Rant about electronics on newer used car

[Z3Dreamer]

Just purchased a 2017 Subaru Legacy. I read the manuals and studied online stuff and called. Here is what you are supposed to get:

Starlink is the name of their Safety ($100 a year) and Security ($150) product. Totally different products so you should get both. They have features like automatically notifying people in case of accidents, locating the car if stolen, remote locking/unlocking via a cellphone app, etc.

Starlink notifies people but they don't do anything. For example, no towing is included above. For that, you should get Roadside Assistance Plus. $80 a year. For this you get 4 - $100 credits, one per incident. Can be used on all of your drivers and cars. $80 is per family, not per car.

Are we done, yet? No, read on.

There is an information page that gives you weather, sports, stocks, etc. To use this, you need Sirius XM for $16.95 per month plus taxes and fees. See ongoing thread about the Sirius dance where you can get the cost down to $80 a year and they may even throw in an Echo dot!

Total $410 a year, if you are lucky and persistent. Oh, I forgot, other features of Starlink appear to need you to Bluetooth connect to your phone. I am talking about the maintenance data and a few others.

BTW, the car is great.

Do you have similar experience with your car electronics?

 

[pb4uski]

We bought our 2016 Subaru Outback new and I ignored all of that stuff... we have AAA for roadside assistance but that is all

 

[zinger1457]

Most new cars throw in those options for the first couple years then try to hook you into a subscription, never found any of them worth paying for. Apple CarPlay or Android Auto are good options if you're looking for more entertainment/informational services.

 

[gauss]

Sounds like your gripe is more with the optional Services as opposed to the underlying Electronics.

It may sound like I am being pedantic, but this is somewhat close to what I did for a living for a number of years.

Having said that, if the unactivated services get in the way of using the base electronics then that would be a problem for me!

-gauss

 

[braumeister]

Do you have similar experience with your car electronics?

I got all those things free for the first four years (it's called Volvo On Call) and then paid $125 for an additional two years. Six years is usually as long as I own a car, so it seemed quite reasonable.

 

[pb4uski]

Most new cars throw in those options for the first couple years then try to hook you into a subscription, never found any of them worth paying for. Apple CarPlay or Android Auto are good options if you're looking for more entertainment/informational services.

My truck has Andriod Auto and I use frequently.

 

[CRLLS]

I never subscribed to Sirius XM, although somewhere in the cost of my 2012 Hyundai that was added. I get a free 3 months trial every time I have service. I still don't use it. My 2015 Ford has the safety feature linked to my cell phone. In the case of an accident, it automatically dials "somebody". Who? I'm not sure. Maybe just 911. Ford had something they called "Sync" which had some similar type free and add-on services as Your Subaru. Unfortunately, in 2018, Ford decided to stop supporting it so it died a peaceful death. Their reason for ditching the service is, and I quote, "SYNC Services relied on technology that is no longer being supported. " For those who chose the Fords based on those services, I feel for them. Supposedly, the auto call-in the case of an accident was not part of the change.

 

[euro]

We bought our 2016 Subaru Outback new and I ignored all of that stuff... we have AAA for roadside assistance but that is all

Same here with a 2017 Outback. Just ignore all that stuff and get AAA (or nothing at all).
I know that this appears to be a nuisance to you, but I much prefer to have the option to pay or not to pay for each of these “services”. Far better than a situation where all this stuff is basically worked into the price of the vehicle and you end up being forced to pay for stuff you are not interested in using.

 

[Z3Dreamer]

Gauss, you are right. The radio and bluetooth - hands free calling works great. It is just $410 or more for the other features that I was ranting about. Basic operations is fine.

I was looking to see if anyone thought $410 a year was worth it. So far, no.

 

[someguy]

Many of the current cars have their own cellular/data connections which can relay telemetry and other data back to the manufacturer. Eventually, this will be a valuable revenue stream for manufacturers (ie, selling your data to third parties).

That said, I think having cellular-based remote start is worth paying a modest fee. You don't have to worry about remote fob range, and in some cases, you can control heat/AC temp, defrost, etc.

 

[Midpack]

Not entirely accurate, I have a 2018 Outback going on 3 years now, though I am not a big fan of Subaru.

"STARLINK brings multimedia content, smartphone connectivity, seamless navigation, extra safety, and everyday convenience to Subaru vehicles. This suite of on-board technology helps make every drive more entertaining, confident, and enjoyable." Most of the features are included without subscription, but there are added Safety & Security features that are available with a paid subscription. What automaker doesn't try to sell added subscription features, like OnStar beginning in 1996? The MultiMedia and NAV systems are perfectly useable (though IME Honda & Toyota equivalents are better).

If you don't want the added Starlink features, don't subscribe. I don't subscribe to any Subaru paid in car services, I use Apple CarPlay much more often than the Subaru systems.

Starlink is the name of their Safety ($100 a year) and Security ($150) product. Totally different products so you should get both. They have features like automatically notifying people in case of accidents, locating the car if stolen, remote locking/unlocking via a cellphone app, etc.

Not correct. The Safety Plus pkg is $100, Security Plus is $150 which includes the Safety pkg features - IOW you "get both" for $150.

https://content.subarunet.com/snet/_content/starlink/starlink_packages_and_pricing.pdf

And you can subscribe to the MySubaru app (mobile and PC) to see all your maintenance records and recommended services for free.

There is an information page that gives you weather, sports, stocks, etc. To use this, you need Sirius XM for $16.95 per month plus taxes and fees.

Another added paid service most automakers will try to sell you. I can get all that for free on my iPhone, why would I want to pay for it on my car UI?

 

[Z3Dreamer]

Midpack, you are right. Thank you. The $150 includes Safety Plus and Security Plus. Because they have so many value-added services, I did not understand what was and what was not included. In fact, after reading your comment, I called and was told that Roadside Assistance was also included! Then I restated it and was told "Oh. No. If your car is not under warranty, then you must also purchase that."

A purpose of this is to get an accurate understanding of the options. Even at a corrected $310 a year, I leaning towards no, as I understand I have the option of not subscribing.

 

[Chuckanut]

They seem like those small vampire fees that make it so hard for many people to ever get to FIRE. $5 for this, $8 for that, $10 for the other thing, and pretty soon you're talking real money.

I did not sign up for any of these 'services' when I bought my 2019 RAV4. Since Toyota offered me two years of towing for 'free' I even dropped my AAA account.

Note1: AAA introduced a new premium account and placed limits on the old cheaper accounts. That was a huge incentive to let my membership lapse. Especially since I can't remember the last time I called I them. IMHO, they may have outsmarted themselves.

Note2: (Apologies to Senator Everett Dirksen - “A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking real money.". )

 

[athena53]

I bought a 2021 Honda Civic last year- not the version with all the electronic bells and whistles, just a few. I'm very happy with the ability to sync with my iPhone but don't need an on-board GPS, for example- they just cost a fortune to replace when they fail.

I took it to the stealership because it needed some minor work within warranty and then I started getting e-mails from Sirius that my free trial had begun. I got out the manual and poked through menus on the dashboard trying to get Sirius and concluded that my model doesn't get Sirius unless I buy some extra electronics. Not gonna happen- I'm perfectly happy with the podcasts on my phone and the music on my ancient iPod Nano.

But I'm still getting e-mails from Sirius.

 

[easysurfer]

When I was shopping for a used car a few years back, one car I test drove had a built in GPS. I told the dealer I really have no need for that as will be using my own portable GPS.

 

[finnski1]

We bought our 2016 Subaru Outback new and I ignored all of that stuff... we have AAA for roadside assistance but that is all

We are on our 3rd Outback and do the same. Although this time we bought used (2015) so didn't get all the "free trials" etc.
As for the electronics themselves, mostly we like them although I am wrestling with a finicky rear power gate right now.

 

[O2Bfree]

I bought a 2021 Honda Civic last year- not the version with all the electronic bells and whistles, just a few. I'm very happy with the ability to sync with my iPhone but don't need an on-board GPS, for example- they just cost a fortune to replace when they fail.

I took it to the stealership because it needed some minor work within warranty and then I started getting e-mails from Sirius that my free trial had begun. I got out the manual and poked through menus on the dashboard trying to get Sirius and concluded that my model doesn't get Sirius unless I buy some extra electronics. Not gonna happen- I'm perfectly happy with the podcasts on my phone and the music on my ancient iPod Nano.

But I'm still getting e-mails from Sirius.

^^"stealership"

I just bought 2017 Honda CR-V with the lowest trim package because it has just a basic USB/Bluetooth sound system with no navigation system, remote start, or other features. A few people have told me that they like to have new vehicles with all the gadgets, but because gadgets tend to cost extra, become obsolete, or fail, they choose to lease.

I have however dropped a couple hundred bucks on an after-market anti-sway bar to improve the cornering.

 

[OldShooter]

You bought a used grocery-getter where there are some additional services available and you're mad that they are not free? Really? Possibly the XM folks are mad that their satellite constellation and its maintenance are not free, either. Ditto the satellites and ground facilities that support the other services.

I have a 2017 Soob WRX bought new off the lot in 2018 (at a significant saving). IIRC there were some optional things, including XM, that I never turned on because I had no interest. The radio tunes public radio stations, including HD, just fine. The standard dashboard tells me the outside temperature and if I want more weather information I look out the window. Also, and most importantly, the touch-screen is already a huge distraction to use and hence a safety hazard. As a pilot, I usually have my right-seater run the radios and the nav. I do the same in the Soob. She is quite good at it.

 

[Midpack]

Midpack, you are right. Thank you. The $150 includes Safety Plus and Security Plus. Because they have so many value-added services, I did not understand what was and what was not included. In fact, after reading your comment, I called and was told that Roadside Assistance was also included! Then I restated it and was told "Oh. No. If your car is not under warranty, then you must also purchase that."

A purpose of this is to get an accurate understanding of the options. Even at a corrected $310 a year, I leaning towards no, as I understand I have the option of not subscribing.

The point I was also making is every automaker plays that game these days, just clarifying it's not at all unique to Subaru since you referred to them directly. GM OnStar Safety & Security starts at $250/yr and goes up to $540/yr with all the bells & whistles. It's a racket IMO, but it might be worth it to some folks.

https://www.onstar.com/us/en/plans-...ick=&msclkid=8eb8a8593e9018792f0bc840bf95335d

 

[Z3Dreamer]

OldShooter, I was not clear. I don't expect everything for free in my used grocery-getter. I don't believe my initial post says that I expected them for free. As to the maintenance of satellites, I have no knowledge of that. My rant was more about the number of add-on things and the difficulty in understanding what did what for what price. MidPack clarified some bad info I had assumed/heard/read, so that is good.

Finally, once I understand the services, since this is my newest car since I purchased that 2003 Subaru Legacy, I wanted to know which add-ons people really liked.

 

[OldShooter]

... the number of add-on things and the difficulty in understanding what did what for what price. ...

Sorry to misunderstand. Re add-ons, I'll join the rant. Last year DW bought a never-sold Mini Countryman that was a Mini rep's car. It had every option in the book, including a little projector light that puts the Mini logo on the driveway when the driver door is opened at night! Heads up display of course, GPS, etc. etc.

The killer, though, was that the manual to operate all this stuff is stored in the main electronic box itself, so you can either read the manual or operate the box but not both at the same time. Paper manual? "No problem, sir. They are available for $65." !??!?!

 

[finnski1]

Sorry to misunderstand. Re add-ons, I'll join the rant. Last year DW bought a never-sold Mini Countryman that was a Mini rep's car. It had every option in the book, including a little projector light that puts the Mini logo on the driveway when the driver door is opened at night! Heads up display of course, GPS, etc. etc.

The killer, though, was that the manual to operate all this stuff is stored in the main electronic box itself, so you can either read the manual or operate the box but not both at the same time. Paper manual? "No problem, sir. They are available for $65." !??!?!

When I bought the Subaru a month ago I went online and joined the Subaru Technical Information System website and bought a 3 day subscription for $34.95. This allowed me access to every manual and Tech Service bulletin.
I then spent about an hour or more downloading every single TSB (99 of them)and every manual (12 of them,operators etc) including the 7000 pg. Factory service manual for my 2015 Outback. It was well worth it and now I have everything stored in a folder on my desk top. The Factory service manual will pay for itself many times over as I tend do do many maintenance and repair items myself, leaving the real difficult or specialty ones to my mechanic.

 

[doneat54]

It gets worse. Here is something I read BMW was approaching recently, but then backed off from saying it was "not quite ready to be rolled out."

Subscription services for features in your car. You want heated seats? Ok, pay us $17 a month. If you don't we will deactivate them in your car via wireless link. Keep in mind the heaters are always THERE, they will just make them work (or not) unless you pay them. Same with all the fancy infotainment stuff. Every car has all the same hardware (that actually saves the maker money) but you'll just need to (keep) paying them to keep them working. You want your engine to produce the full 400hp? That's $22/mo, else we detune your engine to the "base" hp.....



Needless to say, I have no plans of buying a Beemer.

 

[braumeister]

Subscription services for features in your car.

I believe Tesla already does that for some features. All the hardware/software is installed, but you have to pay to get it activated.

You can even buy a subscription for a car:
The modern way to lease a car.

 

[RunningBum]

I'm not following what the rant is.

Does the OP want all of this included with the base car? I don't want the base price going up for features I don't use.

Does the OP want those somewhat related features to be grouped together in one package? I don't want to pay for Sirius if I just want the emergency products.

Is the rant about the $410 cost of all this? Don't get it then.