Shut off valve (plumbing question)

[triangle]

My washing machine cold water ball valve is leaking. It's designed to either be sweated or screwed into a shark bite fitting. And it's behind sheet rock. I'll get around to it in a few more days--since we've moved elsewhere.

Good luck. I had to replace my washing machine cutoff values a couple of months ago. It was a 30 year old gate value and though there must be many homes in my town with the same builder's grade shutoffs I was not able to find properly sized washers at Lowes, HD, or the plumbing supply store. Sweating vertical pipes that are/were filled with water is not fun.

 

[SteveNU]

A trick that I learned is to take a straw or short piece of tubing and stick it in the pipe. Then you either suck out the water or just seal the end and pull it out a little at a time. A plain old straw will get you six inches or so of dry pipe, works great.

Good luck. I had to replace my washing machine cutoff values a couple of months ago. It was a 30 year old gate value and though there must be many homes in my town with the same builder's grade shutoffs I was not able to find properly sized washers at Lowes, HD, or the plumbing supply store. Sweating vertical pipes that are/were filled with water is not fun.

 

[triangle]

A trick that I learned is to take a straw or short piece of tubing and stick it in the pipe. Then you either suck out the water or just seal the end and pull it out a little at a time. A plain old straw will get you six inches or so of dry pipe, works great.

Yes that makes sense. In my real world attempt I was too inexperienced or clueless to do that, and managed to get one side soldered properly (I do not remember if it was the hot or cold side) while the other side leaked.

Since testing the sweated fittings meant refilling the pipes with water, when my connection failed I just cut off another section of pipe rather than trying to desolder and redid everything. But the second time I used a few rags that I could jam down into the pipe to wick out enough water so that it did not interfere with the sweat joint the next time. But that second attempt and testing of the pipes was like and at the same time. (I was using a propane torch instead of Mapp gas which made it more tricky).

 

[JoeWras]

Went to the plumbing store. They confirmed that there is no way to replace the entire stem. Nothing is standard. So, I bought a washer and some packing rope and rebuilt the valve. No problems.

Congrats Jerry! This is old school plumbing. My dad did this stuff in his sleep for 40 years.

Most plumbers today would just replace the valve.

But anyhow... Nice to hear you also repacked the stem. I always marveled at how the stem leaks are held back by nothing more than a string. (Today's "high tech" packing includes graphite.) Many people freak out over stem leaks, which I know was NOT your problem. But they are easy to fix, with patience. Maybe I should start a new thread.

 

[Winemaker]

A trick that I learned is to take a straw or short piece of tubing and stick it in the pipe. Then you either suck out the water or just seal the end and pull it out a little at a time. A plain old straw will get you six inches or so of dry pipe, works great.

A trick I learned along time ago was to insert a small piece of bread into the copper with water. Any water in a copper pipe is always attracted to the heat source. Bread has never left me down.

 

[REWahoo]

A trick I learned along time ago was to insert a small piece of bread into the copper with water. Any water in a copper pipe is always attracted to the heat source. Bread has never left me down.

+1

I've used this bread trick a couple of times with good success.

Using Bread to Sweat a Leaking Copper Pipe

 

[Jerry1]

Congrats Jerry! This is old school plumbing. My dad did this stuff in his sleep for 40 years.

Most plumbers today would just replace the valve.

But anyhow... Nice to hear you also repacked the stem. I always marveled at how the stem leaks are held back by nothing more than a string. (Today's "high tech" packing includes graphite.) Many people freak out over stem leaks, which I know was NOT your problem. But they are easy to fix, with patience. Maybe I should start a new thread.

Thanks.

Actually the stem would leak whenever I would turn it on or off so it was good to get that taken care of too.

 

[travelover]

+1

I've used this bread trick a couple of times with good success.

Using Bread to Sweat a Leaking Copper Pipe

And once the soldering is done, you turn on the water and retrieve the bread for a soggy but tasty toasted treat.

 

[JoeWras]

+1

I've used this bread trick a couple of times with good success.

Using Bread to Sweat a Leaking Copper Pipe

Dang, I wish I knew about this about 10 years ago when I changed my main supply globe valve to a ball valve. This was with type L copper (main supply) which is harder to solder because it is thicker.

Anyway, my solution was to wait a few hours for the house to drain out.

Learn something every day. My dad didn't use this trick. He had other industrial tricks. The big one was a freeze sleeve he'd put upstream. Literally, it froze everything coming through the pipe! This was crucial for lead pipe work -- a lost art, but that's another story.

You can do this too by going to the store, getting dry ice, and wrapping it around the pipe a few feet upstream. Dad used dry ice for decades. In his final years, he had some sort of CO2 tank contraption with a pipe and sleeve that was The Bomb for freezing pipes. Yeah, pros have tricks, ya'll.

 

[samclem]

Yes that makes sense. In my real world attempt I was too inexperienced or clueless to do that, and managed to get one side soldered properly (I do not remember if it was the hot or cold side) while the other side leaked.

When I installed our washing machine I put in one of those 2-in-1 valves: The hot and cold lines to the hose connections are ball valves and controlled by a single lever. It looked spiffy, and I was able to sweat it into the copper well enough, but I don't think they are a great idea. When either side crumps out, I'll need to replace the whole thing. It's better just to use 2 regular valves.

Congrats Jerry! This is old school plumbing. My dad did this stuff in his sleep for 40 years.

Most plumbers today would just replace the valve.

Yes, maybe those globe valves are old school, but there's something nice about a product that is designed to be repaired easily rather than just thrown away.

I'm just "okay" at sweating copper connections, about 90% of mine work. The other 10% are a real problem (getting water out of the line, re-cleaning everything down to bare metal, etc). I'm a very big fan of PEX pipe, I've never had a connection fail and cutting out/replacing things when needed is very easy. I re-did much of the plumbing in DDs house with PEX, now I have mostly "home run" lines there that can each be turned of with a centrally located valve manifold (like an electrical breaker panel). Super!

 

[JoeWras]

Yes, maybe those globe valves are old school, but there's something nice about a product that is designed to be repaired easily rather than just thrown away.

The world changed. All the fixtures were solid brass. All were designed for repair. Valve seats were reground. Fixtures like faucets had 30 to 50 year life. When I went around with Dad in the 70s, he was routinely repairing fixtures built in the go-go 1920s. It is hard to believe now, but all the inside parts of a toilet were brass, even the float ball was brass!

Today, brass faucets are getting rare mostly because they started to add lead to the alloy, and lead is now a no-no. So, any brass has to be no-lead and that stuff is expensive because it is harder to work with from a manufacturing standpoint.

I'm just "okay" at sweating copper connections, about 90% of mine work. The other 10% are a real problem (getting water out of the line, re-cleaning everything down to bare metal, etc). I'm a very big fan of PEX pipe, I've never had a connection fail and cutting out/replacing things when needed is very easy. I re-did much of the plumbing in DDs house with PEX, now I have mostly "home run" lines there that can each be turned of with a centrally located valve manifold (like an electrical breaker panel). Super!

I'm a PEX convert. Any changes in my house now go to PEX. The no-lead solder is harder to work with than the old 50/50. Since lead has been declared enemy #1, it only makes sense to go with PEX in any repair. It appears that PEX has solved the connection issue that plagued early crimp-on supply pipe from the late 80s through mid 90s.

 

[homestead]

A trick I learned along time ago was to insert a small piece of bread into the copper with water. Any water in a copper pipe is always attracted to the heat source. Bread has never left me down.

That’s an old plumbers truck!