The Subdivision is looking shabby....Are we doomed?

[utrecht]

You're upset that your HOA enforced the rules? From this thread it sounds like the bigger issue is lack of enforcement.

That's the problem with HOAs. A lot of the rules are stupid (like not allowing trees to be planted), but everyone's ideas of what a stupid rule is, is different. I would never live in a neighborhood with an HOA. I find that the neighborhoods in upper income areas tend to pretty much be void of cars on blocks in the front yard and dont need all that much oversight from people on HOA boards who tend to be power hungry.

 

[harley]

You're upset that your HOA enforced the rules? From this thread it sounds like the bigger issue is lack of enforcement.

No, I'm more upset that they would even have such a dumb rule. I could see a rule saying not to plant anything that would block someone else's view, but that's about it.

Seriously, when we had the HOA/ARB fascists in charge the neighborhood was a miserable place to live, with people measuring the length of other people's grass and what not. We almost didn't move in there due to the bickering and name calling at the HOA meetings. Since a new, more relaxed regime has taken over it's become a much more friendly and tolerant place to live. People are talking to each other in the streets, and (mostly) no one minds if someone keeps their boat or RV in the driveway for a week or two. People work together to keep the common ponds and gardens cleaned up, and generally get along better. The old group doesn't come to the neighborhood parties, but it's not a big loss.

Still, having lived through both aspects of HOA life, I'm going to make sure that future homes (if any) are in non-HOA neighborhoods. I feel more comfortable that way. I guess I'll have rules when I finally end up in an old-folks home, but what can you do?

 

[zinger1457]

That's the problem with HOAs. A lot of the rules are stupid (like not allowing trees to be planted), but everyone's ideas of what a stupid rule is, is different.

If the rules are stupid why live there? Hopefully one reads the CC&R's thoroughly before purchasing.

 

[Ronstar]

If the rules are stupid why live there? Hopefully one reads the CC&R's thoroughly before purchasing.

Exactly. I haven't had any negative experiences with the HOA's I've been subjected to. The rules are fair and apply to everyone for the betterment of the community. If someone doesn't like the rules, they have the right to live somewhere else.

 

[MichaelB]

I've lived in HOA's and Condo Associations most of my adult life. The rules, and standards, are there because the residents want them. Not agreeing with something doesn't make it wrong, especially if it is a personal choice.

I would say that it is foolish to live in an HOA if the homeowner doesn't want or agree with the regulations.

 

[Rex]

I am the OP and I appreciate the great info and feedback.....

Update and my plans:

• A neighbor (former board member) and I are in agreement about the concern we have that the HOA rules are not being enforced...Come to find out he had sent in similar concerns.
• We met with a Board Member and he agreed with our one incident and when we pointed out all the other violations, his reaction was that he was not that familiar with the rules. It was very cordial.
• We (neighbor & I) are on the agenda for the next board meeting (a little concerned that there is no date yet set for the December meeting)
• My goal at the board meeting is to find out if the board is interested in enforcing the rules we all signed up for (I plan to bring a document with the rule and the number of violations I have found). There will be no yelling...that's not me. I am there to help.
• We are continuing to update the house for selling it/or not.
• We are thinking/researching where we would go if we decide to leave.

One of the greatest benefits of reaching FI, is that it's great to have options and the freedom to choose!

Again, thanks for the insights. I luv this board for this very reason.

 

[harley]

If the rules are stupid why live there? Hopefully one reads the CC&R's thoroughly before purchasing.

As with all laws, the devil is in the details. A rule that states "all landscaping projects must be approved by the ARB" doesn't mean you can't plant a tree to me. That's not a landscaping project. Building a deck is a landscaping project, and I submitted my plans before I did it. But I plant trees, bushes, flowers, etc. every week. I move them around, cut them down, etc. I garden. So just because you read the rules doesn't mean you interpret them the same way the HOA board does.

Anyway, I find it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission. My trees are still there.

 

[utrecht]

If the rules are stupid why live there? Hopefully one reads the CC&R's thoroughly before purchasing.

If you read my post, you saw that I did say I would never live in a neighborhood with an HOA.

 

[harley]

If you read my post, you saw that I did say I would never live in a neighborhood with an HOA.

I think he/she was talking to me.

 

[utrecht]

He said that while quoting my post, not yours. Post #53.

 

[Walt34]

So much depends on local culture and the people in it. Before we moved we did not have an HOA. When we moved to WV and bought, we got a copy of the covenants and you have some time (I think it was three days) to back out if you don't like them. Unlike most people, I actually read them so I knew what I was getting into. I thought they were reasonable so we stayed the course and there have been no issues between us and the HOA.

A discovery is that at least around here, one is generally better off with a strict HOA. There is no zoning, so if you buy a home where there isn't one, a neighbor can use that building for pretty much whatever they want to; open a bar, strip club, junkyard, gambling joint, whatever. Given that, I think I'd be a fool to buy a nice home without the protection of an HOA.

 

[utrecht]

No zoning? Thats anarchy.

 

[REWahoo]

No zoning? Thats anarchy.

AKA Houston...

 

[haha]

In the 4 years I have owned my condo it has doubled in value, to judge from sales in the building.

I basically hate thinking about property values, it seems like the object of satire. Yet if you have a good bit of money (life) tied up in a home, property values unfortunately matter.

That is one virtue(of many) of city living. Crime is really the only thing that can throw a big wrench in the equation. When I lived at Venice Beach I didn't worry that my modest investment could be lost. At my back was a whole city of affluent voters many of whom would prefer to live at the Pacific in the clean air and hipster vibe of Venice, and still be close to Century City and Santa Monica and other places where well paid people work. I figured, correctly in this case, that once suitably motivated, police could stop the bad behavior that annoyed well-to-do and politically influential people and that beautiful things would find their natural owners, the rich.

The same is true where I now live. This is an affluent city, and no matter how idiotic our socialist officials may be, good property within 1 mile of downtown CBD cannot be long term cheap.

Some suburbs have this trait, but not many. Just one more exit on the freeway and everything is new and clean and socially non-scary once more. Also big city police are better at shutting down some outrages than some suburb that is beginning to get worn.

Ha

 

[brewer12345]

I can't imagine wanting to live in an HOA community. Yuck. I have already spent too many years being told what to do. We shopped hard to find a house that was NOT under the thumb of a busybody HOA.

 

[RetireAge50]

Sometimes I throw my pop cans in my own front lawn and I'm glad I do not have someone telling me I can't. I do pick them up within a few days.

 

[Rex]

Went to the Board Meeting

Update for you.....

Last week, myself & two neighbors went to the HOA board meeting with my list of 150 + HOA violations. The purpose was to present the list and understand what was going on regarding enforcement (or lack of) of the HOA restrictions.

It turned into a horrible meeting and the Board seemed clueless about the HOA covenants and dis-interested in enforcing them.

Our plan is to send a formal letter to the HOA President with our list and ask for a response.

In the meantime, the DW and I have to figure our plan: 1) Move 2) Stay and fight 3) Stay and forget about it (& risk the property value slippage).

Not where we thought we would be after 20 years in a place we like.

Any thoughts or similar experiences? Am I just pounding salt?

Thanks.

 

[Brat]

For as long as you are living in the community you need to involve yourself in HOA affairs. Research the HOA's covenants and what it takes to change them so you know what you are up against. Likely the Board members really didn't know what they were getting into, the most effective approach is to help them know the rules and be prepared to enforce them. You, and the Board, need a knowledgeable attorney to put things on the right track. What worries me is that if a particular rule hasn't been enforced in X number of years it is no longer a rule.

 

[W2R]

Update for you.....

Last week, myself & two neighbors went to the HOA board meeting with my list of 150 + HOA violations. The purpose was to present the list and understand what was going on regarding enforcement (or lack of) of the HOA restrictions.

It turned into a horrible meeting and the Board seemed clueless about the HOA covenants and dis-interested in enforcing them.

Our plan is to send a formal letter to the HOA President with our list and ask for a response.

In the meantime, the DW and I have to figure our plan: 1) Move 2) Stay and fight 3) Stay and forget about it (& risk the property value slippage).

Not where we thought we would be after 20 years in a place we like.

Any thoughts or similar experiences? Am I just pounding salt?

Thanks.

I don't know. I've never lived in an HOA, but I'd tend to leave. Even if you stay and fight or forget, if everyone there knows you are the guy who complained about their HOA violations, they might make your life less than blissful.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Update for you.....

Last week, myself & two neighbors went to the HOA board meeting with my list of 150 + HOA violations. The purpose was to present the list and understand what was going on regarding enforcement (or lack of) of the HOA restrictions.

It turned into a horrible meeting and the Board seemed clueless about the HOA covenants and dis-interested in enforcing them.

Our plan is to send a formal letter to the HOA President with our list and ask for a response.

In the meantime, the DW and I have to figure our plan: 1) Move 2) Stay and fight 3) Stay and forget about it (& risk the property value slippage).

Not where we thought we would be after 20 years in a place we like.

Any thoughts or similar experiences? Am I just pounding salt?

Thanks.

No similar experiences but my gut reaction when reading your last post is this a neighborhood you really fit in these days? People tend to like people like themselves, and it seems like your HOA board and neighbors aren't bothered by the infractions. You might be fit in more and be happier some place else.

 

[Rustic23]

If the HOA is elected, get to know your neighbors, put a slate together and take over the board. I know, easier said than done, but it really is your only choice. If the current board is unwilling to change things get a new board.

If this is not really an answer, then I would start looking for a new place to live before things really turn ugly and property values take a dive.

 

[zinger1457]

As I stated in a previous post the development I live in hired an outside management company to help manage the HOA. They definitely helped to make enforcement of the rules more consistent and their costs are reasonable. We have no common areas so all the HOA does is maintain the CC&R's, our HOA fees are $120/year. I would recommend looking into it before jumping ship.

 

[harley]

I'd say you are doomed. It sounds like your choices are to be a PITA to the HOA (and probably without success), or try to take over the HOA and become an HOA Nazi to your neighbors. If you can't live with the direction the community is going, and unless there is a LARGE contingent that wants to resurrect it, I'd say it's time to move on. Definitely get out before prices drop too far.

 

[haha]

I'd say you are doomed. It sounds like your choices are to be a PITA to the HOA (and probably without success), or try to take over the HOA and become an HOA Nazi to your neighbors. If you can't live with the direction the community is going, and unless there is a LARGE contingent that wants to resurrect it, I'd say it's time to move on. Definitely get out before prices drop too far.

+1. It's an old story, at least back to the immediate postwar period when neighborhoods began changing.

Shoot first, later you can figure out who you shot. I bet they loved your modest 150 item proposal.

Ha

 

[rdy2go]

Rumor has it that the Taliban started out as an HOA.