Are We Alone?

[Lucantes]

It has been my experience that discussions of religion rarely end well.

for either side!
But what about alien religions?

 

[FUEGO]

Interesting topic.

I wonder what the correlation is to believing in ETs verses believing in a deity.

Can anyone prove the existence of either...

Can anyone disprove the existence of either?

Alien inter galactic travel at a thousand times the speed of light?

A supreme being... Creator of the universe?

Is one more plausible than the other?

Well, we have thousands of deities right here on Earth. Obviously other planets have a similar number.

 

[FUEGO]

Maybe all those extraterrestrial intelligent life forms observe the Prime Directive to not interfere with other primitive forms of life (like our own here on Earth).

They might have figured out we're here, but decided out of altruism (or whatever they call it on their planet) to leave us alone. Or maybe we are like dust mites to them. Barely worth observing or paying attention to at all.

There's certainly a possibility that the other intelligent life forms out there could be 10x or 100x smarter than us and hence consider us barely self-aware, barely intelligent creatures.

 

[MooreBonds]

Well,have ever considered the possibility the powers that be have allready made contact with intelligent beings much more advanced than us and not told us?I have.

I highly doubt we initiated contact, given that our signals were limited to radio broadcasts over the past 100 years, and given how weak those signals would be 100 light years out.

So the only way contact could already have been initiated would be if they visited us. And an alien race would either be hell-bent on dominating us, or be friendly. If the former, we would already know they are out there. If the later, I would assume they would already have made their presence known as well.

What evidence do you have that they already have visited/contacted us, other than a 'feeling'?

Anything could be possible because we do not know what is out there.

...as well as the possibility that we are, indeed, alone. If self-replicating life forms are so easy to create, then why aren't scientists making them in the lab? Why isn't there a kit you can buy your child to 'make your own amino acid chains and simple life forms' at home?

This planet does have many characteristics that we don't realize how beneficial and 'unique' they are - like the special role that water plays, in terms of its physical properties: it's less dense when a solid, so it takes a long time for bodies of water to freeze solid, and water is extremely aggressive and will dissolve many compounds (making it far easier for chemicals to distribute around). And if the earth were at different distances from the sun, things would have turned out much differently due to the impact on water. Then there's the beneficial effects of the moon with tides.

It's not an automatic given that there is a large amount of water in other solar systems even present at all, nor is it a given that the water would settle or be 'delivered' via comets to the planets that are at the right distance from the star, given the star's solar output, nor of the gases in the atmosphere to keep the planet in a temperate equilibrium.

And don't forget the huge benefit of the Earth's magnetic field (due to the molten iron core). This helps shield the planet from dangerous solar particles that would make the planet nearly inhospitable to land-based life as we know it. It's not a given that other planets would have similar magnetic shield protection from their star.

 

[martyp]

Why isn't there a kit you can buy your child to 'make your own amino acid chains and simple life forms' at home?

This would actually be fairly easy to do. See this page about the iGEM Foundation at MIT.

About - ung.igem.org

 

[Zathras]

What a classic short story, and a great Twilight Zone episode!

My favorite of all!
One of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's as well

"Twilight Zone" promo for "To Serve Man" - YouTube

 

[robnplunder]

I confess. Aliens contacted me 25 years ago and put a monitoring device in my head. They also have taken billions of my sperms, no doubt to populate their world with what they believe is the finest earth specimen. It was all in my report to FBI. By FBI's nonchalant response, I realize these things happen all the time.

BTW, there are cross bred aliens living among us: Dennis Rodman, Michael Jackson to name a few. I wasn't the only one whose sperms have been taken away.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

I highly doubt we initiated contact, given that our signals were limited to radio broadcasts over the past 100 years, and given how weak those signals would be 100 light years out.

So the only way contact could already have been initiated would be if they visited us. And an alien race would either be hell-bent on dominating us, or be friendly. If the former, we would already know they are out there. If the later, I would assume they would already have made their presence known as well.

What evidence do you have that they already have visited/contacted us, other than a 'feeling'?



...as well as the possibility that we are, indeed, alone. If self-replicating life forms are so easy to create, then why aren't scientists making them in the lab? Why isn't there a kit you can buy your child to 'make your own amino acid chains and simple life forms' at home?

This planet does have many characteristics that we don't realize how beneficial and 'unique' they are - like the special role that water plays, in terms of its physical properties: it's less dense when a solid, so it takes a long time for bodies of water to freeze solid, and water is extremely aggressive and will dissolve many compounds (making it far easier for chemicals to distribute around). And if the earth were at different distances from the sun, things would have turned out much differently due to the impact on water. Then there's the beneficial effects of the moon with tides.

It's not an automatic given that there is a large amount of water in other solar systems even present at all, nor is it a given that the water would settle or be 'delivered' via comets to the planets that are at the right distance from the star, given the star's solar output, nor of the gases in the atmosphere to keep the planet in a temperate equilibrium.

And don't forget the huge benefit of the Earth's magnetic field (due to the molten iron core). This helps shield the planet from dangerous solar particles that would make the planet nearly inhospitable to land-based life as we know it. It's not a given that other planets would have similar magnetic shield protection from their star.

The evidence is out there with those with an open mind.I am not saying I believe we have been visited by Alien intelligence,but I am open to the possibility we have.All you have to do is use google to see examples.It is up to each individual as to whether they are open to the information or not.Considering the vastness of Space it is certainly possible we have been visited and probraly have.If you don't want to believe it ,that is fine with me.Alien beings would not necessarily have to be either naughty or nice.They could be indifferent to us.

 

[easysurfer]

I believe we are not alone.

But when we find other life, the skeptics will say "Prove they didn't originate from earth"

 

[robnplunder]

The evidence is out there with those with an open mind.I am not saying I believe we have been visited by Alien intelligence,but I am open to the possibility we have.All you have to do is use google to see examples.It is up to each individual as to whether they are open to the information or not.Considering the vastness of Space it is certainly possible we have been visited and probraly have.If you don't want to believe it ,that is fine with me.Alien beings would not necessarily have to be either naughty or nice.They could be indifferent to us.

None that I can see.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

I highly doubt we initiated contact, given that our signals were limited to radio broadcasts over the past 100 years, and given how weak those signals would be 100 light years out.

So the only way contact could already have been initiated would be if they visited us. And an alien race would either be hell-bent on dominating us, or be friendly. If the former, we would already know they are out there. If the later, I would assume they would already have made their presence known as well.

What evidence do you have that they already have visited/contacted us, other than a 'feeling'?



...as well as the possibility that we are, indeed, alone. If self-replicating life forms are so easy to create, then why aren't scientists making them in the lab? Why isn't there a kit you can buy your child to 'make your own amino acid chains and simple life forms' at home?

This planet does have many characteristics that we don't realize how beneficial and 'unique' they are - like the special role that water plays, in terms of its physical properties: it's less dense when a solid, so it takes a long time for bodies of water to freeze solid, and water is extremely aggressive and will dissolve many compounds (making it far easier for chemicals to distribute around). And if the earth were at different distances from the sun, things would have turned out much differently due to the impact on water. Then there's the beneficial effects of the moon with tides.

It's not an automatic given that there is a large amount of water in other solar systems even present at all, nor is it a given that the water would settle or be 'delivered' via comets to the planets that are at the right distance from the star, given the star's solar output, nor of the gases in the atmosphere to keep the planet in a temperate equilibrium.

And don't forget the huge benefit of the Earth's magnetic field (due to the molten iron core). This helps shield the planet from dangerous solar particles that would make the planet nearly inhospitable to land-based life as we know it. It's not a given that other planets would have similar magnetic shield protection from their star.

None that I can see.

Are you looking with an open mind?

 

[martyp]

The evidence is out there with those with an open mind.I am not saying I believe we have been visited by Alien intelligence,but I am open to the possibility we have.All you have to do is use google to see examples.It is up to each individual as to whether they are open to the information or not.Considering the vastness of Space it is certainly possible we have been visited and probraly have.If you don't want to believe it ,that is fine with me.Alien beings would not necessarily have to be either naughty or nice.They could be indifferent to us.

“The problem with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and putting things in it.”

Having an open mind is no different than having a closed mind. Someplace in the middle is discriminating judgement.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

“The problem with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and putting things in it.”

Nothing in life that is worthwhile is without risks.

 

[robnplunder]

Are you looking with an open mind?

I don't think it is a question of having an open mind or not.

This reminds me of History Channel's Ancient Aliens program. Anything they can't explain is attributed to aliens. E.g., human race at the time cannot possibly build a Pyramid that huge. Therefore, they have done it with alien technology and help.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

I don't think it is a question of having an open mind or not.

This reminds me of History Channel's Ancient Aliens program. Anything they can't explain is attributed to aliens. E.g., human race at the time cannot possibly build a Pyramid that huge. Therefore, they have done it with alien technology and help.

There's just been too many what I will call incidences happen over the years for there not to be something to it.There is the Betty and Barney Hill case of 1961.Then there is the Roswell case of 1947.Then there is the fascinating Bentwaters UFO in 1980.This happened on a base in England.Even those who are experienced pilots were baffled by what they saw.Then there is the Travis Walton case of 1975.There is the Weiner UFO abduction maybe 1976 or thereabouts.Then there is the Michelak case of 1967 in Canada where he saw a UFO and touched it and it left a physical mark on his stomach with radiation burns.All these cannot be hoaxes.We all want the smoking gun so to speak.If such evidence does exist and it likely does,it is in the hands by those who do not want to share it and are powerful enough to get away with it.

 

[redduck]

Having an open mind is no different than having a closed mind. Someplace in the middle is discriminating judgement.

Did you just make that up?

 

[robnplunder]

There's just been too many what I will call incidences happen over the years for there not to be something to it.There is the Betty and Barney Hill case of 1961.Then there is the Roswell case of 1947.Then there is the fascinating Bentwaters UFO in 1980.This happened on a base in England.Even those who are experienced pilots were baffled by what they saw.Then there is the Travis Walton case of 1975.There is the Weiner UFO abduction maybe 1976 or thereabouts.Then there is the Michelak case of 1967 in Canada where he saw a UFO and touched it and it left a physical mark on his stomach with radiation burns.All these cannot be hoaxes.We all want the smoking gun so to speak.If such evidence does exist and it likely does,it is in the hands by those who do not want to share it and are powerful enough to get away with it.

None of what you said above makes it an evidence that intelligent alien race is visiting earth. None of them is even remotely convincing. U in UFO stands for unidentified, not "intelligent alien."

Then again, there are people believing US never went to moon, 911 is started by US gov't, etc.. They too have their share of "evidence." People believe what they want to believe.

 

[kombat]

Maybe so.But they would not be able to do much beyond detection.

My understanding is that they can do a great deal beyond "detection." It's remarkable what they're able to deduce from the tiny amount of information they're able to gather.

They already know plenty about the star (its age, temperature, size, mass, etc.). And using the Kepler telescope, they can detect the "dimming" of stars that indicates the presence of a planet passing in front of it. But based on the degree of dimming, the length of time it dims, and the frequency of the dimming, they can determine the size, mass, and orbital distance of the planet(s) causing the dimming. Combined with what they know about the star, they can then calculate the likely surface temperature of the planet, whether it's large enough to support an atmosphere, whether its size/weight ratio suggests an iron core (which would imply a protective magnetic field), and so on. If the planet is determined to be in the "Goldilocks" distance from its star (i.e., not too hot, not too cold), it could support liquid water, which is essential for the possibility of life.

They can learn all of that, just from the dimming of the star's light.

Back on-topic, there is absolutely, most definitely other life out there. Heck, we haven't even completely ruled out finding other life in our own solar system yet! There are between 200 and 400 billion stars just in our galaxy alone, any one of which could have multiple planets orbiting it, several of which could be in the "Goldilocks" zone. Heck, our own star has 8 planets, what makes you think that's anomalous? Perhaps that the average. Maybe that's below average. There could be trillions of planets out there, just in our galaxy.

Now consider that there are at least 100 billion galaxies, each of which could contain several hundred billion stars, each of which could have between 0 and a dozen planets orbiting them. What are the odds that of all those sextillions (10^21) of possible planets, not a single one of them has any life at all? That somehow, through a process we don't even understand yet, life on Earth just spurt out of the ocean at some point several billion years ago, and that was it. Whatever caused that spontaneous burp of life was unique to our planet, and has never happened anywhere else in the entire universe, in billions and billions of years, on any of the sextillions of possible planets out there?

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

None of what you said above makes it an evidence that intelligent alien race is visiting earth. None of them is even remotely convincing. U in UFO stands for unidentified, not "intelligent alien."

Then again, there are people believing US never went to moon, 911 is started by US gov't, etc.. They too have their share of "evidence." People believe what they want to believe.

That is because your mind is allready made up.There is no way anyone can look at these cases and not wonder if it is true.Just because I don't have evidence doesn't mean it isn't true or didn't happen.I doubt you have studied all these cases.It's simple really.I am willing to consider the possibility that it could be true.You are not because the smoking gun evidence is lacking.I never said I had such evidence to begin with.I said it is out there for those with an open mind.If you wish to call all the eye witnesses and abductees of UFO's mistaken or simply crazy then that is your right.My right is to consider the possibility and I do.The vastness of space is so big it is almost as if it demands life to fulfill it's existance.

 

[MooreBonds]

Are you looking with an open mind?

I never said "we are definitely alone, and life cannot possibly exist outside of Earth." I merely pointed out that it's not purely a numbers game, and saying "with fifty gazillion infinitrillion planets, surely there are some that have life", because there are many, many variables that would not necessarily be present in most or even many of those planets, let alone those solar systems as well.

But, I remain open minded - to evidence. Sure, there's a chance there could be life elsewhere, but as far as intelligent life...I don't think it's always quite as easy to reach those conditions.

Your claims of open-mindedness sounds like certain people in this country who claim to be 'open-minded and accepting' in their political and moral beliefs....as long as the political or moral view is the same as theirs. If you disagree with them, you are branded as 'closed-minded' - even though their self-ascribed definition of "open-minded" requires them to accept ALL views, not just those that are similar to theirs.

 

[HFWR]

That is because your mind is allready made up.There is no way anyone can look at these cases and not wonder if it is true.Just because I don't have evidence doesn't mean it isn't true or didn't happen.I doubt you have studied all these cases.It's simple really.I am willing to consider the possibility that it could be true.You are not because the smoking gun evidence is lacking.I never said I had such evidence to begin with.I said it is out there for those with an open mind.If you wish to call all the eye witnesses and abductees of UFO's mistaken or simply crazy then that is your right.My right is to consider the possibility and I do.The vastness of space is so big it is almost as if it demands life to fulfill it's existance.

Space...bar...

 

[samclem]

. U in UFO stands for unidentified, not "intelligent alien."

Isaac Asimov's article "The Rocketing Dutchman", part of his book "The Planet that Wasn't", makes your case very well.


I sure miss Asimov--there are many good "popularizers" of science, but IMO he was the best. His breadth of knowledge (a "renaissance man", at least as much as possible in the modern age ) allowed him to go well beyond science to make his "science fact" articles come alive with human touches.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

I never said "we are definitely alone, and life cannot possibly exist outside of Earth." I merely pointed out that it's not purely a numbers game, and saying "with fifty gazillion infinitrillion planets, surely there are some that have life", because there are many, many variables that would not necessarily be present in most or even many of those planets, let alone those solar systems as well.

But, I remain open minded - to evidence. Sure, there's a chance there could be life elsewhere, but as far as intelligent life...I don't think it's always quite as easy to reach those conditions.

Your claims of open-mindedness sounds like certain people in this country who claim to be 'open-minded and accepting' in their political and moral beliefs....as long as the political or moral view is the same as theirs. If you disagree with them, you are branded as 'closed-minded' - even though their self-ascribed definition of "open-minded" requires them to accept ALL views, not just those that are similar to theirs.

Wrong.It has nothing to do with me wishing to impose my beliefs on you or anyone else.Having an open mind means open to all possibilities.Since I am not 100% sure I consider that it might be true.Whether you are open to all possibilities or not is of no concern to me.I have no proof therefore I am open minded.You seem to disagree with that.Do you have any proof that it is not true?

 

[redduck]

Wrong.It has nothing to do with me wishing to impose my beliefs on you or anyone else.Having an open mind means open to all possibilities.Since I am not 100% sure I consider that it might be true.Whether you are open to all possibilities or not is of no concern to me.I have no proof therefore I am open minded.You seem to disagree with that.Do you have any proof that it is not true?

I'm not sure about this, but, perhaps you have realized your potential.

 

[splitwdw]

I'm hoping for a planet with dinosaurs or a planet that cures cancer or little green men and women that like music. I'm hoping for the best in us and them.