The Electric Vehicle Thread

[TromboneAl]

>>Then it will stay at the speed limit even as the speeder comes up and tailgates.
>This should be fixable with software.

Even if driving manually, what is the proper course of action at this point? That is, you're passing a car at the speed limit, and a tailgater appears.

Go above the speed limit (illegal) and pass faster?

Slow down so you can get behind the car you were passing?

Continue at the speed limit?

None of those is ideal.

One thing that works surprisingly well with tailgaters is to put on the flashers. The tailgater has never failed to drop back a bit, and I haven't gotten shot.

 

[TromboneAl]

Do you think they know Waymo than the Tesla cars?

Good one. Took me a second.

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

>>Then it will stay at the speed limit even as the speeder comes up and tailgates.
>This should be fixable with software.

Even if driving manually, what is the proper course of action at this point? That is, you're passing a car at the speed limit, and a tailgater appears.

Go above the speed limit (illegal) and pass faster?

Slow down so you can get behind the car you were passing?

Continue at the speed limit?

None of those is ideal.

One thing that works surprisingly well with tailgaters is to put on the flashers. The tailgater has never failed to drop back a bit, and I haven't gotten shot.

That covers a lot of what I was thinking. This is a very tough judgement call. Does the car exceed your set speed to pass so you can move over? If so, by how much? Or does it drop its speed, and if so, how far? Some....people (I have less charitable words) don't pay any attention to their speed, and will just automatically pace the other cars around them, so what if the car you're trying to pass starts to slow down or speed up with you?

These things could be made part of the programming, but drivers tend to have strong preferences about some of these choices. That's one of the big obstacles to acceptance of autopilot software; after the lack of control itself, it's the unwillingness to let the car drive in a way that the driver feels is "wrong".

 

[NW-Bound]

... That's one of the big obstacles to acceptance of autopilot software; after the lack of control itself, it's the unwillingness to let the car drive in a way that the driver feels is "wrong".

Eventually, they may be able to have the autopilot programmable to match the owner's personality. He will be able to set his car to drive defensively, or courteously, or like the jerk that he is.

 

[HFWR]

Just activate Tesla’s “trunk-based rocket launcher option”...

 

[travelover]

Just activate Tesla’s “trunk-based rocket launcher option”...

Seems like a car that sophisticated would come with a Trunk Monkey.

 

[Midpack]

The car will get into the passing lane even if there is someone in that lane, far back but approaching fast (over the speed limit). Then it will stay at the speed limit even as the speeder comes up and tailgates.

However, is it also true an autopilot equipped Tesla will change lanes if the driver just signals? Or maybe only when nav is enabled? I don’t understand the logic that would have the car move to the left lane, but if a driver sees a faster car approaching from behind, she could just turn on the right turn signal and the car would change lanes and maintain.

 

[unclemick]

That is SOooooo NOT TRUE! At least not me. I would love to own one but they do not fit my driving style for long distance travel. Plus we have beome a one car family since selling our second toy car and deciding we did not need a second car to gather dust in the Garage.

Unlike a lot of folks here, I like to drive from Dawn to dusk (or however long daylight lasts) on the first day of a long distance drive, E.G., from Florida to Toronto Canada. I do a 10 - 12 hour first day usually, stopping a short time for potty breaks, gas and food. That for me is about 700 - 800 miles. I am in Toronto by Noon the following day. Hampton Inns usually help with the overnight stay.

I am an Engineer and research everything to the max. The day an EV can run for 600m - 700m without charging, I am on it like a fly on S#%t. So please do not lump me into the naysayers camp, or those that just comment for comments sake.

Going up out West - 800 miles to visit is a 'short trip'. However age is creeping up as time marches on.

Have a Polaris EV and rebuilt three wheel Marketeer( 36 volt) for tooling around the farm. Each with 300 watt solar panels.

Got my fingers crossed that I will still be driving(76/77) when electric pickups are out in quantity.

heh heh heh - seeing more and more Tesla's around KC so the itch is building.

 

[Gumby]

...or like the jerk that he is.

They'll call that "BMW Mode".

 

[Ready]

However, is it also true an autopilot equipped Tesla will change lanes if the driver just signals? Or maybe only when nav is enabled? I don’t understand the logic that would have the car move to the left lane, but if a driver sees a faster car approaching from behind, she could just turn on the right turn signal and the car would change lanes and maintain.

Automatic lane change is part of the "Full Self Driving" package that sells for $7K. The basic autopilot included with the car is traffic aware cruise control and lane keep assist.

If you have the FSD package you can use your turn signal to request a lane change and the car will do so if it deems it safe.

You can also use navigate on autopilot to navigate from freeway onramp to offramp and it will change lanes when it's required to do so to transition from one freeway to another. There is an option to allow the driver to first approve the lane change or just let the car do it automatically.

 

[CaptTom]

The car will get into the passing lane even if there is someone in that lane, far back but approaching fast (over the speed limit). Then it will stay at the speed limit even as the speeder comes up and tailgates.

That explains the a-hole in the Tesla out in the passing lane who was tying up the highway for everyone today.

As I said earlier, it's not safe to go faster OR slower than the traffic flow. You are not doing anyone any favor by setting yourself up as a rolling roadblock. You're just being an overly-smug jerk.

[Edit: That was directed at my fellow traveler on the road today, not Al!!!]

 

[HFWR]

During rush, or in heavy traffic, it’s every autonomous vehicle for themselves!

 

[NW-Bound]

As I said earlier, it's not safe to go faster OR slower than the traffic flow. You are not doing anyone any favor by setting yourself up as a rolling roadblock. You're just being an overly-smug jerk...

Many years ago, on the I-10 freeway going from Phoenix to LA, I saw a cop stopping 3 or 4 cars who followed each other at a high speed. These cars passed me, and a few minutes later, I saw a patrol car speeding past me and caught up with these cars. Of course these cars all slowed down when the patrol car zoomed past them. They probably thought they got away this time, and that the cop had an emergency to which he had to respond.

Nope! The cop pulled over some distance ahead, jumped out of his car, and pointed to each of these cars as they drove past him and motioned for them to pull over. Of course they obediently pulled over. The cop most likely had radioed ahead to his buddy down the road, and nobody dared run away.

Now, imagine being the last driver that received his ticket. He was kept waiting for a long time until the cop got to him.

Anyway, I thought it was good that the cop got them all, else it would be unfair to give a citation just to the "leader" car, and let the "followers" get away free.

 

[Ready]

I don’t think it’s a good idea to drive significantly above the speed limit just because everyone else is doing it. I don’t let people intimidate me because I’m trying to obey the law and they want to drive like a maniac. If I need to move over to a slower lane I will do that. But some people have the idea that it’s OK to speed if everyone else is. It is not.

 

[CaptTom]

...Anyway, I thought it was good that the cop got them all, else it would be unfair to give a citation just to the "leader" car, and let the "followers" get away free.

Agreed. I've seen this, too. I've also seen where they set up one officer shooting radar, with a few more farther down the road waving people over and writing tickets. Good for them! Laws are pointless if not enforced.

I don’t think it’s a good idea to drive significantly above the speed limit just because everyone else is doing it. I don’t let people intimidate me because I’m trying to obey the law and they want to drive like a maniac. If I need to move over to a slower lane I will do that. But some people have the idea that it’s OK to speed if everyone else is. It is not.

I also tend to agree, but with a caveat. There's an old saying: "the law is what the lawmen do." Having just driven over 1,200 miles and passing dozens of speed traps across a half-dozen states, I'll tell you exactly what they do. They won't stop anyone unless they're going at least 10 miles over the limit. Often more. I personally went by probably a dozen of them yesterday at 8-9 miles over, driving safely at a good following distance and keeping up with traffic. None of us were pulled over.

Here's my beef: Everyone knows the speed limits are set artificially low, and hence everyone has no respect for them. Eroding respect for the law isn't a good thing.

In my imaginary perfect world, I'd set the speed limits at the highest safe speed, and ticket anyone who exceeded them. But in the real world, it just doesn't work that way. Some self-righteous a-hole out in the left lane trying to make everyone else slow down is far more dangerous than the attentive driver keeping up with traffic.

 

[aaronc879]

I don’t think it’s a good idea to drive significantly above the speed limit just because everyone else is doing it. I don’t let people intimidate me because I’m trying to obey the law and they want to drive like a maniac. If I need to move over to a slower lane I will do that. But some people have the idea that it’s OK to speed if everyone else is. It is not.

I agree with everything you just said.

 

[tn3sport]

Im a fan and watching these discussions closely as I'm done buying purely fuel supplied cars. Done. Will never buy another gas only vehicle. My next will be hybrid or plug in EV.


However, you can could call me Pragmatic Pete.... I just have to take a realistic view on situations to determine if plug-in only EV is the way to go.



I refill my car when it goes to 1/4 tank. I'd be on pins and needles if I let it go to 1/10 of a tank living where I do. You just never know when or where one of those I-75 two hour back-ups is going to occur and I don't want to be low on fuel (or EV charge). So, I never let my car go below 1/4 tank.

So, does the OP really let the battery go to 10% charge before a recharge? is that recharge interval in the map realistic?


Anecdotal experience: My cousin bought two Teslas. He loves them. Can't say enough good things about them. His reason for buying? Atlanta traffic. He gets to use the EV lanes and uses autopilot. His 1 hour commute is more enjoyable now. He was able to turn the most high stress miserable 2 hrs of his day into a pleasant ride. 2 hrs/day 5 days/wk. Significant improvement in quality of life. Now... if he and his wife could only get his kids on board.... They refuse to get out of a car at school with gull wing doors...

 

[Chuckanut]

So, does the OP really let the battery go to 10% charge before a recharge? is that recharge interval in the map realistic?

I thought Teslas will warn a driver if she is approaching the point where the remaining charge won't get her to a charging station.

 

[NW-Bound]

Im a fan and watching these discussions closely as I'm done buying purely fuel supplied cars. Done. Will never buy another gas only vehicle. My next will be hybrid or plug in EV...

One of my wife's nieces bought a hybrid car. As many young people, she is quite idealistic about protecting the environment. She recently had to replace it with a new car, and this time it was a regular ICE car. I have not talked to her to learn the reason, but heard that she had enough trouble with the hybrid and did not want a repeat.

What a shame, as a hybrid car would work so well for her on the congested LA freeways.

 

[TromboneAl]

However, is it also true an autopilot equipped Tesla will change lanes if the driver just signals? Or maybe only when nav is enabled?

Yes, that's exactly right. You can tell the car to change lanes by fully depressing the turn signal stalk but only when in the proper mode.

I don’t understand the logic that would have the car move to the left lane, but if a driver sees a faster car approaching from behind, she could just turn on the right turn signal and the car would change lanes and maintain.

Yes, you can always override at any point by signaling that you want it to change lanes or by taking control.

Here's how it works when in Navigate on Autopilot:

You're driving at 65 MPH and you're coming up to a car driving 62 (you can specify this differential).

Depending on another option you set, the car will either ask you to confirm the lane change (by turning the wheel slightly), or it will go ahead and make the lane change automatically. You can override the change (e.g. if you see a car approaching). It will only make the change when it's safe.

After passing the car, it will sometimes change out of the passing lane but sometimes not.

 

[TromboneAl]

So, does the OP really let the battery go to 10% charge before a recharge? is that recharge interval in the map realistic?

That's an option you set in the route planner (ABetterRoutePlanner.com—not run by Tesla):

I simply hadn't set it (10% is the default). 10% would be about 31 miles for our car. I'd probably want 20% or more for going through the Nevada desert.

Tesla's onboard route planner is similar.

I think it's realistic based on the experience of others on the Tesla forums, etc. The onboard planner monitors things along the way, so it will warn you if anything's changed (no first-hand experience with this yet).

There are lots of fun videos on Tesla road trips.

Here's one by a Valley Girl that's kind of "random" (Valley Girl talk, apparently). At one point they have to reroute because they didn't have enough juice (10:09).

 

[Midpack]

I don’t think it’s a good idea to drive significantly above the speed limit just because everyone else is doing it. I don’t let people intimidate me because I’m trying to obey the law and they want to drive like a maniac. If I need to move over to a slower lane I will do that. But some people have the idea that it’s OK to speed if everyone else is. It is not.

Sounds good, but not necessarily safer to travel at much lower speed than the flow. In most major cities, Chicago to be sure, almost no one drives the speed limit on major roads. On the TriState-I 294, the average speed must be 70-75mph - driving 55 mph is more likely to cause an accident. Parts of I 294 have a 55 mph speed limit posted, but I'd be surprised if 1% are going that slow in fair weather.

And as far as I can tell, few observe the slow and fast lane construct anymore (except maybe on interstates well outside cities where slower cars may stay in the right lane).

 

[NW-Bound]

In more than one instance while driving on European freeways (Spain, Portugal, France), I was driving at or a bit less than the legal limit, and found myself having to keep changing lane to pass the slower trucks. So, I thought it was safe for me to maintain the center lane in order to pass the trucks, while still allowing the faster cars to pass me on the leftmost lane.

Nope! Faster drivers would come up behind me and flash their headlights. Good grief! Could they not pass me on the leftmost lane? Or is that reserved for Ferraris and Lambos that could go 150mph? This was not in Germany where one could go as fast as he wanted.

PS. I need to add that when the above happened, the freeway was not at all congested, and sparsely occupied. Apparently, what I did was not according to the local etiquette. Or did they pick on me with the rental car?

 

[TromboneAl]

And as far as I can tell, few observe the slow and fast lane construct anymore (except maybe on interstates well outside cities where slower cars may stay in the right lane).

Fortunately, that's where we find ourselves. Definitely fewer aggressive and obnoxious drivers here.

I remember driving in Long Beach in 2007 and commenting that: "'at the speed limit' in LA means about 10 MPH slower than everyone else; it makes you feel like a rock in a stream."

 

[TromboneAl]

I made a video today showing how the Tesla will change lanes when it sees a lot of cones next to it. The cones mark off a closed rest area. The car then stays in the passing lane, though that may be because there's a slower car ahead. I signaled for it to change back, first pushing it just a little, and then more firmly.

Lena's recording the video while I'm driving (car in autopilot):