bobandsherry
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Obviously investors didn't take as "good news", now trading below price before Musk started teasing on news. What a shame that he suckers people to pump the stock. SMH
Thoughts on TESLA
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You are correct. I got suckered in at 293. I feel shamed and optimistic all at the same time.
bobandsherry
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I referred to those who pumped the stock after the "good news" tweets, they got super suckered into buying up to $320. How'd you like to be the suckers who bought at $320 yesterday based on Musks tweets. As they say, buy on the rumor, sell on the news.
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I hear you.
ls99
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Deletd tesla related suspension issues article, NHTSA did not confirm.
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bobandsherry
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Yet again, another accident with Tesla running under trailer.
Tesla Model 3 driver again dies in crash with trailer, Autopilot not yet ruled out
https://electrek.co/2019/03/01/tesla-driver-crash-truck-trailer-autopilot/
Tesla Model 3 driver again dies in crash with trailer, Autopilot not yet ruled out
https://electrek.co/2019/03/01/tesla-driver-crash-truck-trailer-autopilot/
NW-Bound
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Exactly like what happened in 2016, when a Model S went under a semi-trailer. This new accident is also in Florida. And again the Tesla car got its top sheared off going under a trailer.
The fault may be with the truck driver, but the Tesla driver, or non-driver as it appeared, would not die if he kept his eyes on the road and not trusted the "autopilot" to be able to see obstacles on the road and to brake for him.
People will never learn, I guess. They simply do not want to believe that Tesla "autopilot" is simply an advanced cruise control system, and not a truly autonomous system. They trusted the "autopilot" with their life, and they lost.
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Lakewood90712
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It's time for Tesla to offer dealer franchises. Most people, not the early adopters, need to feel , touch, and drive one before purchase.
The franchise fees alone will be significant. The dealers will take on a lot of the financial and other burdens : Car and parts inventory, most customer service, trade in issues. Dealers can also pump sales volume when incentive's match the task.
The franchise fees alone will be significant. The dealers will take on a lot of the financial and other burdens : Car and parts inventory, most customer service, trade in issues. Dealers can also pump sales volume when incentive's match the task.
ncbill
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We've been over this...gasoline/diesel-fueled vehicles catch fire all the time.
And unlike the Tesla, there's usually no skid plate to prevent road debris from being kicked up and damaging high-pressure fuel lines.
You're FAR less likely to experience a vehicle fire in a Tesla than in any conventional vehicle.
The report says the car drove itself another 500 yards after the accident. Seems if Autopilot is engaged and drives a car under a truck shearing off the top of the car, Autopilot could at least be smart enough to then drive the hulk to an emergency room. Or maybe it could pull over and burn up to destroy the evidence of what happened.
NW-Bound
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Emergency room after the top of the car is sheared off? And the driver does not know to lay low across the passenger seat? You meant the morgue.
In the 2016 case, there was absolutely no skid mark to indicate that there was any attempt to brake, by the autopilot or the human non-driver. It appeared to be the same this time, if the car ended up 500 yards down the road from the accident.
But worry not. Musk promised full hand-off autopilot soon, when the car can navigate the shopping mall parking lot to pick you up at the store entrance, then drive you home safely and park itself in your garage. Staying away from semi-trailers on the highway is no sweat compared to the above feat.
In the 2016 case, there was absolutely no skid mark to indicate that there was any attempt to brake, by the autopilot or the human non-driver. It appeared to be the same this time, if the car ended up 500 yards down the road from the accident.
But worry not. Musk promised full hand-off autopilot soon, when the car can navigate the shopping mall parking lot to pick you up at the store entrance, then drive you home safely and park itself in your garage. Staying away from semi-trailers on the highway is no sweat compared to the above feat.
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NW-Bound
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Test videos of cars vs. semi-trailers. Good lesson for people to keep their eyes on the road.
Just a Reminder
Getting a little hysterical over the safety of Tesla cars. Just a reminder:
https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2018/TESLA/MODEL%25203/4%2520DR/RWD
Five stars across the board and no fiery explosions during any of the tests. Tesla crashes get a lot of hype, but the testing and real life averages do not support the notion that they are more dangerous than other cars; just the opposite.
Getting a little hysterical over the safety of Tesla cars. Just a reminder:
https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2018/TESLA/MODEL%25203/4%2520DR/RWD
Five stars across the board and no fiery explosions during any of the tests. Tesla crashes get a lot of hype, but the testing and real life averages do not support the notion that they are more dangerous than other cars; just the opposite.
Yes. These advanced sensory systems should be limited to a few specific actions: obstacle/lane alarms, autonomous braking for emergencies, parallel parking, and perhaps adaptive speed cruise control. I’m confident Anything more is going to lull the below-average driver, and tired average drivers, into complacency.
Vehicle auto-pilot should only be marketed after they are demonstrably safer than human drivers. And for the sake of us luddites, demonstrably much safer! Otherwise Tesla and other AI driving systems risk a vicious market backlash, endless court cases, and overreacting legal bans.
Rant over. I don’t want to get too off topic.
When the company selling the car was promoting it as “Full Self-Driving” mode until late last year, it’s not surprising that people are confused about this capability.
ERD50
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Yes, we have been over this. Have you been paying attention? How about you provide some comparable data, as was asked at that time?
This is kinda old 2003-2007, but it shows 73% of car fires are due to mechanical/electrical failure or malfunction, another 8% to intentional(!), 3% to collision/overturn, and 5% to exposure to other fire. I guess 12% undetermined?
The point is, this is across all cars on the road. The average age of the car fleet is ~ 12 years, so some significant number are older than that (not exactly half, unless even distribution). . What it the average age of the Tesla fleet? Maybe one year?
Clearly, old cars are going to be more subject to fire, and/or poor maintenance. And the 8% intentional - likely older cars to collect insurance?
So can you find data on fires in cars that are on the road for the same as the Tesla average fleet, let's compare that, shall we?
And perhaps EVs have an advantage over time (but I want to see the data). If those reported mechanical/electrical failures are due to gas leaks, or electrical faults igniting gas in aging cars, then maybe EVs won't exhibit the same rate of aging in their systems. Or maybe they will? I don't think we can say at this point.
https://www.nfpa.org/-/media/Files/...ports/Fact-sheets/vehiclefactsheet.ashx?la=en
Well, a gas tank doesn't have anywhere near the exposure that the Tesla battery pack does. As I mentioned, mine are roughly 1.5' by maybe 2', and tucked up and behind the rear axle. Fuel lines are a tiny target compared to that battery pack.
Again, provide some comparable data. It's not hysterical, as has been pointed out, this is new tech with new challenges (battery fires are FAR harder to extinguish than a gas fire).
Did any gas car have fiery explosions during any of the tests? Is this relevant?
I'll give you a chance to reduce any 'hysteria" - and you can do that with facts and figures. So how about you find the guidelines for extinguishing an EV fire, and publish them here? I've found them before and posted them here, and they are very involved, requiring huge amounts of water and time. The fire needs to be cooled, not just deprived of O2.
-ERD50
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A five star safety rating is all the data that I have. If you have data that suggests Tesla does not deserve such a rating, then produce it. I have seen nothing to indicate that Tesla drivers are in greater peril than the drivers of any other mass market vehicle. Again, if you know otherwise, then show us some "comparable data" instead of playing devil's advocate.
Regarding fires, you know that every Tesla fire related crash gets extra play time on this thread and in the news. That is an implied hit against Tesla safety in a crash. Noting that such fiery explosions don't seem to occur in most accident scenarios (as is shown by the 5 star rating), counters this implied deficiency, obviously.
ERD50
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Are you ever, even one single time, going to actually address the context of my posts?
The subject was - Tesla fires. No one was debating the 5 star safety rating. But you deflect, apparently because you have no answer.
And it wasn't about news coverage of the fires, it was about the fires. I reserve judgement (either way) until we have comparable data. But the relative difficulty in putting out a Lithium Battery fire is still an issue.
"instead of playing devil's advocate."
Every investor should play devil's advocate. What's the problem?
-ERD50
Are you ever, even one single time, going to actually address the context of my posts?
The subject was - Tesla fires. No one was debating the 5 star safety rating. But you deflect, apparently because you have no answer.
And it wasn't about news coverage of the fires, it was about the fires. I reserve judgement (either way) until we have comparable data. But the relative difficulty in putting out a Lithium Battery fire is still an issue.
"instead of playing devil's advocate."
Every investor should play devil's advocate. What's the problem?
Thank you for conceding that you have no "data" to back-up the notion that Tesla drivers are in more danger than the drivers of other cars.
Lithium battery fires are an interesting topic, but not the purpose behind this thread. I suggest you start a separate thread on lithium battery fires unless you can show a connection with Tesla safety (supported, of course, with real "comparative data").
Chuckanut
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Agreed. A former co-worker had two cars go up in flames on her in about 10 years. Both were parked and had nothing bad happen to them before being burnt to a crisp. It does happen.
At about 80,000 miles my old Pontiac had a gasoline leak from the carb that could not be permanently fixed other than to buy a factory rebuilt carb for $1500. That was one of many reasons I decided to get rid of it. The fire risk to me and my family was just to great, plus it made the garage smell awful for about 1/2 hour after I parked it.
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Chuckanut
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ERD50
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The question was fires, which act differently from gas fires, not overall safety. So if you contend Teslas have less of a fire problem than comparable vehicles, you present the data. As I said, I reserve judgement until I see the data. So another straw man from you, since I never claimed they were worse or better.
When Tesla stops using Lithium batteries, it will stop being a topic on a Tesla thread.
BTW, I just took a closer look at my car. My ~ 1.5' x 2' gas tank has a full 15" of ground clearance, is behind a cross member that extends across and below the tank, and provides considerable protection, and much of the tank has the muffler under it (with a heat shield and air space in between), providing additional buffer/protection.
-ERD50
In summary, the best empirical data shows that Tesla makes very safe cars.
Side note: lithium battery fires are hard to extinguish.
ERD50
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What data is that? The 5 star safety rating is impressive, but what about real world comparable data (same age/type of vehicle, same age range driver)?
Do you have that data?
Yes, and there was another point - that the large amount of battery area exposed and so low to the ground might make the Tesla more susceptible to fire from road debris than a gas car's tank is. I don't think there is enough data on that, so we can't say one way or the other. But it sure doesn't look good to me.
-ERD50
Texas Proud
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You say that, but is it true... look at my previous post where you have to compare apples to apples... that means fire per 100,000 miles driven and also adjusted for age of the car...
I really do not know the answer and do not know if it is available or not... but just stating that on raw number the Tesla is better is not saying anything...
Edit... seems ERD already took this on with lots more words...
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