So for those that did RE...

[nuke_diver]

I'd like to hear your comments on this article and those like it. I will retire between 55-60 so early (but not early enough for me) and my first reaction is really what is the difference the years make for the reasons quoted. The same issues could/would be there after 60 maybe moreso. I do agree about the planning But I'm not expert since I still work. But there are lots of folks here who are experienced

The link here

The article summarized [mod edit for copyright reasons] for those that don't want to go the link

My immediate advice to someone who is planning to retire between 55 and 60 would be to not do it. However, if you are both willing and able, you may find retiring early takes more planning and work than staying in the workplace longer.
... [mod edit]
So, before you retire, do some careful planning that goes well beyond financial security. ... What will you be pursuing to give you a daily sense of purpose?
...[mod edit]
What will you do to translate that dividend of time into quality life years, not just time off?

 

[M Paquette]

After 6.5 years, I have not run out of things to do. I don't know how I managed to squeeze a j*b into my schedule.

I also feel better, am in better physical condition, and am under much less stress than when working.

Your mileage may vary, of course.

I suspect the article is aimed at maximizing value extraction from labor units prior to disposal. But that's just me...

 

[RAE]

All I can do is relate my experience, which is that my "daily sense of purpose" INCREASED after retirement, not decreased. I spent a lot of time at work the last several years feeling that a large chunk of my time each week was being wasted on things like pointless meetings, uninteresting projects, stupid performance reviews, etc.........I think many know what I am talking about. After retirement, I was finally free to spend my time on projects and activities that were interesting to ME. I have no illusion that the things I spend my time on now are changing the world in a major way, but I'm perfectly okay with that - they are meaningful to me, and that's enough. The one thing I agree with in your summary of the article is that everyone should spend some time prior to retirement thinking hard about how they will spend their time in retirement. In my case, I spent a long time thinking about it, and I saw no chance of being bored in retirement. And that is the way it has worked out - 4 1/2 years into retirement, and I consider all of them so far to be "quality life years", without a doubt.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

I suspect the article is aimed at maximizing value extraction from labor units prior to disposal. But that's just me...

+1. I think we will see more of these articles as more baby boomers reach retirement age. The super wealthy do not want to have their taxes raised to pay for increased SS and Medicare. So we're supposed to just take one for the team and work until we drop.

Who would want to spend their days hiking with a nature group or learning French cooking anyway when you could be in a cube filling out TPS reports instead?

Most of these articles are simply the more senior versions of the ones encouraging uninsured younger workers that no insurance at all was better than signing up for ACA subsidized insurance.

 

[Tekward]

I can see both sides and tend to take a middle view. Life is not a binomial two state existence (RE or not). Being FI means you can RE; but to me retirement is doing what you want, even if that means a j*b. No way I would continue my previous hi stress/hi travel j*b, but I'm very happy teaching at the university. Some would say that I'm not RE since I still set an alarm, but it suits me. I guess the critical point is the power to choose how you spend your time.

 

[GravitySucks]

I suspect the article is aimed at maximizing value extraction from labor units prior to disposal. But that's just me...

+1. I find WSJ to be getting worse and worse.

To OP: I've been out for a year and 8 months. I haven't done anything overly meaningful except enjoy my life, and help my friends and family in ways I never had time for before.

If I had stayed I would have been able to write one more yearly action plan, two yearly self appraisals, and multiple PowerPoint slides justifying to newly rotated upper managers the value of my department to the organization. World changing stuff!


Sent from my Nexus 7 using Early Retirement Forum mobile app

 

[RunningBum]

So, before you retire, do some careful planning that goes well beyond financial security. ... What will you be pursuing to give you a daily sense of purpose?
...[mod edit]
What will you do to translate that dividend of time into quality life years, not just time off?

As if w*rk gave me a daily sense of purpose and qualify life years. At one point it did and might have been tougher to walk away from. It wasn't for me at the end, and hadn't been for some time.

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

These articles annoy me. The 'studies' try so very hard to group people into tiny little segments...similar to bring grouped as a Democrat or a Republican...most people aren't straight line voters as I'm guessing most people don't want to be grouped in these 'studies'. It's awfully hard to be your own person, isn't it?

And I would guess there is a study out there that completely disagrees with this guy's hypothesis.

 

[FIREd]

After 6.5 years, I have not run out of things to do. I don't know how I managed to squeeze a j*b into my schedule.

I also feel better, am in better physical condition, and am under much less stress than when working.

Your mileage may vary, of course.

I suspect the article is aimed at maximizing value extraction from labor units prior to disposal. But that's just me...

+1

I really cannot relate to anything written in this article.

 

[scrabbler1]

I thought the comments were better than the article itself. Anyone agree?

For me, ERing (at 45, nearly 6 years ago) got rid of the biggest negative, the thing I hated the most about working - the dang commute! Getting rid of a negative is just as enjoyable, if not more enjoyable, than finding a new positive. And I get reinforcement of that elimination of a big negative part of my former everyday life simply by watchinglistening to the traffic and transit reports on any given day.

I did add a lot of personal activities to my everyday life when I switched from working FT to PT back in 2001, and those 7 years of working PT were better than the 16 years of FT work which preceded them. Being able to keep doing those activities (and expand on them to some degree) has been good, too. But it is simply the elimination of the commute which remains my #1 reason I like being ERed so much.

 

[Telly]

Many years ago at Megacorp, they had some really really super early-out packages. I was way too young then to be able to apply for them. But such gnashing of teeth I never saw before on the part of those that were eligible. Some of the people were bordering on being physically sick due to the stress of making a decision. Every morning they came in with the opposite decision that they had left the evening before with. Most of those that finally took it, were looking for something to do in 6 months or so.

Some people are not cut out for ER. Those that need the structure of a job every day that they have to go to. To stay out of the way of the spouse at home. For many of these people, work was the part of their life they felt they controlled. Without it, they were floating. They became a loose nobody (I doubt they would agree with my generalization, but I'm the observer).

I would expect that very very few people who post on this board are of the type that couldn't really handle ER.

 

[BellBarbara]

It has gotten to the point where I can't read any articles authored by or promoted by financial services companies or services. Can you get bored? Yes Can you solve that in a way that is better than working? Definitely

 

[longranger]

Not retired yet but I don't envision my retirement as a time of inactivity. On the contrary as long as my body and mind allow I expect to be at least as active in retirement as in w*rk. Articles that tell me to work longer than absolutely needed for FI make me flat our angry.

 

[clifp]

I'd like to hear your comments on this article and those like it. I will retire between 55-60 so early (but not early enough for me) and my first reaction is really what is the difference the years make for the reasons quoted. The same issues could/would be there after 60 maybe moreso. I do agree about the planning But I'm not expert since I still work. But there are lots of folks here who are experienced

The link here

The article summarized [mod edit for copyright reasons] for those that don't want to go the link

I do wish these experts had actually tried retirement for a few year before pontificating on it. You know if I was the director of an MIT research lab like the author, I probably wouldn't want to retire either. He is basically his own boss, and is top researcher at highly prestigious institution, and it is easy to believe that his work on aging and retirement is meaningful.

I've said before if you are fortunate enough to have a good job, you'll find your best months working to be more fulfilling than your worse months retired, but your worse months retired will be better than you worse months working. Retirement is lower highs and higher lows, if that isn't want you than keep working.

 

[Totoro]

Not retired yet, but still. From the article:

Ask yourself what will you be doing in between the vacations, fixing the house, visiting grandchildren and the occasional community activity? Those activities are highlights, not life.

They are only highlights if you do them occasionally. Fixing the house can easily take up years of your time. You can go on decades long vacations.

What will you be pursuing to give you a daily sense of purpose

What percentage of paid activities give a daily sense of purpose? If you don't work a regular job you can do all sorts of things, including visiting sick people, helping with a charity, programming a useful application, growing flowers for loved ones. Or are these highlights, not life?

As it is often said, a person has to have a reason to get up in the morning.

Most people will go to work to do things they mostly do not enjoy. Is that a good reason to get up in the morning?

Some people like to get up in the morning to enjoy the sun, feel raindrops fall on their skin and play with their dogs. Try to do that when you are sitting at a desk.

Methinks author lacks imagination. If only a big stick will whack you out of bed in the morning you got bigger issues than early retirement considerations.

 

[donheff]

I've said before if you are fortunate enough to have a good job, you'll find your best months working to be more fulfilling than your worse months retired, but your worse months retired will be better than you worse months working. Retirement is lower highs and higher lows, if that isn't want you than keep working.

+1 The cautions are irrelevant to most people on this board since few here unconditionally love their work or they wouldn't be here. Some of us have (or had) good jobs but even we had quite negative aspects that eventually outweighed the rewards. And most of us who have ERd and have been very happy with the result. As for those who have jobs they actively dislike or even hate, the question is pretty much just a calculation of can I afford it.

 

[MikeWillRetire]

I thought the comments were better than the article itself. Anyone agree?

Yes, the comments in the article were much better than the article itself!

 

[Which Roger]

My immediate advice to someone who is planning to retire between 55 and 60 would be to not do it.[/I]

I agree with this part of the article - if at all possible, do it before age 55.

 

[scrabbler1]

+1 The cautions are irrelevant to most people on this board since few here unconditionally love their work or they wouldn't be here. Some of us have (or had) good jobs but even we had quite negative aspects that eventually outweighed the rewards. And most of us who have ERd and have been very happy with the result. As for those who have jobs they actively dislike or even hate, the question is pretty much just a calculation of can I afford it.

The part of your quote I bolded definitely describes how, over time, the awful commute I had wore me down to the point where the negatives abot it eventually surpassed the positives about the job itself. And it wasn't so much my job satisfaction fell sharply. It remained pretty high although it did erode a little bit. It was just that the awful commute and its negativity rose quickly in the late 1990s (it was making me physically ill at times, causing me to see a shrink for a few months), causing me to push hard to reduce it (I had a mostly telecommute deal for 2 years from 2001-2003), along with my weekly hours worked.

When my company eliminated all open-ended telecommuting in late 2003, it returned the horrors of commuting, even only 3 days a week. It did not take long for its negative aspects to again surpass the positives of working, despite a second reduction in the commute and weekly hours worked in 2007. By 2008, I could do only one thing - reduce the commute to ZERO and retire. I recall telling the HR rep in my exit interview that I hated the commute so much that even if they offered the old (mostly) telecommute deal I had in 2001-2003 (it included one day a week going to the office), I would turn it down because it would be too often.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

You know if I was the director of an MIT research lab like the author, I probably wouldn't want to retire either. He is basically his own boss, and is top researcher at highly prestigious institution, and it is easy to believe that his work on aging and retirement is meaningful.

There is a Nat Geo documentary on stress that I saw on Netflix that pretty much came to the same conclusions. Whether it is a baboon troop or British government workers, those at the top with autonomy had less stress and those kicked around below with less control over their days had significantly higher stress levels, measurable by blood tests.

I have not found working at my own little business to be stressful, though I still wouldn't want to do it for 60+ hours a week, including commute.

 

[Midpack]

I can argue both sides - there are great people who have achieved FI who are legitimately better off working. But I always wonder what value it provides to ask this self selected niche audience what they think of ER vs work. Sort of like going to a Chevy forum and asking members what they think of an article on the merits of Toyotas, self-fulfilling.

There are definitely people who would agree wholeheartedly with the linked article, but they're few and far between at ER.org.

 

[photoguy]

There are countless stories of people who have retired early only to return to work within a year or even within 30 days. It is not necessarily because retirement was so bad. It was that they ran out of meaningful things to do.

You may not run out of things to do. Errands and other mundane activities have a way of filling the void. However, research suggests that in two years, most people begin to run out of activities that give them meaning, a sense of purpose, continuous engagement and support their overall well-being.

I found these statements rather sad that most cannot find something meaningful to do. Are self directed people that small a percentage of the population? I'm only 6 months into fire but have been busier than ever and cannot imagine running out of meaningful stuff to do. But perhaps I'm being naive and my tune will change in another few years.

 

[W2R]

My responses to a few brief quotes from the article:

research suggests that in two years, most people begin to run out of activities that give them meaning, a sense of purpose, continuous engagement and support their overall well-being.

Purpose to whom? I don't WANT to feel like I am being used by a corporation for a purpose that is only of value to that organization. I want to have the freedom to govern how I use my time, instead of having that dictated to me, minute by minute.

If someone needs to be ordered to complete (often) fairly meaningless tasks all day long every day in order to experience a sense of well-being, then I would suggest that they need to do some introspection especially concerning why they have such a need to behave in such a submissive way.
　

Studies indicate wives are more likely to initiate divorce because the guy who now occupies the couch "is boring."

Oh pul-eeze. The author makes the broad, unsubstantiated assumption that someone who is retired is more boring to his spouse than someone who works. That is SO untrue. F is a lot more interesting, IMO, since he retired. He is writing his third book, pursuing his interests in astronomy and ham radio, sending me links to fascinating podcasts and youtube videos, and generally he is so happy and vibrant. Yet I should believe that he is more boring now than when he was working so many hours of overtime and was exhausted from it? I don't think so.
　

Marriage aside, the Gallup Healthways Well-Being Index suggests that those who work in latter years report higher states of well-being, that is better emotional and physical health as well as overall healthy behaviors and life satisfaction.

Apparently this author never heard that "correlation is not causation". If someone is in poor physical or emotional health, he might HAVE to retire.

Also I doubt that retired cubicle workers do not engage in overall healthier behaviors in retirement, than they did when spending most of their time at work in the cube. Seems to me that the vast majority of those at my gym who are in their 50's or 60's are retired. In retirement, they have the time to be at the gym.

 

[travelover]

I'm convinced. I'm gonna see if I can get back my windowless basement cube.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

My husband has never been without a purpose since he retired. If he isn't out and about with one of his many clubs, he knows there is a never ending honey-do list waiting for him at home.