The new way of calculating a restaurant tip

[kcowan]

I've noticed that a lot of restaurant checks that sometimes include the gratuity (like for a large table) figure it at 18 percent on the whole check, including the tax. I wonder if that's meant to come to about 20 percent not including tax.

We first noticed this at South Beach and we asked. They said that large groups often chip in and mostly forget some items or shave the tip so that the bill comes up short.

(Of course we have also noticed restaurants that have this policy printed in tiny type on the menu than also have a tip line on credit machines. Imagine tipping 18% on top of the previously included 18%!)

 

[Koolau]

We first noticed this at South Beach and we asked. They said that large groups often chip in and mostly forget some items or shave the tip so that the bill comes up short.

(Of course we have also noticed restaurants that have this policy printed in tiny type on the menu than also have a tip line on credit machines. Imagine tipping 18% on top of the previously included 18%!)

Yep, this always made me angry - much more than calculating the tip with the tax. It got to the place where, if I didn't see the policy listed on the menu ("We add 18% gratuity to all meals with 8 or more patrons...") I would ask whenever there was a significant sized group. Back in the day, I bounced a couple of managers about the "tip on the tip" and they gave the excuse that they couldn't suppress the tip line (since most of their meals were smaller groups - not subject to the "forced" gratuity.) Then I would ask why they did not point out the potential "double tip" to patrons upon presenting the bill - at which point they would blame the wait staff. I no longer have to worry about "big" groups as that only happened back when I was w*rking. Yet another advantage of ER, heh, heh - no staff "get-togethers."

Since we often visit restaurants offering "specials" (pie on Thursdays - $1, etc.) I have noticed that the "suggested gratuity" always includes the full price of the special when figuring it. I have no problem with this - especially since it's only suggested and not forced.

I have gotten much more generous to wait staff in my old age. I'm much more tolerant of "bad" service as well. I leave at least 20% on anything less than $50. Beyond that, I require "average-good" service to get the full 20%. Just my thing. Now, DW seems to think 15% is plenty, even if the bill is $9. I will often slip an extra dollar on the the table - even alerting the wait staff that "DW shorted them on their tip" if she pays by CC instead of cash. So far, she hasn't caught me at it.

 

[panacea]

Honestly I've never put that much thought into it... regarding the taxes. It's such a little difference. It's pretty rare that'll we'll tip under 15% unless the service is so bad we'd never return to the restaurant. Most of the time we tip 20% rounded up to the nearest dollar and if we really like the server we'll go closer to 25%. And like some others here, we'll tip much higher on a really small bill. I also like over-tipping on a really slow night (25%-100% depending on the size of the bill). I'm sure it makes a difference that DW and I both have restaurant experience from our college years.

 

[Dawg52]

When I was younger I pretty much stuck to 15% pretax. But now that I'm older and a high roller, I've bumped it up to 20%. At the local pub where I meet friends, I usually leave around 30% for the bartender. But she's hot and deserving of it.

 

[Sunset]

I am being picky about tipping the taxman, and I know it doesn't really go to the taxman.
But it is like tipping on top of the gratuity charge, just another way restaurants mislead folks.

Perhaps it's because I don't like tipping.
I think tipping is an archaic practice possibly left over from when only Elitists could travel and dine or when every tavern was owner family run.
Restaurants could pay normal wages and have no tipping like in some other countries.
We do it for lots of other jobs like the grocery cashier.

 

[pb4uski]

I didn't read every reply but dang there are some cheap people here. ...

It took you 4 months and 146 posts to figure that out?

 

[W2R]

It's not that tough, folks. Computing the tax and tip in my head, adding everything up, rounding to the nearest dollar, and then figuring out how much each of us needs to chip in, is part of the math fun that I insist on doing every day at lunch since we eat lunch at a restaurant every day. F does it too, and we doublecheck ourselves that way.

Got to keep our minds active, use it or lose it! We prefer to use it.

 

[Music Lover]

Restaurants could pay normal wages and have no tipping like in some other countries.
We do it for lots of other jobs like the grocery cashier.

But, instead they don't pay a normal wage and then the customer is the "cheap" one for not tipping enough.

 

[Texas Proud]

There is no set rule when it comes to pre tax and the after tax amount. This is just a social convention. I worked in several fine dining restaurants over the last ten years. Most people tip on the after tax amount. I really don't care. People are going to tip what they tip. Often times without regard to the quality of service. With regards to this forum, most are LBYM and aren't spending more than $30-50 per meal for a couple. The tax is negligible. When I go out to eat by myself and the bill is $10-15 I will always leave $4-5.

Often times people have to tip out the people they work with. I remember I had one check for three people. It was $450. They stiffed me (no tip) and I still had to tip out $45 to my busser/runners. I actually lost money when I offered very good service.

Well, paying someone when you got nothing is not right IMO... and mgmt should not be allowing it... they are not your employees and if you got nothing they should get nothing...

 

[Texas Proud]

Just as a point of reference... out tax is 8.25%... which is on the meal...


SO, look at the tax... double it and you are at 16.5%.... adjust accordingly...


I will say that from the little I know that most people who worked in food services tip more than the normal person... I was one of two siblings that did not work as a server and we are 'low' tippers according to the ones who did... even though we are 16% ish...

 

[MJ]

I usually leave around 30% for the bartender. But she's hot and deserving of it.

I hope you aren't serious.

 

[CardsFan]

Since we often visit restaurants offering "specials" (pie on Thursdays - $1, etc.) I have noticed that the "suggested gratuity" always includes the full price of the special when figuring it. I have no problem with this - especially since it's only suggested and not forced.

My experience at a local brewery is just the opposite. There was no recommended tip, and the bill just showed the steeply discounted happy hour prices for beers and appetizers. After leaving a generous tip based on my recollection of the "list prices", I talked to our waitress and suggested they should at least show the full price, then the discount. I think (hope?) most people would tip on the non-discounted price.

After thanking me for the tip, and the comment, she went on to say that the staff refers to happy hour pricing as "half price apps, half price tips".

 

[meierlde]

But, instead they don't pay a normal wage and then the customer is the "cheap" one for not tipping enough.

Actually that is part of the whole $15 minimum wage issue. Removing the exemption for folks that are tipped from the minimum wage. (in most places there is a lower minimum wage for folks that get tips). Now of course the other question is if the server is getting $15 such as in Ca or Seattle, or NYC how much to tip? 20% seems excessive with the higher minimum wage.

 

[W2R]

Actually that is part of the whole $15 minimum wage issue. Removing the exemption for folks that are tipped from the minimum wage. (in most places there is a lower minimum wage for folks that get tips). Now of course the other question is if the server is getting $15 such as in Ca or Seattle, or NYC how much to tip? 20% seems excessive with the higher minimum wage.

I don't know if it is true everywhere, but here waitresses do not get the minimum wage. Not sure why (is it because they are not involved in interstate commerce, maybe?), but anyway they only get about $2/hour plus tips.

We ALWAYS tip because of their low pay. If a waitress or waiter does a great job, we add a little extra.


Edited to add: OK I found this on Wikipedia:

The American federal government requires a wage of at least $2.13 per hour be paid to employees that receive at least $30 per month in tips. If wages and tips do not equal the federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour during any pay period, the employer is required to increase cash wages to compensate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wage_in_the_United_States

 

[CardsFan]

Yep, this always made me angry - much more than calculating the tip with the tax. It got to the place where, if I didn't see the policy listed on the menu ("We add 18% gratuity to all meals with 8 or more patrons...") I would ask whenever there was a significant sized group. Back in the day, I bounced a couple of managers about the "tip on the tip" and they gave the excuse that they couldn't suppress the tip line (since most of their meals were smaller groups - not subject to the "forced" gratuity.) Then I would ask why they did not point out the potential "double tip" to patrons upon presenting the bill - at which point they would blame the wait staff. I no longer have to worry about "big" groups as that only happened back when I was w*rking. Yet another advantage of ER, heh, heh - no staff "get-togethers."

I have had the same experience (and like you, mostly when working and entertaining customers).

On a related topic, has any else noticed the appearance of tip lines when dining in Europe? The menu says, in small print at the bottom, "service compris", and the locals all know not to tip, or just leave a small rounding tip. Makes me wonder if they are trying to take advantage of the gullible Americans.

 

[W2R]

I have had the same experience (and like you, mostly when working and entertaining customers).

On a related topic, has any else noticed the appearance of tip lines when dining in Europe? The menu says, in small print at the bottom, "service compris", and the locals all know not to tip, or just leave a small rounding tip. Makes me wonder if they are trying to take advantage of the gullible Americans.

Trust me, all Americans are not that gullible.

 

[meierlde]

I don't know if it is true everywhere, but here waitresses do not get the minimum wage. Not sure why (is it because they are not involved in interstate commerce, maybe?), but anyway they only get about $2/hour plus tips.

We ALWAYS tip because of their low pay. If a waitress or waiter does a great job, we add a little extra.


Edited to add: OK I found this on Wikipedia:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wage_in_the_United_States

It depends on the laws of the state involved. In Ca its the full rate no exemption for tipped employees. Which means when the wage goes to 15 per hour in 2020 in Ca one should reduce the tip somewhat perhaps back to the old 10%

 

[Dawg52]

I hope you aren't serious.

 

[Drake3287]

When I go out to eat by myself and the bill is $10-15 I will always leave $4-5.

Leaving a 30% to 33% tip every time makes no sense, I don't care how much money you have.

With a $15. an hour minimum wage becoming the law in the near future (at least here in California), many of these restaurant service workers will be getting paid more then Police, Firefighters and certainly Teachers. What a screwed up system we have!

 

[Big_Hitter]

With a $15. an hour minimum wage becoming the law in the near future (at least here in California), many of these restaurant service workers will be getting paid more then Police, Firefighters and certainly Teachers. What a screwed up system we have!

you are going to have some very expensive burgers in CA if that's the case

 

[braumeister]

I never understood why this is a sticking point for people. I always understood the tip to be 15 to 20% of the service. As a customer I agree that the tip is part of the cost of the service. Why wouldn't I tip on the tax?

That's the way I've always looked at it. Most servers work pretty hard for their money, and the small difference is negligible to me. I even take it a step farther and round the total, including tip, up to the nearest dollar.

 

[Drake3287]

Yup, and a lot of smaller places will go out of business!

 

[marko]

Trust me, all Americans are not that gullible.

Having lived in France for many years, I can attest that many (not all) are that gullible.

We've had to tell visitors from the US how it works and sometimes they STILL leave a 15% tip because "they feel guilty walking out not tipping"!

Some places in tourist areas will give you a credit card slip with "gratuity" listed, like in the US; this is illegal but they still do it.

 

[marko]

you are going to have some very expensive burgers in CA if that's the case

And those police, firefighters and teachers (do they really make less than $30k per year? ($15X40X52) Won't be able to afford it.

Seriously, let's not kid ourselves. An increase in the minimum wage will only mean fewer staff, more overworked staff and poorer service. And higher prices that the management can hide behind.

 

[Big_Hitter]

Seriously, let's not kid ourselves. An increase in the minimum wage will only mean fewer staff, more overworked staff and poorer service. And higher prices that the management can hide behind.

maybe we should do a pole on how much a big mac costs in our home towns? that should be a good barometer