Thoughts on TESLA

[Running_Man]

I interpreted as meaning that solar production of the charging stations would generate all the electricity that was needed to charge the vehicles, not that they wouldn't be connected to the grid.

https://twitter.com/x/status/873131202663690240

Actually Elon said he would be disconnected from the grid as you can see in this tweet. This was in response this was actually being powered by coal Elon answered with this tweet, when the individual correctly noted a football size field would be needed for each supercharger Elon did not answer and instead other Tesla owners claimed that Elon needed to be connected to the grid to send all the excess electricity back to society. Of course "over time" for Elon is before he dies.

 

[JoeWras]

I interpreted as meaning that solar production of the charging stations would generate all the electricity that was needed to charge the vehicles, not that they wouldn't be connected to the grid.

He clearly said "disconnect from the grid."

 

[clifp]

https://twitter.com/x/status/873131202663690240

Actually Elon said he would be disconnected from the grid as you can see in this tweet. This was in response this was actually being powered by coal Elon answered with this tweet, when the individual correctly noted a football size field would be needed for each supercharger Elon did not answer and instead other Tesla owners claimed that Elon needed to be connected to the grid to send all the excess electricity back to society. Of course "over time" for Elon is before he dies.

I guess it depends what you mean by off the grid. I often say that I'm "almost" off the grid since the Tesla plus my solar panels mean I used a few hundred KWH/month from the grid. I see he did say disconnect which is different word than "off" the grid, but I interpret it as the same.

It doesn't make sense to physically disconnect from the grid, for all the reason people point out. Also he did use the words "over time". Time is a very fluid concept in Elon-speak, and almost certainly twice as long as what he initially says.

 

[JoeWras]

It doesn't make sense to physically disconnect from the grid, for all the reason people point out. Also he did use the words "over time". Time is a very fluid concept in Elon-speak, and almost certainly twice as long as what he initially says.

And that's what makes it frustrating. He's vague enough to make an argument for everyone.

To the coal plant hater: "Good, they will be off the grid."
To the engineers watching: "Good, it will happen far into the future, because initially they must be connected since the math doesn't make sense with today's panel technology."

I admire Elon for many of the things he's done, but his marketing antics really are annoying.

 

[clifp]

And that's what makes it frustrating. He's vague enough to make an argument for everyone.

To the coal plant hater: "Good, they will be off the grid."
To the engineers watching: "Good, it will happen far into the future, because initially they must be connected since the math doesn't make sense with today's panel technology."

I admire Elon for many of the things he's done, but his marketing antics really are annoying.

No argument here. For a genius, he says a lot of stupid things. It is even worse if you work there.

 

[NW-Bound]

To me, Musk is a BS'ing marketeer who happened to raise enough money to hire good engineers to carry out some of his ideas. To that, I give him credit.

But no engineers will be good enough to repeal the laws of physics.

 

[NW-Bound]

Forgot to add, I read the Twitter thread posted above, and indeed many people asked how large a solar farm would be needed to support a charging installation. Not everyone is fooled.

I do not have a Twitter account, let alone the desire to follow silly tweets. They would drive me nuts, and raise my blood pressure.

 

[Lakewood90712]

Tesla at the LA Auto show

Just got back. Lots of interesting cars of most brands except Ferrari , Bentley and Bugatti weren't there. First time in a Tesla. Model 3 looks great, but way to cramped for me, bumped my head getting in. Model X very roomy.

 

[ERD50]

I'm re-posting a portion of my earlier post below. I'd be interested in hearing the numbers from the Tesla owners. I've read a bit about the costs of Tesla's recc service plan, but it seems you need to be an owner to get access to the data, and it was hard to put together from random posts I found.

... And, the car has no required service other than tire rotation and changing the brake fluid every 2 years. So much fewer trips to the service center than my Lexus requires. Every time I do a routine 5,000 mile maintenance on the Lexus I spend at least $300, and once it get to around 15,000 it seems to run closer to $1,000. Over many years that really begins to add up compared to the Tesla.

I can understand objections to EVs. But I have to say the appeal of Hybrids is lost to me. They strike me as the toaster oven of the car universe.

You are lugging around and having to maintain all the crap associated with ICE cars radiators, fuel injection systems, transmissions and plus an engine. ....

Our ICE maintenance costs are no where near that. Why are yours so high? Looking back at our 2011 Honda CRV: ....

So seven years, and for non-EV stuff we are talking average of less than $80 a year. . And maybe another ~ $60/year if I needed a brake job, and amortize that. Roughly $140/year, add another $$10 to include next battery replacement.

....

How does that compare to Tesla's recc service? I bet they are a lot higher, as a local garage won't handle some of that? And I've seen they recc battery coolant replacement at year 4. My (radiator) coolant is on the minder, with no mileage listed in the manual, and it has not asked for it yet. My trans fluid is lifetime if I don't tow (I don't).

Tire rotations, cabin filter, wipers, etc are common to EV, so no change there.

I'll bet that Tesla's maintenance costs are higher (probably by a lot) than mine, because little is tied to the ICE, and you have to go to Telsa for this, which I bet it far higher than Matt (who I know and can actually trust) at my local shop.

-ERD50

 

[38Chevy454]

The solar parking cover on the charging stations is a perfect example of why solar panels for the roof of an electric car will have negligible effect. There is just not enough area to generate any amount of electricity that would actually effect the charge status of the car batteries.

 

[NW-Bound]

The solar parking cover on the charging stations is a perfect example of why solar panels for the roof of an electric car will have negligible effect. There is just not enough area to generate any amount of electricity that would actually effect the charge status of the car batteries.

And that's why no car makers bother to put a solar roof on their EVs.

Pointless, unless you just want to maintain a bit of charge if you park the car for a very long time (like several months), and want to keep the electronics alive for the car to maintain contact with the Web.

 

[gerntz]

An EV owner can consult his manual to see what the car maker recommends. However, just from the technical info regarding lithium batteries in general, I can see the following practices.

1) If the battery was charged before getting cold soaked, discharging (driving) is OK as long as the current demand is reduced. Remember that charging is a big nono, but discharging at a lower current is OK. The battery will warm itself up as it is being "worked". Or some of its juice could be used in a heater for self-warming, as the battery has a circulatory coolant system for temperature control. This could explain why the range of EVs is reduced in the winter, because not just the passenger compartment needs heat, but the battery needs to warm itself too.

2) If the cold-soaked battery is discharged and an AC outlet is available for charging, the car electronics will turn on an electric heater in the battery coolant system to heat up the battery with that AC power, then turns on the charger once the temperature is sufficiently raised.

Thanks. Sounds like a lot of thought & effort vs just pushing a button to start an engine.

 

[Rianne]

60 minutes interview with Elan Musk last night. Interesting view of the world.

 

[JoeWras]

Interesting that why we are fiddling on this thread, TSLA has had a nice run up in stock price the last few weeks while other tech concerns have cratered.

 

[Independent]

60 minutes interview with Elan Musk last night. Interesting view of the world.

I don't follow the Musk story closely, so that 60 Minutes interview was interesting.

Stahl presses him on missed deadlines, isn't that dishonest? Musk says he's just guessing anyway, ignorance not deception.

 

[kgtest]

Interesting that why we are fiddling on this thread, TSLA has had a nice run up in stock price the last few weeks while other tech concerns have cratered.

DW saw the then and now pics and made mention life had taken its toll on his physical appearance over the decade. Stress.

 

[Clone]

Musk says he's just guessing anyway, ignorance not deception.

This seems relevant:

 

[ERD50]

Interesting that why we are fiddling on this thread, TSLA has had a nice run up in stock price the last few weeks while other tech concerns have cratered.

It's been really strong while the market has been dropping and volatile. Up while I type, in a down day (so far). Interesting.

Not sure what's driving that (no pun intended), but there it is. I'm kinda curious to see how things play out with financing in 1st Q, and if/when they get to $35,000 Model 3, and how margins hold up if they need to get into those lower priced offerings, especially as the tax credit gets cut in half in Q1-Q2, again in Q3-Q4, and gone next year.

I'm also really curious about the Boring Company, I keep planning to start a new thread on that, but wanted to get some info together first.

-ERD50

 

[Chuckanut]

I just watched the 60 Minutes interview with Elon Musk. I was not impressed by the interview. It was the typical go for the emotional outrage nonsense which passes for supposed quality journalism today, IMHO. Lot of Junior High concerns over what somebody else said about Musk and Tesla with nothing to back it up.

 

[bobandsherry]

I just watched the 60 Minutes interview with Elon Musk. I was not impressed by the interview. It was the typical go for the emotional outrage nonsense which passes for supposed quality journalism today, IMHO. Lot of Junior High concerns over what somebody else said about Musk and Tesla with nothing to back it up.

Interesting perspective and commentary regarding that interview. Just don't understand how people continue to invest in Tesla, but then people continue to invest in Bitcoin too.

Tesla: The 60 Minutes Scare

 

[eroscott]

Just got back. Lots of interesting cars of most brands except Ferrari, Bentley and Bugatti weren't there. First time in a Tesla. Model 3 looks great, but way to cramped for me, bumped my head getting in. Model X very roomy.

I've been driving a Tesla Model X since March 2016. I've actually had two as the first one was in an accident with a deer at highway speeds and insurance totaled it.

At this point, I have driven the X 53.5K (36K+17.5K) miles. I have driven probably close to 85-90% of those miles on AutoPilot (highway and local 35-55 mph roads). It "sees" better than humans in some bad weather and uses radar to see two cars ahead as well as thru some fog (obviously we slow down in bad weather too) which allows for automatic braking. It is fantastic for staying centered in the lanes and keeping a good distance from the car ahead of you (adjustable). It's display shows many cars in your blind spots and avoids the automatic lane change when there is a car in your blind spot (ie. it will lane change by itself if you put the blinker on and it is clear). My first X had AutoPilot 1 with 3 cameras in the front and my 2nd X has several cameras all around the car with AutoPilot 2.

The recent Nav on Autopilot (NoA) Over The Air (OTA) will automatically take exits and slow down nicely (plus make sure you are in the proper lane for upcoming Ys or exits). Used this last night on the way to/from Christmas party.

One of my kids drives a Tesla Model 3 and loves it for his long commute 4 days per week. Uses AutoPilot to have a much more relaxing to/from ride. Spends less than 1/2 the amount of money on $ than he use to. I probably spend 1/4 the amount. I have an hourly rate program and charge after midnight when the rates are cheapest.

With the right seat adjustment, the Model 3 fits many tall people. There are several videos on this to prove it. This one came out just a short while ago.

Title: How Tesla Model 3 fits a 6'10 Basketball Player

 

[eroscott]

I interpreted as meaning that solar production of the charging stations would generate all the electricity that was needed to charge the vehicles, not that they wouldn't be connected to the grid.

FYI, the crowdsourced supercharge.info site is tracking the battery and solar of various Tesla Supercharging locations as of recently.

A) Red dot exist are Tesla Superchargers that current exist.

B) Blue dots crowd-sourced *only* permitted locations.
C) Construction cones in-progress builds (in this winter month!).

 

[ERD50]

Only an anecdote, not data - but the friend of mine who picked up his Tesla S on Wed has had some some problems.

Screen went gray, then black, heat went full on, radio was cutting in and out, all sorts of wonky things. Told him he was in park when he 'shifted' to reverse, but actually was in 'forward'. It seemed to reset itself after a minute.

He's calling them now, I suggested they may be able to upload diagnostics from the car. But it does make me wonder, with the production push, did quality slip? It normally does. May or may not be a big deal, but rather unsettling after paying big $$$ on a brand new car.

-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

Wow.

I wonder if modern cars, not just EVs, still have the brake system being partially mechanical for safety. Traditionally, even vacuum assisted brakes can still work when everything goes dead, including the engine that provides the vacuum. And there's no electricity involved. One just has to stomp on the pedal.

Although I am an EE and spent most of my career working with computers (hardware and software) in avionics (GNC), I am always leery of computers, particularly software bugs. Perhaps it was because of what I know.

 

[ERD50]

....

Although I am an EE and spent most of my career working with computers (hardware and software) in avionics (GNC), I am always leery of computers, particularly software bugs. Perhaps it was because of what I know.

Yes. As he was telling me this, I'm thinking of all the interference that powerful motor and control system must be generating. Switching high currents and high voltages. They obviously have the proper shielding and controls in place, but that often relies on very good grounds. And we know that grounding in the harsh environment of a vehicle (here with salt on the roads) can get iffy after a while.

This guy owns a small fleet of trucks, so is aware of grounding problems he's had with that fleet. Makes him a little nervous. OTOH, he has friends that are Tesla owners, not sure how long, but he never mentioned them having issues, and if they did, obviously not enough to dissuade him from his purchase. OTOH again - he's a car guy, and reliability isn't always a factor over 'cool' and 0-60 times! Again, maybe a small thing, but that production push does make me wonder.

-ERD50