaven". The Bible is really talking about a fixation on material things, reward in this life, gluttony etc. I think ERing and LBYM is actually more Godly, since you aren't being a mega consumer worrying about appearance, driving a Hummer etc.

 

[Indymomguest]

In regard to Mary's retirement:
It certainly can be the type of retirement concerned with here. She wasn't employed wass she?

As far as everything being regarded as work, that's partly my point. There have been times when having employment was a piece of cake for me. The forum is about retirement from a job, mostly. Other than that, work is in the eye of the beholder. Jesus remarked approvingly on the lilies that weren't toiling or spinning. I do believe you have OD'd on Protestant work ethic.

 

[azanon]

I do believe you have OD'd on Protestant work ethic.

Contrare. You're the one bound by the shackles of your religion.

I do exactly as I please.

 

[Indymomguest]

So am I.

 

[azanon]

Laurence, my reference was to Adam's curse to "work and toil the field" until he died, admittingly paraphrasing that.  God was saying that's the way its going to be.  So he doesnt want us building towers to heaven any more than he wants us to not "work and toil the field".

Maybe i'm recalling Genesis 3 or thereabouts wrong, but i'm pretty sure that's what it said.

Again, not my problem though.

 

[laurence]

Az,

Again, I can't speak to those who take the Bible in a strictly literal/fundamentalist bent, but those of us who read it as "Truth", not the literal truth understand that to be a reference to our self awareness, and transition from hunter/gatherer to agrarian, but I don't want to get into a debate with fundamentalists on this board! The thing is, the Bible is a time line, and there were a lot of things God's chosen people had to do before the coming of Christ that they/we don't have to do any more (like avoid shellfish and pork). Jesus was the perfect sacrifice on the cross, the price has been paid for Adam's sin. One has only to accept him.....

There are branches of Christianity that feel different, my 7th day Adventist friend still follows all the Old Testament rules, for example. But I think what you are getting at is you feel it's foolish to believe in something you can't physically touch or see. I totally respect your position, as it was mine for a part of my life, too. Obviously, I am willing to chat about my faith with anyone, but just as obviously, this isn't the forum for it, and I apoloogize if I've offended/annoyed anyone of a different faith or no faith at all.

 

[BUM]

That gets back to why i started this thread. For various reasons, one i mentioned initially, and one you just mentioned, I would think that a "hardcore" christain would not be driven to retirement.

I know christainity cause i was one for 20 years, and from that viewpoint I am pretty confident to "retire" for the sole purpose of not having to work anymore would not glorify God. God either stated directly or implied several times in the bible he does not look favorably on laziness or slothfulness. At best, you could only trade one job for another (such as for voluntarily work to glorify him). Either way, we're supposed to work and toil the earth until we die (see Genesis), or at least that's what Jehovah of the OT says.

Dont think so. Its "Do Good Works" not "Do Work Good (or until you die).

BUM

 

[Zipper]

I think all religions are a kind of mental disease inflicted upon young children when they have not yet developed a defence.

The religious contamination is slowly being eradicated in Canada, Europe and Asia as the masses rebel against the force fed nonsense that "my god is the greatest".

Only in America, and the Middle East are the fundamentalists still infecting the young.

Think about it.

The world would be a much safer place without the rabid religious wingnuts all trying to outdo each other.

 

[frayne]

I think all religions are a kind of mental disease inflicted upon young children when they have not yet developed a defence.

The religious contamination is slowly being eradicated in Canada, Europe and Asia as the masses rebel against the force fed nonsense that "my god is the greatest".

Only in America, and the Middle East are the fundamentalists still infecting the young.

Think about it.

The world would be a much safer place without the rabid religious wingnuts all trying to outdo each other.

Amen brother.

 

[laurence]

Zipper, I'm sensing some negative energy eminating from your post.

Religeous intolerance is bad, but you can't overcome intolerance with more intolerance.....

 

[homestead]

I can't condemn what zipper is saying I used to think the same way.
Science was my god for most of my life as an engineer. It seemed like the best source of truth in the world.
But I got tired of wondering why so many people had this unshakeable
faith. I had to find out for myself first hand. So I read the account in the new testament of the 4 eyewitnesses to Jesus and his life. (the gospels) Ended up reading the
entire new testament and came to the point where I decided this was how I wanted to live my life. THEN God became very real to me and changed my life.
Faith must come first.

"For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the LORD, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope. Then you will call upon Me and go and pray to Me, and I will listen to you. And you will seek Me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart." Jeremiah 29

 

[Michael]

Either way, we're supposed to work and toil the earth until we die (see Genesis)

The ground was cursed because of Adam's sin, but Christ came to set us free.

Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Galatians 3:13 KJV

A Christian's only duty is to obey Lord Jesus.  We have only one Lord, one Master.  This is His command:

A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.  John 13:34 KJV

We work to provide for our families, because we love them.  We do not work because we have been cursed.

 

[Michael]

christains highly focused on retirement just for the sake of sleeping in late, playing golf, et al might need to reevaluate their spirituality.

I agree.

Financial independence is a worthy goal, as the Bible commands us:

Art thou called being a servant? care not for it: but if thou mayest be made free, use it rather.
1 Corinthians 7:21KJV

IOW, do not voluntarily be a servant to other men. We have but one Lord, one Master. Our goal is not to be free from servitude to men solely to play golf, but rather to devote full time to our Lord's service.

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Mark 16:15 KJV

 

[wabmester]

The religious contamination is slowly being eradicated in Canada, Europe and Asia as the masses rebel against the force fed nonsense that "my god is the greatest".

Only in America, and the Middle East are the fundamentalists still infecting the young.

Hey, maybe we could start a new country with a clear separation between government and religion. Oh, wait. We already have that here in America.

I have a feeling that if we banned religion, we'd just replace it with nationalism. And, yes, my country really is better than your country

 

[homestead]

It saddens me to see Americans use their freedom of speech to
attack another freedom, freedom of religion. Is one of these freedoms greater than the other?
To be used to attack the other?
They do this even though they know that one of the main reasons people
came to this county was because of religious persecutions.
Don't they realize what they are doing is also a form of religious persecution?
Thankfully the founding father understood the need to define these freedoms for
speech and religion in the bill of rights and constitution.
History shows these were men of faith.
Please think about this before you attack the religious beliefs of others.
I used to do this myself years ago before I became a Christian and I thought it was fun
to ridicule believers. It probably was stemmed in my insecurity of not knowing if God was real.
Only today do I realize how harmful this was to others.

 

[sgeeeee]

It saddens me to see Americans use their freedom of speech to
attack another freedom, freedom of religion.   Is one of these freedoms greater than the other?
To be used to attack the other?
They do this even though they know that one of the main reasons people
came to this county was because of religious persecutions.
Don't they realize what they are doing is also a form of religious persecution?
Thankfully the founding father understood the need to define these freedoms for
speech and religion in the bill of rights and constitution.
History shows these were men of faith.
Please think about this before you attack the religious beliefs of others.
I used to do this myself years ago before I became a Christian and I thought it was fun
to ridicule believers.  It probably was stemmed in my insecurity of not knowing if God was real.
Only today do I realize how harmful this was to others.

A belief that Christianity's god is not the one and only god is a religious belief too. Declaring that this belief is an attack on religious freedom is an attack on religious freedom.

 

[wabmester]

It saddens me to see Americans use their freedom of speech to
attack another freedom, freedom of religion.

Oh, brother. This is an internet discussion board. If you feel that you are being persecuted, there is an easy way to flee persecution.

Turn off your computer. Ready ... now!

And last I checked, those who shared your beliefs were in the majority in this country. Persecution shouldn't be your worry. Tyrrany of the majority should be.

 

[John Galt]

Yep, just say "No". Personally I value the First
Amendment just as much as others; pretty much
sacred ground to me. Thus, to quote my good friend
Pat Benetar, "Hit me with your best shot; fire away!"
Hey, whatever happened to her.? I thought she was HOT!

JG

 

[hocus]

Does it not often seem to be the case that the threads we try the hardest to shut down end up being the longest threads of all?

 

[yelnad]

This thread has turned into an after dinner conversation between my mom (the baptist minister) and I (the pagan quaker). Good times!

 

[azanon]

And last I checked, those who shared your beliefs were in the majority in this country.   Persecution shouldn't be your worry.   Tyrrany of the majority should be.

Damn Straight.  I go to church now primarily for perception, perception for my parents, my wife, my workmates.  It would be professional suicide if i were to admit to my workmates and my boss i was agnostic.  There's no way i'd get promoted after saying that cause who's going to trust someone that doesn't ultimately answer to a God? (The way christains think, they think if you dont believe in god, you have no morals, which is just plain dumb). These folks here in Arkansas are god-fearers, and one would definitely be ostrasized if you said you were an atheist/agnostic (though admittedly it would be done subtlely to avoid grounds for discrimination grieveances).

70%+ of americans polled profess to be christain.  Over 95% believe in God, also per national polls.  

If its persecution one's looking for, go tell everyone you're an atheist.

 

[laurence]

(sigh) now we are getting to the everyone who is x does y stage. I'm so glad I've been enlightened on what I think. I thought I thought differently, but I guess I was wrong! Religion and politics, never a good subject, especially on a message board. :-/

Hey, so I'm interested in getting a kayak, I've only done it twice, but I really enjoyed it and would like to get out to the ocean more. What a good starter kayak?

 

[azanon]

First, if you can't handle it, dont participate. Second, do you mind not hijacking my thread?