LBYMers, Could You Spend $300k A Year?

$300k And You

  • I'm Doing Just Fine

    Votes: 8 6.6%
  • A Quarter Or Less

    Votes: 27 22.1%
  • Less Than Half

    Votes: 15 12.3%
  • Half

    Votes: 16 13.1%
  • More Than Half

    Votes: 6 4.9%
  • More Than Three Quarters

    Votes: 4 3.3%
  • All That Plus A Bag Of Chips

    Votes: 46 37.7%

  • Total voters
    122
Wow! I left the home to go to my daughter's new home to help install some mini-blinds, and just came back to find how this ended. I knew it! I can say it's déjà vu, even though I have not been on this forum long.


... they cost less than hand-made suits but more than the rags that proles wear while sweating up our national parks.

Man, oh man! Taking cue from another thread, perhaps people should start taking up streaking through national parks, so they would not be judged by their clothes. However, this means that I would no longer be able to frequent NPs myself. You see, I have this old-fashioned sense of modesty. :blush:
 
Loop Lawyer is right about one thing: MDs can be really bad investors, because we are trained to trust people. The docs on this board are the exceptions.

Moe is right about another thing: white coats cost about $35. But they are an infection risk, and the best way for an MD to dress while seeing patients is short sleeves (facilitating handwashing up to the elbows). Scrubs work well, they are comfortable, and you toss them in the hospital laundry bin and put on your jeans before going home. Most MDs that I know have "one good suit" unless they are in upper management. Then they have two or three.

In contrast to Radiohead, my earnings ceiling is more like $300K. I've had a fair amount of legal work done lately, and I've paid the lawyers approximately three times my own hourly rate. I don't give a rat's ass what type of car my lawyer drives or whether he / she drinks Chateau Lafite. Just do a good job and treat me nicely, and we'll get along. The CEOs that I know (and I do know a few) wouldn't care either.

I'm frugal, but I have no problem with people who can afford it spending whatever they want. I do recognize that in some circles image is key to success. Danmar and Loop Lawyer deserve credit for being honest about this. I'm glad not to be on that treadmill.
 
That is one thing I like about medicine, you don't have to "play a part" to be successful. Sure, lots of docs spend most (or all) of their money on a high end lifestyle, but it isn't "required". In private practice there aren't any rungs to climb like in a corporation. While there are a few predatory groups out there, in general when you join a group you can expect to be a full partner in a couple years or less...it is a given. As long as you take good care of your patients, nobody cares if you get all your clothes from Target and drive a 20 year old beater.

Compare this to business and law where it is very, very common for those on the top of the pyramid to make a killing off taking advantage of those below them. My SO has a friend whose first job out of law school was for a guy in the Chicago area who not only was mob connected and liked to fraudulently bill his clients, but was the only "partner" in a firm of ~15. Essentially no associate stayed for longer than a year. He lives VERY extravagently, but his whole life is a giant fraud. It seems like in law and business there is generally a lot of game playing and/or shadiness to advance. I prefer to stay away. I may still check out the book though.

Being a geek, I always thought advancement in the engineering field was more like the medical profession as you just described. It was certainly true when I started working in the early 80s.

Back then, after a few years of working, nobody cared about what prestigious school an engineer graduated from. All they asked a guy was what he had been producing lately. All my career was spent in R&D departments of large corps. There might be other companies that did not have the same esprit de corps, but my experience was that a guy who flaunted his class ring or hinted about his background would immediately get sneered. We just didn't talk about it. Indeed, an experienced engineer should have some work achievements to show other than his diploma.

Recently, many megacorps are now run like businesses that believe in outsourcing work to other countries. Some do not even know that they should at least maintain some core competencies. So, they start to value managers more than real producing engineers, and as it is more difficult to judge a manager skill than the tangible work of an engineer, they start to rely more on the nebulous aspects. Thus, the rise of the ass-kissers, the shirkers of responsibilities, the back-stabbers, the meeting-goers, etc...

Some people do not believe that Dilbert's cartoons are real-life portrayals, but sadly it is. I find it difficult to laugh.
 
Warning this is long!

Me.... I've had big bucks from business and well... didn't care for the social circles and stress associated with the treadmill. That's not directed at anyone here, and if they are comfortable with the folks they surround themselves with good for them. Rich, poor or in between, I've found likable people and people who were snobs about what they have as well as people who were snobbish in their own poor way by constantly living a life of envy or with a "poor mentality" about money. Happiness is between ears, not between the folds of a fat or thin wallet.

Me, I find more happiness building an engine and restoring a hot rod than buying Porsche and its not because I couldn't afford one. I've done the "one payment plan" before with a rather expensive vehicle. After a while... the thrill wore off and the only way it could be replaced was by doing it again, which I declined. I took it out of service, modified the engine, transmission and suspension, did some fabrication... and there's always a new thrill I can think of to "make it my own model." I'd rather build a classic Cobra kit car, drive around cruise-ins and smoke the tires at lights than tool around in a luxury car. I downsized the house after realizing it didn't do much for me. I now have a small ranch house with a few acres in the country, enjoy the slower pace of life and have large workshop out back. That's where I find my happiness... building things with my hands. Heck, I even enjoy cleaning up the shop, especially on a very hot day where nothing feels more satisfying than downing an ice cold diet Coke. I know how to and can enjoy a great dry aged steak and the best gourmet meal but I find beers with people casually laughing it up at a local joint more enjoyable --- especially if there's an old fart there spinning yarns about his youth. I find rubbing grease off my hands at the end of the day far more rewarding on an emotional level. Yeah, cars are a hobby of mine, not my income... but I've busted my ass at work and busted my knuckles under a greasy engine so I've seen both sides of the coin. For me, I've found that you can wash dirt and grease off in a shower but no shower takes away the stress of a tough day at the office, especially those weeks when I put 80 hours (or more on occasion, no kidding), or worse, a week of travel no matter how fancy. Getting pampered by doormen wearing tails, bellhops who act like they are your best friend, having an expensive gift basket awaiting me in the room and a classy waitress at my cocktail table was fun but the conversation was always thin. The only "deep" conversations were the intricacies of business.

So, I guess I'm a simple man, with simple tastes, who's been there, done that... and found my place in life where I fit. I wear faded blue jeans and t-shirts year round, and shorts in the summer. I don't give a damn if the shirt has a stain on it either... what other people think doesn't impact me. The suits come out only for weddings and funerals. While I certainly prefer first class flying over cramped coach the fancy hotels do little to nothing for me... I'm not there to spend my time at the hotel. I'm there to spend as much time with a line in the water looking to catch a big fish! On the rare occasions I go to a high end hotel it's for an romantic weekend getaway with my wife, but we still spend the majority of the time window shopping, too busy sharing our thoughts with each other to spend much money. Heck, 99% of the enjoy is having each other around without having the kids around! lol When I meet with my financial adviser sometimes I get a chuckle wondering if he cringes when shaking my hand because there may be grease under my fingernails!

I'm 43, been retired for 3 years and loving it. Sure, I can find plenty things to do with $300K per year. Anyone who says they can't, well, they probably aren't trying hard. The first year it would be easy to blow some serious cash on machining equipment that I'd rarely use, maybe a dynometer and the best vehicle lift you can buy, and perhaps a 68 Camaro and 64 Mustang convertible but after that my vehicle wants are met. Perhaps I'd spend a good chunk on house sitters so I could take a long road trip with the wife to visit the lower 48 states, and perhaps take the 4x4 for a drive up to Alaska. After that... maybe I'd increase my joy by stuffing money into a single mother's purse at church around Christmas, or having a box of clothes for her kids dropped off anonymously. An absolute blast would be to take all of the gift cards for the needy at Christmas off the tree at a local church and personally insuring all those kids had the best toys, and give them a Christmas they'll remember the rest of their lives. Hard to say exactly what I'd do, but I would try to do something positive with it. And yes, blow some frivolously but can't see it happening much... it's just not me.
 
Meadbh: Not sure what treadmill you think I'm on? Retired for almost 5 years and having a ball. Cheers.

Sorry Danmar, I know you are retired. Loop Lawyer is the one on the treadmill. When you were a bank executive, did you feel pressure to maintain a certain image, or had that level of spending become natural? I presume that, unless you were born with a silver spoon, your spending must have started out modestly and increased over the course of your career.

I think my personal spending in inflation adjusted dollars is lower now than it was in my 20s.
 
It turns out that the $300K Lamborghini-bashing incident was more about a business dispute than a complaint about the car company. And it was a used car worth "only" about $80K:
The Other Side to the Lamborghini Story - The Wealth Report - WSJ

But they are an infection risk, and the best way for an MD to dress while seeing patients is short sleeves (facilitating handwashing up to the elbows).
After spending a week hanging around a hospital, I learned to look for that white coat.

The guy in short sleeves was cleaning the rooms & mopping the corridors.
 
After spending a week hanging around a hospital, I learned to look for that white coat.

The guy in short sleeves was cleaning the rooms & mopping the corridors.
That guy was practicing infection control.

According to this article: White coats may not carry an increased infection risk | Cambridge Medicine Journal
a study carried out in Denver, Colorado has in fact concluded that white coats carry no more risk of infection than regularly laundered standardized short sleeve uniforms which would be seen as the gold standard for infection control.
 
Maybe Loop Lawyer should have tried impressing his clients with a short sleeved shirt!
 
Well, as the topic has drifted towards infection spread by unwashed hands, and I remembered reading something about this in the past about this subject, decided to look it up. Found this and this.

Following are some excerpts.

At the time, the Vienna Lying-In hospital had two maternity wards, one staffed by midwives, and the other by medical students supervised by staff physicians. The mortality rate among women attended by midwives was approximately 2-3%; however, the students’ ward had a rate of 10% or more. While hospital administrators blamed the high mortality rates on poverty, this could not explain the difference between the two wards. Instead, Semmelweiss believed that the students, who received much of their medical training in the autopsy room, were carrying infections from cadavers they dissected to the women in the ward...

More recently, Chang and associates traced an epidemic of yeast infection in a neonatal intensive care unit to the failure of some hospital staff members to wash their hands after playing with their pet dogs, who were carriers of the yeast (New England Journal of Medicine, 338(11), 706-711, 1998). Similarly, Moolenaar et al. suggested that an outbreak of a bloodstream infection in another neonatal ICU was due to bacteria carried under the long or artificial fingernails of some hospital nurses (Infection Control & Hospital Epidemiology, 21(2), 80-85, 2000)...



Many observational studies, mainly conducted in intensive care units, show low rates of hand washing, especially among doctors.4 Bartzokas et al observed that, despite frequent patient contacts, senior doctors washed their hands only twice during 21 hours of ward rounds.5 Though doctors spend less time than nurses in direct patient contact and may think that they need to decontaminate their hands less often, they have many transient contacts and move from ward to ward. The same is true for phlebotomists, physiotherapists, radiographers, and various technicians.

Self reporting overestimates compliance. After unobtrusive observation of doctors to obtain a baseline hand washing rate, Tibballs asked a sample to estimate their own hand washing rates before patient contact. Their perceived rate of 73% (range 50%-95%) contrasted sharply with the observed frequency of just 9%.6 Pritchard and Raper were astonished that “doctors can be so extraordinarily self-delusional about their behaviour.”​

Oh, please doctors...
 
Sorry Danmar, I know you are retired. Loop Lawyer is the one on the treadmill. When you were a bank executive, did you feel pressure to maintain a certain image, or had that level of spending become natural? I presume that, unless you were born with a silver spoon, your spending must have started out modestly and increased over the course of your career.

I think my personal spending in inflation adjusted dollars is lower now than it was in my 20s.

Did not have to be a big spender to impress my associates. Ostentation was not viewed as a advantage or a detriment. I probably would have been at the lower end of the spending scale. Yes, spending started lower then gradually increased as I earned and saved more. it really took off when I retired and realized I didn't have to LBYM any more. Also finalized my divorce which gave more certainty to my fixed and future expenses. I certainly was not born with the spoon.
Like many of you on this forum, I went to the equivalent of state schools( all degrees part time while working) and completely paid my own way. Because I attach a very high premium to education, and because it is more expensive now, I have paid for my daughter's education to the masters level. I would support her education further if that's what she wanted.
 
<<Maybe you should recruit a couple of the top students from SR state. They could show some of your 300K boys how to get by in life without over-paying for everything, getting by on less, chasing status and maybe end up with a few bucks in savings at the end of the year.>>

Those of us who own the firm don't hire anyone to show us how to "get by in life" or "get by on less." We don't care to "get by" at all. We live very well, thank you. Could say more but will decline. :whistle:

<<Besides any school you or your family attends [sic], does this also apply to your neighborhood, gym, country club, church, clothing store, and circle of friends. Just wondering when it would be appropriate for me to use.>>

No comment (here). :crazy:

I think we have just decided on a different image that we want to display in life. I decided that to be financially comfortable and not flaunt it is a more tasteful approach. After reading your posts, I am very happy with my decision.
 
I could spend 300k in one year but after that year I'd have everything I ever wanted. Don't know what I'd do the second year.
 
I did a similar exercise a few years ago where I tried to think of ways to spend $40,000 per year but it still ended up sounding somewhat construed. I couldn't do it. $300,000 would be another two doublings.

I'm sure it's possible to learn how. After all, it's also possible to learn how to spend less.
 
Most definitely we could spend $300K per year and enjoy every penny of it. And I wouldn't feel a whit of guilt about it, because I imagine we would have worked hard for it.
 
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Nah, spending money is easy. Haven't we read about how lottery winners blew through tens of million in just a few years? They spent way more than $300K/year effortlessly, my friends.
 
Because I attach a very high premium to education, and because it is more expensive now, I have paid for my daughter's education to the masters level. I would support her education further if that's what she wanted.
I always worry about the affluenza and entitlement aspects of this. I wish I had a better answer for the situation, both with kids & grandkids.

I didn't pay for either of my degrees up front, but I paid for them afterward through indentured servitude...

Nah, spending money is easy. Haven't we read about how lottery winners blew through tens of million in just a few years? They spent way more than $300K/year effortlessly, my friends.
I think the key is a large entourage.
 
Nah, spending money is easy. Haven't we read about how lottery winners blew through tens of million in just a few years? They spent way more than $300K/year effortlessly, my friends.

Seems as much thoughtlessly as anything else. As ditsy as even I can be as a LBYMer, there isn't much I buy without consideration and research.
 
I think I could live in scrubs all day, and I've never worked in the medical field. Man, those are comfortable.
 
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