Poll: Total Income from SS & Pensions (Not Nest Egg or Retirement Withdrawals)

[ShokWaveRider]

Honestly, a lot of the comments are almost moot, interesting, entertaining or valid perhaps, but moot. The objective of the poll was to see where the majority of ER.org members fall. The poll is pretty much conclusive ..... don't you think, we are a pretty well-off bunch really by standards. But we already knew that didn't we?

 

[Freedom56]

Honestly, a lot of the comments are almost moot, interesting, entertaining or valid perhaps, but moot. The objective of the poll was to see where the majority of ER.org members fall. The poll is pretty much conclusive ..... don't you think, we are a pretty well-off bunch really by standards. But we already knew that didn't we?

With CD, treasury, agency notes yielding over 5% and corporate notes yielding over 6%, many of us are even better off.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

With CD, treasury, agency notes yielding over 5% and corporate notes yielding over 6%, many of us are even better off.

Absolutely!

 

[MarieIG]

Lots of wealthy folks here on ER.ORG.....

I suspect (but don't know) that polls which mention pensions attract more folks who have pensions . . .

Also, a lot of folks here have been saving, preparing, and running the numbers for years for their respective retirements, so if they have more than the general population - well, there may be a reason for that.

 

[MarieIG]

In retrospect I probably should not have included RMDs as a lot of us are not of the age yet. I did just in case some had small SS and/or pensions but had a good nest egg in Retirement funds ..... oh well, it is all in fun anyway, right?

But, but, but . . . you included social security and there are those who are either not of age, or entitled to - and not yet drawing it.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

But, but, but . . . you included social security and there are those who are either not of age, or entitled to - and not yet drawing it.

As per the title, the poll was NOT intended for them at all ..... sorry and all that.

 

[jollystomper]

Honestly, a lot of the comments are almost moot, interesting, entertaining or valid perhaps, but moot. The objective of the poll was to see where the majority of ER.org members fall. The poll is pretty much conclusive ..... don't you think, we are a pretty well-off bunch really by standards. But we already knew that didn't we?

Given that the median household income in the U.S. is a little more that $5,900/month, I would agree .

 

[Alan]

This Poll is intended only for those who are taking SS and getting Pensions.

Honestly, a lot of the comments are almost moot, interesting, entertaining or valid perhaps, but moot. The objective of the poll was to see where the majority of ER.org members fall. The poll is pretty much conclusive ..... don't you think, we are a pretty well-off bunch really by standards. But we already knew that didn't we?

Your poll clearly states that only those in receipt of pensions and/or SS should take part so your comment only really applies to a subset of the members here, and that subset does indeed have good pension income.

 

[MarieIG]

As per the title, the poll was NOT intended for them at all ..... sorry and all that.

No, no, don't be sorry. It's an enjoyable poll!

 

[MarieIG]

Even when one of us dies, and if the only income that the survivor has is $5K per month, the survivor will have to give up the country club membership, sell the home and move to a cheaper and lower HOA cost home, get rid of $14K per year of timeshare maintenance liability, no more travel and no more eating out. $5K per month becomes real hardship for survivor in our situation, not to mention for a couple. I have occasionally thought about if my husband goes before me since he is quite a bit older, I will definitely get rid of timeshare and reduce travel to ad-hoc instead of being away 3 months a year, and most likely stop the country club membership. I am still looking at about $10K a month for an individual before RMD, and I have to adjust my lifestyle substantially. So it depends on where you live and how you live.

When one of us goes, we will of course lose one social security income; and taxes will go up. But life style changes would be dictated by loss of the spouse/ partner, rather than loss of income and somewhat increased expenses. (No time share or country club membership though.)

 

[jollystomper]

When one of us goes, we will of course lose one social security income; and taxes will go up. But life style changes would be dictated by loss of the spouse/ partner, rather than loss of income and somewhat increased expenses. (No time share or country club membership though.)

+1

If I go before I start taking SS, the household income will increase. DW will get 75% of my pension plus my SS, which is greater than pension today.

If DW goes before I start taking SS, my pension goes up, plus I start taking SS, so household income will increase.

If either of us goes after I start taking SS, we will lose the lower SS amount, but that is planned for gifting to the kids, so its loss will not impact the household income.

It is a good thing we love each other and are not greedy .

 

[Plantman]

It's a good poll, but evidently needed a few more higher end choices.

 

[TheWizard]

I can't vote because I'm not collecting SS yet. But I just wanted to say that RMDs really aren't income, they're just the transfer for money from tax deferred saving to taxable savings - doesn't seem right to count RMDs as income.

I disagree.
Withdrawals from tax-deferred IRA, 401(k), or 403(b) are DEFERRED INCOME, hence taxed the same, though possibly at a different rate.

And as far as putting excess retirement income into your taxable account each month, I do also. But I don't distinguish where that income came from. Pension/annuity? SS? RMD? It's all the same shade of green once it's in my checking account and the excess over a certain threshold goes into my Vanguard account...

 

[Exchme]

I disagree.
Withdrawals from tax-deferred IRA, 401(k), or 403(b) are DEFERRED INCOME, hence taxed the same, though possibly at a different rate.

And as far as putting excess retirement income into your taxable account each month, I do also. But I don't distinguish where that income came from. Pension/annuity? SS? RMD? It's all the same shade of green once it's in my checking account and the excess over a certain threshold goes into my Vanguard account...

Words mean things, it's very hard to communicate if you have your own personal definitions. You have described cash flow, which is also critically important, but it is not income the way the rest of the world means it. The rest of the world uses income to mean money coming in from the outside world, so RMDs don't qualify, they are just a forced movement of money between accounts that force a taxable event. You are not richer for having been forced to take an RMD, whereas you are richer when the pension check hits the bank.

 

[MarieIG]

+1

If I go before I start taking SS, the household income will increase. DW will get 75% of my pension plus my SS, which is greater than pension today.

If DW goes before I start taking SS, my pension goes up, plus I start taking SS, so household income will increase.

If either of us goes after I start taking SS, we will lose the lower SS amount, but that is planned for gifting to the kids, so its loss will not impact the household income.

It is a good thing we love each other and are not greedy .

Yes, my scenario "assumed" that we had both made it to 70.

Neither one of us has taken SS yet, and the current plan is to wait until age 70 for both of us. (We are using the postponement for Roth conversions.) If for some reason one of us has to tap it, I would be me since DH has the better income record.

DH has instructions that if I go first, to file ASAP for widower's benefits, and let his SS grow. His pension and (employer funded) annuity are 100% joint and survivor but he gets a significant raise in his pension if I go first, so it's a good thing he seems to like to have me around!

Using the lower SS for gifting to the kiddos is a good idea.

 

[stephenson]

Need another poll, starting at 5K and going to 50K.

 

[Sunset]

......
........ DGF's pension (same place as my mini micro) was so low she was given no option except a cash payout as the value was under $5K (it was $3.5K) even after 16 years of service. My micro mini is after 13 years service leaving at a Director level. Thank goodness for 401Ks and IRAs.

+1 on the 401K and IRA - which only work if one actually saves.

I have no pension.... so I really had to save hard.

 

[Montecfo]

+1 on the 401K and IRA - which only work if one actually saves.



I have no pension.... so I really had to save hard.

I think it is one of the most significant pieces of context needed to evaluate people's investment ideas and strategies:

Pension or Nest Egg?

Pensioners typically have no (or limited) nest egg to fall back on.

Nest Eggers have whatever income their capital generates and only the guaranteed income they create.

Now, a few folks have huge pensions and huge nest eggs. Good for them. Best of both worlds.

Just a casual musing-no hijack.

 

[TheWizard]

Words mean things, it's very hard to communicate if you have your own personal definitions. You have described cash flow, which is also critically important, but it is not income the way the rest of the world means it. The rest of the world uses income to mean money coming in from the outside world, so RMDs don't qualify, they are just a forced movement of money between accounts that force a taxable event. You are not richer for having been forced to take an RMD, whereas you are richer when the pension check hits the bank.

I tend to look at financial movements from an AGI taxation standpoint, not whether I'm "richer".
And I did systematic withdrawals from tax-deferred from age 63 to 70 while delaying SS. Those withdrawals were not RMDs but still taxable as ordinary income...

 

[FI_RElater]

I think it is one of the most significant pieces of context needed to evaluate people's investment ideas and strategies:

Pension or Nest Egg?

Pensioners typically have no (or limited) nest egg to fall back on.

Nest Eggers have whatever income their capital generates and only the guaranteed income they create.

Now, a few folks have huge pensions and huge nest eggs. Good for them. Best of both worlds.

Just a casual musing-no hijack.

Well not exactly a huge pension... but it alone gets us into the fourth entry of the poll and the lower SS that was started this year gets us well past the $5k poll limit...
when the second (higher) SS starts, when they hit 70, we'll be just shy of 10k a month.... and then there's the withdrawals from the portfolio

 

[SloHan]

Did not participate in the poll as I am not receiving SS payments. When I’m eligible for SS the amounts are age 62 $2074, FRA 67 $2946 and 70 $3653.

Maybe I should start a thread and ask“ When should I claim SS”? lol

 

[Toocold]

Too young to get SS or pension, so it would be 0. Would you count payout for NQDC distributions?

 

[Time2]

Given that the median household income in the U.S. is a little more that $5,900/month, I would agree .

I also agree with "we are a pretty well-off bunch really by standards."


But, we no longer w**k for our $5,900.


As to the poll, IF*, we wait another 20 months to collect SS, we will be at or just above the $5000 in the poll. We have no pensions, but do have assets that if we used the 4% guide would generate considerably more than our SS. We are quiet comfortable living on about $70k.


*I'm considering taking SS at the beginning of 2024. But, still not sure.
It won't make much difference in our spending either way.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Personally, I think ~$5k a month in SS and/or Pension is a VERY GOOD income for the average retiree, especially if their home is paid for. That is why I set that as the top tier. We have to struggle to spend as much as that per month (But we are working on it), and I do not consider us short on cash or standard of living. We have had no reason to withdraw anything from our Nest Egg for the last 15 years of FIRE.

Our home (~3,300 sqft) in a gated resort'ish G&CC community, 1.5 miles from one of the best beaches in the area for all the mandatory expenses (Not Food) costs only $1,400 per month all in for 2022. That leaves a lot of cash for Healthcare, Car insurance & related expenses, Food etc. All in includes:

HOA and Landscaping
Electricity, Water & Gas
Internet & Cable TV (We had cable in 2022 but not now)
Umbrella, Flood & Home Insurance
Telephone
Pest Control
Property Tax

OK some of you think it is too low, but it is OK for the objective of this poll, consider yourselves VERY privileged. The points have been well made. Since I collected SS at the beginning of the year, we have a lot of discretionary income to BTD.

 

[RetiredHappy]

Personally, I think ~$5k a month in SS and/or Pension is a VERY GOOD income for the average retiree, especially if their home is paid for. That is why I set that as the top tier. We have to struggle to spend as much as that per month (But we are working on it), and I do not consider us short on cash or standard of living. We have had no reason to withdraw anything from our Nest Egg for the last 15 years of FIRE.

Our home (~3,300 sqft) in a gated resort'ish G&CC community, 1.5 miles from one of the best beaches in the area for all the mandatory expenses (Not Food) costs only $1,400 per month all in for 2022. That leaves a lot of cash for Healthcare, Car insurance & related expenses, Food etc. All in includes:

HOA and Landscaping
Electricity, Water & Gas
Internet & Cable TV (We had cable in 2022 but not now)
Umbrella, Flood & Home Insurance
Telephone
Pest Control
Property Tax

I don't even think it is possible to be so low. Here's our annual numbers compared with the above categories:

HOA (does not include anything on the house): $6,024
Landscape: $1,440
Electricity and Gas: $6,500
Water and Sewer: $2,200
Internet and Streaming Subscription (No Netflix): $2,200
Umbrella and Home Insurance: $1,700
Cell phones and mobile devices: $3,000
Pest Control: $460
Property Tax: $4,350
Pool: $2,000 (not in yours)
Cleaners: $5,000 (not in yours)
Total: $32,674

Our HOA just covers the 24x7 guards and community landscaping and upkeep.