Concern re: Job Loss

Craig

Full time employment: Posting here.
Joined
Dec 26, 2004
Messages
714
Alright, this will likely sound a bit goofy, but this is a nearly anonymous board, so let me give this a try.  Your collective wisdom and decency is evident here.

The job market has been pretty tough last few years, and I do financial management for a living.  Great pay when you can land the jobs, but very high pressure, and the average CFO gig only lasts an average of 28 months.  [I've generally stayed employed, but it has been "interesting".]  That 28 months comes from a solid source, and I've seen it in action.  My age 54 wife is training to be a paralegal, and should be working by July or August (likely comp $28K to start).  My age is 53, and we've created $500K liquid savings, plus another $900K in net real estate equity producing about $1,900 net rental income monthly.  The PITI on our home is less than $1,600, though we're paying it off in 5 years with a much higher payment.  No other debt.

We're now able to save significantly while I'm employed, since we've finally learned to LBYM, and, when I run the numbers, it appears we should be fine, even if I couldn't get another job after this one ends.

Still, I'll be honest ... I worry.  We have a 13 year old, and a 21 year old (diagnosed as disabled a year and a half ago, and not likely to ever hold a decent paying job).  Lost both parents in the last 4 years, and I think that adds to my sense of unease.

Now, as I've worked and reworked our numbers and our plan, I've started to wonder if I am going through what perhaps some or most of you went through when you finally decided to stop working.  That is, it must be a leap of faith to finally quit, and begin drawing down your nest egg, especially if you do so in anticipation of SS saving you from depleting your funds.

So, the sensitive, and perhaps too touchy feely question ... have you dealt with this kind of worry, and how have you gotten past the pit in your stomach that tells you to never stop working, and not to touch those savings?  Or is it some algorithm of size of net worth and number of times you work the numbers?  ;)

Thanks.
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

Hey Charles. Let me get quickly by the part where I let you know that we have satellite pictures of your house. You should mow your front lawn, by the way.

Sounds like you've been through a bit of tragedy these last few years. Let me start by saying I'm sorry for the loss of your parents and the other bad news regarding your oldest child.

That can certainly decrease ones sense of stability.

You know what though, there is no clean answer to your question. As someon in the financial business you can run all the scenarios, spreadsheets and what-ifs and know where you stand risk-wise with regards to a stop-work plan.

Make sure you put all the other factors on the other side of the balance sheet. Even the ones you cant measure.

Since I ER'ed, I was able to focus on my love relationship with the lady thats turned out to be the love of my life. My stress level is 1/10th of what it used to be and that certainly doesnt hurt the quality of life that we enjoy. We just had our first baby last month and I will get the pleasure of being his primary caregiver through most of his life. Note I said 'pleasure' after just having him scream blue bloody murder through his bath a couple of hours ago and just changing the most incredibly poopy diapers I could ever imagine.

You have to run your numbers. Ten ways from sunday. When you think you've got a good shot, and truth be told there no such thing as a sure thing, take it. You're going to be nervous for a year or two or three. Use the coping, analytical and managerial skills you've developed over the years to defeat those concerns that make you nervous.

When I was 17, I was worried about hacking it in my first new big job. When I was 24 I was mortified at the prospects of managing people for the first time. When I was 42, I sat sleepless for several weeks over the prospects of becoming someones husband, and at 43, the same over becoming someones daddy!

This too shall pass. Assess your life and make your move.
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

TH is right. All of those "life changes" scared me too.
It's worthy of note that becoming a parent frightened me more than anything before or since and yet
being a "Dad" became the best thing that has happened
in my life.

JG
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

" That is, it must be a leap of faith to finally quit, and begin drawing down your nest egg, especially if you do so in anticipation of SS saving you from depleting your funds."

Thanks.
Craig,
I have not taken the "leap" yet and the quote above hits one of the questions or fears. I remember a movie where it was said "Give your fear (s) a name" once they are named, identified and acknoledged they can be delt with. This would be a great exercise to do with your wife.
On this Sunday morning I can think of several that may or may not apply to you. Maybe others can add to it.
Fears:
Poverty - I've been poor before - I never want to go back there. Add SWR, SS, Stock Market crash other financial concerns here.
Fool - Giving up a high paying easy job; that others envy for the unknown. See the movie "Lost in America"
Boredom - After retiring I have nothing to do and all I do is watch TV all day
Going against my conditioning - I have only been taught to work - the idea of not working was never even thought of
Freak - Am I crazy? I'm 50 and except for this board no one I know ever retired early. No one talks about ER or even the idea of doing what you want in life and not working.
On the outside - Similar to Freak and Fool. After ER you find out it doesn't measure up to your dreams - you made a mistake and can't get back what you had. All those who said that "He who dies with the most things, wins" were correct!
Indecision - Is ER really what I want or is it only an escapist idear because I don't have other ideas. Meaning does it have to be all or nothing? Would I be happy being a bartender instead of a lawyer (I'm neither).

Patton Once said "I do not take countsil from my fears." I'm guessing he at least identified his fears so he knew who they were so he could ignore them.

Another quote is that "Life is a battle between what you love and what you fear." Maybe we need a list of "Loves".

Finally, I do believe that after considerable thought and planning it really is a leap of faith. "Jump and the net shall appear.":confused::confused:
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

Charles: I don't think it sounds goofy at all. I feel exactly the same way re: the leap of faith. I thought I was ready to take the leap but I haven't yet, probably for many of the reasons/fears Dex points out in his post. I'm 45 and by all the numbers I have put together, I "should" be ready to pull the RE trigger. I have been carrying my resignation letter around in my briefcase and each month print up a new one with a new date on it. I can not seem to adjust to the idea of taking money out of my accounts vs. putting it in, and the idea of retiring early will be madness to the people I work with. Fear of the unknown is what it is for me...my spouse even wants to work another year, so there still is some safety net.
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

Now, as I've worked and reworked our numbers and our plan, I've started to wonder if I am going through what perhaps some or most of you went through when you finally decided to stop working.  That is, it must be a leap of faith to finally quit, and begin drawing down your nest egg, especially if you do so in anticipation of SS saving you from depleting your funds.

So, the sensitive, and perhaps too touchy feely question ... have you dealt with this kind of worry, and how have you gotten past the pit in your stomach that tells you to never stop working, and not to touch those savings?  Or is it some algorithm of size of net worth and number of times you work the numbers?  ;)

Thanks.

Craig:
Early retirement is not for everyone. I have seen more early retirements derailed because of other considerations, then financial.
I am a firm believer in motivation, and without that it will always leave you second guessing your decision.
I personally retired just shy of 50. (My friends, etc. thought I nuts. My children were pretty much raised, and homemaker spouse was O.K. with it.
I wanted to change locations, and pursue two activities that I didn't have time for while working. (It has been almost 18 years now, and my enthusiasm is still very strong in those two areas.
Excuse the life story, but I personally believe that without a very solid reason to retire early you will be leaving yourself wide open to doubts.
The "natural high" of not having to answer, or be responsible, to a job wears off after a relatively short period of time, and has to be replaced with activities that bring you a great deal of satisfaction.
As far as your current assets, it appears you would be O.K., but with a 13 year old and a handicapped 21 year old, (Sorry about that, and having raised children with no problems, can only imagine what adding that element into the mix would be like) you might consider soldiering on for a while yet.
You and your wife have done a great job in building assets, and considering your background, I'm sure that you would be able to make a go of it regardless of what decision you made.
Good luck, Jarhead
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

I basically agree with Jarhead, even though I have not seen any ER plans destroyed, mainly because I am not really close to any true ERs. The ones I know about are mainly here or on similar sites.

I think doubts are natural. But, I didn't have any. In fact, you might say I was compelled to quit. However, in
the early going I eased into it by working part time,
and I was a bit nervous when I "crossed the ER Rubicon" for good in 1998. But, the actual fact of doing
it was never in doubt once I saw all of the possibilities
open to me. When my wife gets in a funk I always tell her that the world is our oyster if you can only look at your situation from the right perspective. I really believe that.

JG
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

I, too, agree with Jarhead.

Most important lines of Jarhead's post are: " Early retirement is not for everyone. I have seen more early retirements derailed because of other considerations, then financial. I am a firm believer in motivation, and without that it will always leave you second guessing your decision."

Take your time. Make sure that your medical expenses are nailed down. It looks like your financials are great. What you could do is try it; Take a sabbatical, do something else, and see how you feel about it. Then, depending on your decision, return to working or stay out. Good luck. :)
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

I have the same thoughts. I am sure I will not be bored in FIRE though but taking the jump from a well paying job into the unknown is still difficult for me.

I have reached FI so now every month is used for adding some more padding, but more importantly; evaluating the pros/cons of work.

I have also set a financial target for stopping NO MATTER WHAT being $2M net worth maybe 4-5 years down the road.
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

I basically agree with Jarhead, even though I have not seen any ER plans destroyed, mainly because I am not really close to any true ERs.  The ones I know about are mainly here or on similar sites.



JG

JG: The area where I live, (according to the Chamber of Commerce), and I have no reason to doubt them, has the highest concentration of move-in early retirees, than any other place in Calif.
They move up here, for the same reason I did. A great spot for outdoor possibilities. Skiing, trout fishing, lots of lakes, rivers, good enough weather to allow year round golf, large University near-by, etc. etc.
Playing a lot of golf, and being around many of the early retirees, have time and time again seen many of them go back to work out of sheer boredom.
I personally have never suffered that affliction, but many have.
Retiring early (Especially under age 50), is not for everyone, in my opinion. For the ones that can think outside the box, it's great. :)
I personally wouldn't trade the 18 years I've been retired for any amount of money. But that's just me.
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

So, the sensitive, and perhaps too touchy feely question ... have you dealt with this kind of worry, and how have you gotten past the pit in your stomach that tells you to never stop working, and not to touch those savings?
Bill Clinton, isn't this when you are supposed to reply "I feel your pain"?

REW
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

Hey Charles,

When I took ER I had a part time business that earned
about 1/4 of my income needs and provided the almost
absolute certainty that I could expand the business
if needed to provide the rest. That provided peace of
mind that helped reduce the flutters. I still have the
business BTW after 16 years into retirement.

As a CFO guru, it seems to me that you should be
able to start or buy a small business that uses your
experience .... something that does not require a lot
of capital for entry and can be run on a part time basis.

Obviously this is not for everyone .... just food for
thought.

Cheers,

Charlie
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

Chuck-Lyn,

I've thought the same over the years, but have yet to find the right business. If I was a little closer to having sufficient assets (north of $2M feels necessary), then I'd be tempted to look for the classic mismanaged small business that needs some focus, but not great amounts of capital. At present, I'm too buried in long, long hours in the current gig.

The comments above are giving me some additional perspective. Thank you.
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

No problem, TH ... I took your comments to heart. Hope you didn't mind that old t-shirt, though ... ::)
 
Re: Concern Job Loss

Not at all Charles.

But those shorts! What...Emmitt Kelley have a garage sale? ;)
 
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