Insomnia! Ugh!

[irishgal]

So many good ideas here, I feel I should thank everyone personally.

I will admit I love ambien, but the last time I took it I was rather punch drunk and ordered 4k worth of clothes and shoes from Neiman Marcus online. Had retrograde amnesia, so totally forgot about it until I looked at my email the following day and saw my purchase confirmation. (FWIW my choices were excellent and I did keep everything).

I do need to focus on the meditative ideas, along with keeping away from iPad and iPhone right before bed.

Thanks to everyone who took the time to respond, it was of great help.



Wild Irish Rogue

 

[AllDone]

I no longer have the problem thanks to a combination of retirement and HRT, but if I did, I would give cognitive behavioral therapy a try:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/09/upshot/the-evidence-points-to-a-better-way-to-fight-insomnia.html

 

[irishgal]

I no longer have the problem thanks to a combination of retirement and HRT, but if I did, I would give cognitive behavioral therapy a try:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/09/upshot/the-evidence-points-to-a-better-way-to-fight-insomnia.html

Love it, was academically trained as a PhD psychologist who moved into global healthcare consulting but well versed in CBT, and of course horrible at applying it to myself.. But you are spot on, it's stopping the racing thoughts that would be helpful.


Wild Irish Rogue

 

[zerogravity]

+1 magnesium

+1 mindfulness breathing techniques

+1 remeron ( an antidepressant but in low doses works instead as an antihistamine thus causing drowsiness) ( less than $4 per month prescription)



a condition of apparent weightlessness such as that experienced in orbit or in free fall or my aunts inverse table! Causes blood flow to the brain that might result in amazing thoughts!

 

[ItDontMeanAThing]

Unlike other insomnia threads, no one has mentioned podcasts yet. I do so only because someone started the industrial strength Sleep With Me Podcast | The Podcast That Puts You To Sleep | A Lulling, Droning, Boring Bedtime Story to Distract Your Racing Mind Compared to Sleep with Me, the average Shaggy Dog story* seems like the Cliffs notes of a Hemingway short story.

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaggy_dog_story

 

[W2R]

Unlike other insomnia threads, no one has mentioned podcasts yet.

Good idea! Also I sometimes drift off while listening to just any old podcast late at night, without any intention of doing so. This works best for me if the podcast guest's voice is sort of monotone and his topic is less than riveting.

I still love podcasts as a form of entertainment, and listen to at least one every night. Many are quite interesting to me.

 

[mpeirce]

Unlike other insomnia threads, no one has mentioned podcasts yet. I do so only because someone started the industrial strength Sleep With Me Podcast | The Podcast That Puts You To Sleep | A Lulling, Droning, Boring Bedtime Story to Distract Your Racing Mind Compared to Sleep with Me, the average Shaggy Dog story* seems like the Cliffs notes of a Hemingway short story.
[/URL]

I have an good free Audio Books app

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/audiobooks/id311507490?mt=8

that I have loaded on an old iPhone I keep by my bed. When I wake up in the middle of the night and don't fall right back to sleep I pop in the earbuds (so as not to annoy DW) and fire up this app.

Last summer I was listening to Walden, right now I'm listening to The Odyssey. There are lots of great old (free) books inside this app that help me to fall asleep. And Eventually I do make it through the book and have a new classic under my belt.

 

[audreyh1]

Women approaching menopause often have disturbed sleep - waking up during the night and being unable to go back to sleep.

My progesterone levels had dropped (common in perimenopause), and taking progesterone took care of the sleep issues.

 

[bmcgonig]

I started having trouble falling and staying asleep about 10 years ago. It was so bad that many nights, I didn't sleep at all. The doctor gave me Ambien and then Lunesta. Both worked for a few hours each night but made me feel like I was in a daze the next. After about a month, I built up a tolerance to both and they didn't work anymore. I didn't want to stay on prescription sleep meds anyway.

So I tried just about every OTC sleep aid I could find. None worked very well "except" a particular variety of Unisom sleep tabs. I found there are basically two different ingredients in most OTC sleep aids. Most use Diphenhydramine HCI and a few use Doxylamine Succinate. The ones that use Diphenhydramine HCl don't do anything for me (zero) but the Doxylamine Succinate works great for me and has for the past ten years and with no side effects (that I've noticed). I suspect I'm addicted to them since I take one every night now.

If you decide to try these be careful and look at the ingredients carefully since many bands make sleep aids (including Unisom) with both ingredients. One variety with Diphenhydramine HCI and another with Doxylamine Succinate. Check the labels. I assume one ingredient may work for some people and the other ingredient may work for others. (YMMV so check with your doctor)

Here's some more useful info. The Unisom Advantage - Unisom OTC Sleep-Aids

Good luck, not sleeping for days, really sucks.

Car-Guy..thanks! I tried this back in September and it worked well for me. I don't take a full 25mg, sometimes only a quarter tablet, but now even though I might wake up at 3AM, I go back to sleep quite quickly. Again, thanks!


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum

 

[Amethyst]

I realize it's only AARP, and therefore suspect, but this really is a bit scary. The article lists a host of common sleep aids (mainly antihistamines) whose regular use has been linked to long-term memory loss:

Sleep and Allergy Meds Linked to Dementia, Alzheimer’s – AARP

I started having trouble falling and staying asleep about 10 years ago. It was so bad that many nights, I didn't sleep at all. The doctor gave me Ambien and then Lunesta. Both worked for a few hours each night but made me feel like I was in a daze the next. After about a month, I built up a tolerance to both and they didn't work anymore. I didn't want to stay on prescription sleep meds anyway.

So I tried just about every OTC sleep aid I could find. None worked very well "except" a particular variety of Unisom sleep tabs. I found there are basically two different ingredients in most OTC sleep aids. Most use Diphenhydramine HCI and a few use Doxylamine Succinate. The ones that use Diphenhydramine HCl don't do anything for me (zero) but the Doxylamine Succinate works great for me and has for the past ten years and with no side effects (that I've noticed). I suspect I'm addicted to them since I take one every night now.

If you decide to try these be careful and look at the ingredients carefully since many bands make sleep aids (including Unisom) with both ingredients. One variety with Diphenhydramine HCI and another with Doxylamine Succinate. Check the labels. I assume one ingredient may work for some people and the other ingredient may work for others. (YMMV so check with your doctor)

Here's some more useful info. The Unisom Advantage - Unisom OTC Sleep-Aids

Good luck, not sleeping for days, really sucks.

 

[bmcgonig]

I realize it's only AARP, and therefore suspect, but this really is a bit scary. The article lists a host of common sleep aids (mainly antihistamines) whose regular use has been linked to long-term memory loss:



Sleep and Allergy Meds Linked to Dementia, Alzheimer’s – AARP

Oh wow. It is interesting that the one mentioned by Car-Guy isn't mentioned in that list, although it probably applies.


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum

 

[haha]

Here's a link that references a recent study.

Over-the-counter sleep aids linked to dementia - Medical News Today

Ha

 

[mpeirce]

Unlike other insomnia threads, no one has mentioned podcasts yet.

Speak of the devil.

Chatting with DS (home from college) and he mentioned how he listens to podcasts to fall asleep sometime. His only problem is that sometimes they are too interesting and so he doesn't fall asleep.

He's going to try the Audio Books app I mentioned. It contains lots of old books that are good, but maybe a little boring...

 

[tfudtuckerpucker]

Here's my story regarding Unisom and other sleep meds. Maybe someone will find it helpful. I've been dealing with sleep issues since childhood. I've tried most OTC and naturopathic drugs, and some prescriptions. I studied the topic extensively. I focused on CBT and obsessively worked on sleep hygiene. For many years I ended up on Unisom, which I found to be the most helpful, with the fewest side effects. But I found I was groggy and in a haze. So this year I went to yet another sleep doctor. He suggested I try Ambien/Lunesta, which I have been avoiding. DW and I discussed it- she's an RN. She mentioned she has seen good results in her patients with Trazolam, which she described as a "old school" med. Apparently it's also popular as a recreational drug, at high dosages. And it is addictive, though not so much at lower dosages. My sleep dr was sceptical, but OK'ed it. The results for me have been striking. I mean, I could not believe a drug could be so helpful, with so few side effects. I've been on it for 6 months (0.25mg). I am cautiously hopeful that I can continue on this. Of course, humans are different, so it might not help you. It's generic, costs $6/mo.

 

[Nodak]

DW and I discussed it- she's an RN. She mentioned she has seen good results in her patients with Trazolam, which she described as a "old school" med.

When I had my knee replacement my Dr. gave me a prescription for Triazolam and it worked very well. Unfortunately after 1 year he would no longer prescribe it so I went back to Alteril. For those that like Unisom it is primarily Benedril which is Diphenhydramine HCL and can be purchased at Amazon for about $20 for 1000 capsules.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

I use hydrion paper. What I have found for me is that: highly acid pH = insomnia, highly alkaline pH = even daytime sleepiness.

For acidicity, Milk of Magnesia works for me pretty close to 100% of the time. So does chamomile or peppermint tea.

 

[audreyh1]

I use hydrion paper: highly acid pH = insomnia, highly alkaline pH = even daytime sleepiness.

For acidicity, Milk of Magnesia works for me pretty close to 100% of the time. So does chamomile or peppermint tea.

What are you measuring the acidity of?

 

[daylatedollarshort]

What are you measuring the acidity of?

It is urine testing pH paper. I should add this is what works for me through trial and error. Everybody is different. For me green tea acts like knock out drops while I've read in most people it speeds up metabolism.

 

[David1961]

Many of the herbal supplements out there cause nasal congestion for me. Am probably allergic to one or more of the ingredients.

 

[Bamaman]

I take Ambien almost every night and have been doing so for a very long time. I cut the 10 mg pill in half with a pill cutter and that does the trick. With the pill, I often still only get about 5 hours of sleep - but that is more than enough for me to not feel tired the next day. The doctor is not concerned about me taking ambien for a long time. I have tried the over the counter options and nothing so far has worked. I will read through the links mentioned above and try some of those options.

Ambien & 6 hrs. sleep? Ever try going to the sleep clinic?

My father had just taken an Ambien and the doorbell rang. When he tried to jump up to answer the door, it was like having concrete shoes on. He fell, broke a hip and never made it out of the hospital.

I once took an Ambien--thinking it was another of my tiny pills. 5 minutes later I misjudged the distance at a red light and my foot didn't put enough pressure on the brake. I tapped a little old lady in the (car's) tail end.

As someone with sleep apnea, I use a CPAP machine and it makes me sleep so much better. I would never take Ambien again as I work hard enough physically around the house to be tired at bedtime.

 

[Car-Guy]

Car-Guy..thanks! I tried this back in September and it worked well for me. I don't take a full 25mg, sometimes only a quarter tablet, but now even though I might wake up at 3AM, I go back to sleep quite quickly. Again, thanks!


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum

You are certainly welcome. Glad it works for you "too".

 

[Car-Guy]

I realize it's only AARP, and therefore suspect, but this really is a bit scary. The article lists a host of common sleep aids (mainly antihistamines) whose regular use has been linked to long-term memory loss:

Sleep and Allergy Meds Linked to Dementia, Alzheimer’s – AARP

I keep forgetting to read this article for some reason...

I didn't see the variety of Unisom that I've been using on the list but to be honest, even it it was, I'd continue to use it. My sleeping problem was that bad, so I'll take the risk. But I "might try" to cut the pills in half and see if they still work for me. So thanks for the info.

 

[Ronnieboy]

I keep forgetting to read this article for some reason...

I didn't see the variety of Unisom that I've been using on the list but to be honest, even it it was, I'd continue to use it. My sleeping problem was that bad, so I'll take the risk. But I "might try" to cut the pills in half and see if they still work for me. So thanks for the info.

Doxylamine is an anticholinergic which was what was studied for the dementia/long term memory results. I would try half, the worst that might happen is a crappy night sleep, but if you have been using it nightly for 10 years, it might not work and I'm kinda surprised that the original dose is still working.
Good luck

 

[DrRoy]

I've had varying degrees of insomnia over the years. Sometimes it is trouble getting to sleep, but more often waking early and not getting back to sleep. It seems to be more of an issue as I get older. I have the recommended routine and bedtime habits but that only goes so far. I mostly use Diphenhydramine HCL at the lowest dosage needed. I will take partial pills until it has worked, and so far have never needed more than a regular dose. I also have melatonin, but that only has a light effect for me.

A third option I use that I have not seen mentioned here is prescription Lorazepam, an anti-anxiety medication. This works well but I only use it once or twice a week to avoid building resistance.

 

[Car-Guy]

I'm kinda surprised that the original dose is still working.
Good luck

Maybe it's physiological and/or physical dependence?