Preferred Stock Investing-The Good , The Bad and The In Between 2015 - 2020

[aja8888]

Mulligan,


After reading about the emergence of PG&E from BK, I decided to tiptoe in and try to scalp some coin from this event.


Just bought 42 shares @ $27.50. Now I wait.

Which issue and why such an odd number of shares?

 

[Coolius]

aja,


It was PCG-A. My order was for an even 200, but only 42 shares filled at $27.50.


I still have that partial order out there, but am not optimistic of being filled. That was a sudden drop from $27.75 down to $27.41. When I saw the drop I figured to get in on the action, and that was the result.


Update: Just filled for another 44 shares.

 

[aja8888]

aja,


It was PCG-A. My order was for an even 200, but only 42 shares filled at $27.50.


I still have that partial order out there, but am not optimistic of being filled. That was a sudden drop from $27.75 down to $27.41. When I saw the drop I figured to get in on the action, and that was the result.

Thanks, I'm looking to buy some of that too. I have not placed an order yet though.

 

[Mulligan]

Mulligan,


After reading about the emergence of PG&E from BK, I decided to tiptoe in and try to scalp some coin from this event.


Just bought 42 shares @ $27.50. Now I wait.

Coolius, They are your electric provider, right? As you know they have high rates. So you gotta buy a lot more if you want them to pay you instead of you paying them, ha...

 

[Coolius]

Yep, PG&E supplies my natural gas. My electricity is supplied by SMUD, which is the provider for the county I'm residing in.


Seems like the BK emergence is going as expected. So the real gain would be dividends beyond June 30.


Mulligan, since some of the Preferreds are not redeemable, are there any tricks that PG&E can employ to get those off their books? Maybe a tender. perhaps?

 

[aja8888]

FYI, I just picked up 100 of PCG-A for $27.55.

 

[pb4uski]

FYI, I just picked up 100 of PCG-A for $27.55.

Good deal.

 

[Coolius]

Mulligan, a thought just occurred to me; is there any possibility that PG&E could pay accrued preferred dividends in the form of common stock?



If they do, then the attractiveness of the accrued dividend is lessened somewhat, unless one sells the stock immediately upon receipt.



And are there any arrangements between the Govt & PG&E to avoid BK due to similar happenings with future fires?

 

[Mulligan]

Hey Coolius, no these are traditional preferreds to be paid in cash. In fact the court document for bankruptcy approval showed on cash flow statements, $42 million in preferred stock dividends to be disbursed by end of year. That is exactly 3 years of then accrued dividends.
In reality PCG preferreds are “irrelevant” in terms of capitalization. All of them combined is less than half the value of say NI-B is by itself. $14 million in dividend payments is total chump change. They were paying out a billion a year in common stock dividends pre fire.
So it was just economic show that they were suspended to begin with as that amount is just communal office petty cash compared to enterprise value of the company.

 

[Mulligan]

PCG litigants officially approved bankruptcy proposal Friday, almost 90%. Next week regulators will stamp their approval before Judge winds it up.

 

[Coolius]

Mulligan,


I read that there was some kind of delay because one of the PG&E plaintiffs wrote some kind of e-mail that is causing problems....have you heard that?


I was thinking that could be one reason why PCG-A dropped yesterday.

 

[bobandsherry]

Mulligan,


I read that there was some kind of delay because one of the PG&E plaintiffs wrote some kind of e-mail that is causing problems....have you heard that?


I was thinking that could be one reason why PCG-A dropped yesterday.

I'm not sure what specific email you are referring to, but there was a question raised a couple weeks ago and judge tossed it out. And not sure where you are seeing PCG-A dropped, I see it was up $0.38 (1.38%) yesterday, closed $28. If there was something serious you'd see all issues drop, not just a single issue.

 

[Coolius]

BobandSherry,


Here is the article from a local TV station, KCRA3. It was dated May 21st, 2020



BERKELEY, Calif. — California power regulators unexpectedly delayed a key vote Thursday on Pacific Gas & Electric's plan for getting out of bankruptcy after saying one of the utility's most outspoken critics sent an improper email attacking the company's proposal to pay wildfire victims.



California Public Utilities Commission President Marybel Batjer was irked by the need to postpone the vote because of the email sent Tuesday by Will Abrams, a survivor of a 2017 wildfire that tore through his Santa Rosa hometown.




The communication came during a mandated quiet period from May 15 through Thursday involving the vote on PG&E’s $58 billion plan for ending its nearly year-and-a-half-old bankruptcy. The vote was delayed until May 28, which coincides with a federal bankruptcy court trial on the plan.
State power regulators and a U.S. bankruptcy judge must approve PG&E's plans by June 30 for the company to qualify for coverage from California's wildfire insurance fund. PG&E should still be able to meet that deadline.
In the email, Abrams reiterated objections to PG&E's plan filed with the bankruptcy court by a committee that represents wildfire victims about their growing doubts the utility will be able to pay $13.5 billion it has pledged to a fund for the fire victims.


Batjer delayed the vote so PG&E and other parties could respond to Abrams' email. Another quiet period will start Friday and continue through May 28. Batjer warned of “serious consequences,” including potential fines, for any other violations.


Abrams told The Associated Press he didn't think he was doing anything wrong because his email didn't include any commentary that hadn't already been entered into the record. “I tried my best to follow the rules,” Abrams said.


PG&E said in a statement that it appreciated regulators' diligence. The company has consistently hailed its plan as the best way to to pay wildfire victims and position the utility to make badly needed upgrades to its electrical equipment to prevent more deadly disasters.


Abrams has repeatedly lambasted the plan as a boon for short-term investors trying to capitalize on PG&E and a ticking time bomb for the 16 million people who rely on PG&E for power in Northern California.

 

[bobandsherry]

Thanks Coolius, hadn't seen that one. Sounds more like a nuisance than issue. Interesting how an "improper email" can cause any delay, seems if it's improper it's discarded - for me not worried.

 

[Coolius]

Bob, I totally agree with you. It's a nuisance, a speed bump on the road to the decision.


This guy seems to be a singular loose cannon and his opinion is definitely NOT that of 85% of the victims.



I was just thinking that this might be an opportunity to pick up more PCG Preferreds if nervous nellies get spooked and sell.

 

[pb4uski]

Thanks Coolius, hadn't seen that one. Sounds more like a nuisance than issue. Interesting how an "improper email" can cause any delay, seems if it's improper it's discarded - for me not worried.

+1 not sure why it was improper... perhaps it was sent after the period for public input had expired.... but if it was improper then it should have been ignored.

My bet is that this Will Abrams a-hole is a lawyer.

 

[bobandsherry]

Bob, I totally agree with you. It's a nuisance, a speed bump on the road to the decision.


This guy seems to be a singular loose cannon and his opinion is definitely NOT that of 85% of the victims.



I was just thinking that this might be an opportunity to pick up more PCG Preferreds if nervous nellies get spooked and sell.

Well, that's good thinking and always worth putting a hook in the water and see what bites.

Since the judge stated this "Batjer delayed the vote so PG&E and other parties could respond to Abrams' email. Another quiet period will start Friday and continue through May 28. Batjer warned of “serious consequences,” including potential fines, for any other violations."

Have to wonder why violating the mandated quiet period the sender wasn't given a fine. Further why it resets anything. But reset the dates and still ends on the same date as the BK trial date for the plan.

 

[bobandsherry]

+1 not sure why it was improper... perhaps it was sent after the period for public input had expired.... but if it was improper then it should have been ignored.

My bet is that this Will Abrams a-hole is a lawyer.

Yeah, as mentioned there is mandated quiet period, so you think the Pub Util President would have just said "shhh" and let things proceed. I see it was he "reiterated objection" so sounds like he's just one who likes to complain about the settlement. Maybe he's hoping for a little "hush" money.

 

[Texas Proud]

I would think its just the dividends not the shares. But remember many of these shares probably never made it into DTC. They were just paper issuances that never converted.

The conversion took effect in 2001, I was told they sent to state in 2005... so there is nothing left at computershares...


Still can not get an answer on how much it is so I can determine if it is too small for me to pursue...



I just got a check from Texas for $23... it took me a bit but did get it... the last thing I sent in was the last I was going to do so glad I got it.

 

[Mulligan]

+1 not sure why it was improper... perhaps it was sent after the period for public input had expired.... but if it was improper then it should have been ignored.

My bet is that this Will Abrams a-hole is a lawyer.

Ya, this was all a nothing burger. Just delayed the inevitable a few days. Everything appears on track. Wish I could get a more definitive answer on assessed credit quality of new debt. As that would of course lay the appropriate tracking of the preferred yields. Though that isnt nearly as precise in ute world as ute preferreds tend to get the benefit of the doubt in most cases.

 

[Mulligan]

The conversion took effect in 2001, I was told they sent to state in 2005... so there is nothing left at computershares...


Still can not get an answer on how much it is so I can determine if it is too small for me to pursue...



I just got a check from Texas for $23... it took me a bit but did get it... the last thing I sent in was the last I was going to do so glad I got it.

I missed something somewhere...I thought we were talking in generalities. You are specifically looking for owed dividend monies? What issue was it?

 

[Texas Proud]

I missed something somewhere...I thought we were talking in generalities. You are specifically looking for owed dividend monies? What issue was it?

Prudential. My mom bought a life insurance policy in the mid 1930s before SS existed... the last change made to the policy was when she got married and made my dad the beneficiary in 1941.... so Prudential had the address of my mom as the one she had in 1941.


Prudential changes to a C corp and she is supposed to get shares or something of value... I have been trying to run down the value of whatever it is she has and who has it. As of now I am told that Computershare did have an account for her but sent the funds into New York state in 2005. They would not tell me much more than that as they could not find all the paperwork I had sent into them showing I was executor. New York state sent me a letter months ago saying they will look into it.

 

[Sunset]

Prudential. My mom bought a life insurance policy in the mid 1930s before SS existed... the last change made to the policy was when she got married and made my dad the beneficiary in 1941.... so Prudential had the address of my mom as the one she had in 1941.


Prudential changes to a C corp and she is supposed to get shares or something of value... I have been trying to run down the value of whatever it is she has and who has it. As of now I am told that Computershare did have an account for her but sent the funds into New York state in 2005. They would not tell me much more than that as they could not find all the paperwork I had sent into them showing I was executor. New York state sent me a letter months ago saying they will look into it.

This is my nagging thought, it must happen quite a bit, where money just gets lost, because the records are old and nobody (my parents) told me about "things". So it was a hunt, and I'll basically never know if I missed something.

Sort of related just about 4 years ago, in our 100 yr old family cabin, I wanted to hide something so it would not be stolen when people broke in (which happens now and then).

So I found a good spot, and when I opened it up to put in my stuff, I found a TREASURE that I can only surmise Grandfather had hidden there. Obviously due to the nature of the TREASURE, my Parents never knew it was there, or they would have not left it there.

Now of course I'm wondering about other spots around the cabin, and previous homes Grandfather lived in.

 

[Winemaker]

This is my nagging thought, it must happen quite a bit, where money just gets lost, because the records are old and nobody (my parents) told me about "things". So it was a hunt, and I'll basically never know if I missed something.

Sort of related just about 4 years ago, in our 100 yr old family cabin, I wanted to hide something so it would not be stolen when people broke in (which happens now and then).

So I found a good spot, and when I opened it up to put in my stuff, I found a TREASURE that I can only surmise Grandfather had hidden there. Obviously due to the nature of the TREASURE, my Parents never knew it was there, or they would have not left it there.

Now of course I'm wondering about other spots around the cabin, and previous homes Grandfather lived in.

When we sold DW's grandmother's house back in 2003, the neighbor told us that 92 year old grandma, who had all of wits, would go to the nearby grocery store every day and buy all the groceries she could carry. Never went to the bank because it was too far too walk, but paid for her groceries with 2 new $20 bills everyday. She was a spy feisty lady who never left the city she was born, and lived in, despite her husband having a railroad pass as a retiree. We looked and looked for the stash, but it went with the house.

 

[aja8888]

When we sold DW's grandmother's house back in 2003, the neighbor told us that 92 year old grandma, who had all of wits, would go to the nearby grocery store every day and buy all the groceries she could carry. Never went to the bank because it was too far too walk, but paid for her groceries with 2 new $20 bills everyday. She was a spy feisty lady who never left the city she was born, and lived in, despite her husband having a railroad pass as a retiree. We looked and looked for the stash, but it went with the house.

Too bad you didn't use a money-sniffing dog to comb the house before you sold it. Or...you could have just let my ex-wife in there for a while and no way would any cash be left behind.