Mini stroke - TIA anyone?

[jim584672]

My mother had mini-strokes that eventually lead to her vascular dementia and death. She also had a 90% blockage in her carotid artery which required surgery. They took a vein from her leg to rebuild her carotid. This helped her stay even for a few years.

Years of untreated blood pressure / smoking / lack of exercise I am convinced caused (or greatly added to) her condition. She always refused to go to the doctor. These things can just happen, but in her case I am sure she would have had many more healthy years if she would have taken care of things.

 

[Live Free]

My husband had a stroke in 2015 at age 54. Fortunately he was right in front of me when it happened and I got him to the ER within minutes. He was assessed (CT scan, MRI, carotid ultrasound etc.) and given the drug TPA which miraculously saved him from some permanent deficits. His arteries appeared clear and we were never sure what caused it. He was already on low-dose aspirin for many years prior at the time of his stroke, due to very, very low HDL and high LDL. They added an additional blood thinner to the mix - plavix. He is extremely active and of normal weight. So this was a shock for us, considering his relative young age.

Last year he had another stroke episode (slurred speech, loss of strength on one side of his body, drooping side of face) - this time the symptoms went away on their own after about 2 hours in the ER. They called this a TIA. They repeated many of the same tests - MRIs, ultrasounds of the neck, etc. No cause identified. He has since been to a neurologist for all kinds of follow-up tests as well as to a heart specialist for tests. So far no tests have come back with any definitive diagnosis. His doctors are divided on whether he should continue with the blood thinners.

Personally I think this is a genetic problem. His mother and many in her family have either had dibilitating strokes or have had many TIAs.

In any case, I'm sorry your husband has experienced another TIA. It is scary. I have learned that sometimes there are not obvious answers when it comes to strokes/TIAs and the various doctors (primary care, neurologist, cardiologist) are not in agreement on whether to continue with medication.

 

[CubicleDrone]

I think simple Vitamin C goes a long way to keeping strokes at bay.

A good time-released C is really one of the cheap non-glamorous miracles of our time.

 

[chris2008]

Thanks for taking time to reply.
Yes, it is scary to watch and being the responsible person to react.
So far, DH is well. In his family, there have been strokes on both parental sides.
We both take vitamin c daily for years. He will take aspirin now, too.
Never overweight, not smoking. Not much else to do and see.
We have been in Vietnam and Cambodia in Feb. At least it did noth happen then and there.

 

[Meadbh]

I think simple Vitamin C goes a long way to keeping strokes at bay.

A good time-released C is really one of the cheap non-glamorous miracles of our time.

Can you share references with us?

 

[CubicleDrone]

The best reference is the book by the author who got Linus Pauling interested in C (who, in turn, popularized it).

Irwin Stone's "The Healing Factor".
Its available free to read: The Healing Factor: Vitamin C Against DiseaseC

Id admit the data on strokes is sparse, but when you read on how Vit C is ignored by the mainstream in other areas where the data is not sparse, you'll get the idea.

(Edit: As theres the possibility of people in this thread taking this informal non-medical advice seriously: Id add that after reading this book, which is a quick read - I read it in two nights, to consider Linus Pauling's Lysine/Proline theory as well and also consider Lipospheric C).

 

[Meadbh]

The best reference is the book by the author who got Linus Pauling interested in C (who, in turn, popularized it).

Irwin Stone's "The Healing Factor".
Its available free to read: The Healing Factor: Vitamin C Against DiseaseC

Id admit the data on strokes is sparse, but when you read on how Vit C is ignored by the mainstream in other areas where the data is not sparse, you'll get the idea.

(Edit: As theres the possibility of people in this thread taking this informal non-medical advice seriously: Id add that after reading this book, which is a quick read - I read it in two nights, to consider Linus Pauling's Lysine/Proline theory as well and also consider Lipospheric C).

Thank you.

I note that this book was published in 1972. The reference list covers only chapters 12 and 13 and the articles cited were published between 1939 and 1970.

Don't you think it's a bit odd that it hasn't caught on 45 years later?

 

[kcowan]

I am on low dose aspirin (81g) and high dose Vitamin B (500g) daily but no mention of Vitamin C?

 

[CubicleDrone]

Thank you.

I note that this book was published in 1972. The reference list covers only chapters 12 and 13 and the articles cited were published between 1939 and 1970.

Don't you think it's a bit odd that it hasn't caught on 45 years later?

Not at all.
A combination of the paradigm being too different from the established theories of the mainstream AND the fact that Vitamin C cannot be made into a money-maker mean it will never catch on (in the present system).

A somewhat updated book are the books of Dr. Thomas E. Levy... but frankly, I found the original Irwin Stone book more readable and convincing.

I would add at this point, that if you are unwilling to put in a night or two to read the book cover to cover first, no debate is possible. Your skepticism will overrule anything I could say.

Been there done that.

 

[Meadbh]

I would add at this point, that if you are unwilling to put in a night or two to read the book cover to cover first, no debate is possible. Your skepticism will overrule anything I could say.

Not skepticism. Critical thinking. As a former scientific researcher, I am looking for high quality studies, preferably randomized controlled trials, that have been replicated.

Here is a report of a presentation (not yet peer reviewed) from 2014. It looks promising, but, as the article says....

"It is important to note that data and conclusions presented at medical meetings typically are considered preliminary until published in a peer-reviewed journal."

Can Vitamin C Ward Off Stroke? – WebMD

Now, moving to Google Scholar, we can see several fairly recent peer reviewed published cohort studies that show a relationship between Vitamin C status and the risk of stroke.

https://scholar.google.ca/scholar?hl=en&q=vitamin+C+and+stroke&btnG=&as_sdt=1,5&as_sdtp=

Association is not the same as causation, so we cannot assume that ingesting extra Vitamin C would prevent strokes. What this evidence shows is that a randomized controlled trial would be worthwhile. Unfortunately it would also be expensive to do, because it would have to be a large study conducted over many years. Pending such a study, it would be reasonable for the public to take supplemental Vitamin C, though not in large doses (because everything has side effects!).

So I am not dismissing what you said. I am dealing with the information by evaluating it in the best way I know how, i.e. scientifically.

 

[Fedup]

I did read there is some problem with taking Vitamin C. So we are not taking it. But my husband and I have been taking ground fresh turmeric with honey, it works as a blood thinner. One needs to stop taking it at least 2 weeks before any kind of surgery. I like alternative medicine.
EDIT to add, it's really good for anti- inflammation.

 

[bmcgonig]

Not skepticism. Critical thinking. As a former scientific researcher, I am looking for high quality studies, preferably randomized controlled trials, that have been replicated.

Here is a report of a presentation (not yet peer reviewed) from 2014. It looks promising, but, as the article says....

"It is important to note that data and conclusions presented at medical meetings typically are considered preliminary until published in a peer-reviewed journal."

Can Vitamin C Ward Off Stroke? – WebMD

Now, moving to Google Scholar, we can see several fairly recent peer reviewed published cohort studies that show a relationship between Vitamin C status and the risk of stroke.

https://scholar.google.ca/scholar?hl=en&q=vitamin+C+and+stroke&btnG=&as_sdt=1,5&as_sdtp=

Association is not the same as causation, so we cannot assume that ingesting extra Vitamin C would prevent strokes. What this evidence shows is that a randomized controlled trial would be worthwhile. Unfortunately it would also be expensive to do, because it would have to be a large study conducted over many years. Pending such a study, it would be reasonable for the public to take supplemental Vitamin C, though not in large doses (because everything has side effects!).

So I am not dismissing what you said. I am dealing with the information by evaluating it in the best way I know how, i.e. scientifically.

There's a cardiologist on the web whose videos I watch, Yorkcardiologist.com, who said that there is debate that some strokes might be caused by inflammation. I wonder since Vitamin C is potentially an antiinflammatory that this might be the connection, if there is indeed a connection. No idea here, just wondering.

 

[Meadbh]

There's a cardiologist on the web whose videos I watch, Yorkcardiologist.com, who said that there is debate that some strokes might be caused by inflammation. I wonder since Vitamin C is potentially an antiinflammatory that this might be the connection, if there is indeed a connection. No idea here, just wondering.

The association with inflammation is supported by research. You may also be aware that periodontal disease is associated with cardiovascular problems. Chronic inflammation appears to be a bad thing all around. So eat your fruits and vegetables, and floss daily!

 

[CubicleDrone]

Not skepticism. Critical thinking. As a former scientific researcher, I am looking for high quality studies, preferably randomized controlled trials, that have been replicated.

Here is a report of a presentation (not yet peer reviewed) from 2014. It looks promising, but, as the article says....

"It is important to note that data and conclusions presented at medical meetings typically are considered preliminary until published in a peer-reviewed journal."

Can Vitamin C Ward Off Stroke? – WebMD

Now, moving to Google Scholar, we can see several fairly recent peer reviewed published cohort studies that show a relationship between Vitamin C status and the risk of stroke.

https://scholar.google.ca/scholar?hl=en&q=vitamin+C+and+stroke&btnG=&as_sdt=1,5&as_sdtp=

Association is not the same as causation, so we cannot assume that ingesting extra Vitamin C would prevent strokes. What this evidence shows is that a randomized controlled trial would be worthwhile. Unfortunately it would also be expensive to do, because it would have to be a large study conducted over many years. Pending such a study, it would be reasonable for the public to take supplemental Vitamin C, though not in large doses (because everything has side effects!).

So I am not dismissing what you said. I am dealing with the information by evaluating it in the best way I know how, i.e. scientifically.

Calling something scientific does not make it so, especially if you are dealing with a different paradigm from the one you are used to.

I'd call what you are doing lazy, because you seem unwilling to put in the time which may shift your paradigm.

Been there done that. You will need to read the book, cover to cover, freely available and relatively short, (and you are welcome to try out the Levy books too - which are much more current).

 

[Meadbh]

Calling something scientific does not make it so, especially if you are dealing with a different paradigm from the one you are used to.

I'd call what you are doing lazy, because you seem unwilling to put in the time which may shift your paradigm.

Been there done that. You will need to read the book, cover to cover, freely available and relatively short, (and you are welcome to try out the Levy books too - which are much more current).

There is no need to be insulting. I do not "need" to read anything, and I have no doubt that you will not read any of the references I included. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

 

[MichaelB]

I'd call what you are doing lazy, because you seem unwilling to put in the time which may shift your paradigm.

Welcome to our forum, CubicleDrone. I'm not taking sides in this discussion, but you might want to break out an old copy of Dale Carnegie - your local library must have one handy. We pride ourselves on disagreeing without being disagreeable.

 

[CubicleDrone]

There is no need to be insulting. I do not "need" to read anything, and I have no doubt that you will not read any of the references I included. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

Sure, its just that I feel you started it by saying "i.e scientifically", clearly implying that my view was not scientifically obtained. If Im wrong about this, I apologize.

We can leave it at that. And anyone reading this who wants to go further - scroll up for the book link.

 

[REWahoo]

And anyone reading this who wants to go further - scroll up for the book link.

Speaking of book links: How To Start Off On The Right Foot On An Internet Forum

 

[LARS]

Speaking of book links: How To Start Off On The Right Foot On An Internet Forum

I'm still looking for how to start off on the Left foot, but then I've always been a contrarian.

 

[Meadbh]

Sure, its just that I feel you started it by saying "i.e scientifically", clearly implying that my view was not scientifically obtained. If Im wrong about this, I apologize.

We can leave it at that. And anyone reading this who wants to go further - scroll up for the book link.

Yeah, Science!

https://youtu.be/eQR1r1KTjaE

 

[Bestwifeever]

Speaking of book links: How To Start Off On The Right Foot On An Internet Forum

Do you mean saying someone is "too lazy" and "needs to read" and "is unwilling to put in the time" and my favorite expression from my kids when they were in grade school (fortunately they grew out of this one by junior high), "you started it", won't make a good first impression?

CubicleDrone, there are many thoughtful conversations here about nutrition and medicine among some smart people, who don't seem to need to prove only their viewpoints are "right". Stick around, you might find them interesting and we might find your contributions interesting.

I hope the OP's DH is doing well!

 

[Amethyst]

Quite a few of us managed to start out on our rears! I think my very first post to a forum back in the 90's (it was a cooking forum, and I needed advice on knives) was "Can you hear me?" or some such

I'm still looking for how to start off on the Left foot, but then I've always been a contrarian.

 

[Amethyst]

Yeah, Science!

I bet Meadbh could....just sayin'....

 

[kcowan]

I for one vote for Meadbh. She is a regular contributor here and is very respectful.

I also agree that is is too many correlation studies that might be causing more harm than good.

Also the 70s had many bad ideas, particularly associated with nutrition and "good" foods.