After I'm Gone

[harllee]

While our accountant would be able to handle and help DW get up to speed, I believe there's another aspect of "being gone" that should also be considered.

There's the every day things around the house: where the fusebox is and how to reset them, the water main shutoff, how to open the garage door if the power goes out, or how those doors need the electric eyes aligned, how to reboot the router, unstick the disposal, reset the light timers as the hours change, pump her own gas, and a hundred little other tricks that you do to keep things running.

Also OP: You say you wouldn't want to hire a financial planner, but in your absence, it could be money well spent IMO especially if there's large sums involved.

As for the around the house things--I am glad we are living in a CCRC that handles most of all that. DH can even hire the CCRC to do the laundry when I am gone.

 

[iloveyoga]

While our accountant would be able to handle and help DW get up to speed, I believe there's another aspect of "being gone" that should also be considered.

There's the every day things around the house: where the fusebox is and how to reset them, the water main shutoff, how to open the garage door if the power goes out, or how those doors need the electric eyes aligned, how to reboot the router, unstick the disposal, reset the light timers as the hours change, pump her own gas, and a hundred little other tricks that you do to keep things running.

Also OP: You say you wouldn't want to hire a financial planner, but in your absence, it could be money well spent IMO especially if there's large sums involved.

You are so right! DH does all of those things for me and more, except gas and car care, I take care of that. But he has kept our house in such smooth good running order for 45 years. I would have to hire someone to do this stuff if needed.

 

[Safe Harbour]

You are so right! DH does all of those things for me and more, except gas and car care, I take care of that. But he has kept our house in such smooth good running order for 45 years. I would have to hire someone to do this stuff if needed.

That will probably cost more than a Money Manager!

 

[sengsational]

I've resolved and am comfortable with "my process" being abandoned when I'm not around any more. Like a lot of thinking in this thread, I used to sweat over the details of how each thing I do would be taken over and done the same. Nah... fuggetaboutit.

Have an up-to-date list of what assets you have, and where those assets are, you're 90% complete. Let's face it, you're not going to be rebalancing from beyond the grave! As long as there's a plan that avoids preditory advice, the fact that it's not being handled "your way", depending on the fickle market, it might actually beat your way.

I'm recording a video series to make it easier for DW, and one or both of my kids to navigate my office, computer, and files. I explain the way I do it now, but indicate that most of it is inconsequential in the big picture, and they can do it however they want.

 

[Dufferin]

I handle it all myself. DW will need help if I go before her (we are both 77). Everything is at Vanguard but am thinking of moving everything to Fidelity and using an advisor. Vanguard don't have offices were you can meet face to face with your advisor. I think the personal contact would be better for DW than dealing with things on line or over the phone.

 

[Closet_Gamer]

I recently put together an organized document that lays out our assets, key contacts, and the strategy that we have underway. Like others, our financial holdings are quite complicated. Part of what I didn’t was draw some pictures that map out how the assets hang together and how funds should flow over the next 15 years.

DW and I agreed that if something bad happens she will contact our Schwab person and engage a Schwab, fee-based CFP.

She’s not in the details but understand the big trade-offs and watch-outs pretty well. She’d be hard to snooker into a variable annuity of some other such structure.

We still need to sort an operating plan for what happens if we both get hit by a bus and our daughters inherit. Will likely have it all go into a trust managed by one of my family members.

 

[TheWizard]

I was reminded of tax implications of unrealized capital gains while doing our taxes this year. I have several long-time MF holdings that I'd like to roll into a single mutual fund but they all have substantial LTCG's (at least 80% LTCG in each). Selling and consolidating would cost me 15% of 80% each fund. Just letting them sit there my son will get a step up in basis and have no tax. I'm not dissatisfied with these funds, I'd just like my list of funds to be shorter. But a 15% penalty to do so? Hard to know what to do!

I thought the main point of consolidating one's investments was to make it easier for an elderly surviving spouse who might be starting cognitive decline.

But a younger offspring should be able to deal with the details of an inheritance just fine, right?

 

[pb4uski]

+1 Simpifying here as well, but need to do better documenting everything.

Vast majority is centralized in 6 accounts at Schwab... joint brokerage, my brokerage (inherited), my tIRA, my inheirited tIRA and his and her Roths. HSAs are at Fidelity simply because Schwab doesn't offer individual HSAs.

OTOH, I do have too many holdings... 78 holdings between those 6 accounts... mostly individual preferred stocks and bonds and 5 different equity/ETF holdings.

Two properties are enhanced life estate deeds held jointly and then to our kids when the second of us dies. Texas house is jointly held but TOD when the second of us dies.

Only other things are our joint checking account (which will soon be at Schwab after the move). two vehicles, a pontoon boat, jet ski and some trailers, all of which are jointly owned.

 

[harllee]

I thought the main point of consolidating one's investments was to make it easier for an elderly surviving spouse who might be starting cognitive decline.

But a younger offspring should be able to deal with the details of an inheritance just fine, right?

Depends how long you live. My mom is in her 90s and I am in my 70s and trying to handle her finances and well my own has been a hardship to me.

 

[iloveyoga]

That will probably cost more than a Money Manager!

Yes, so true. He is very talented and has saved us much money over the years.

 

[Dash man]

DW knows where everything is and is a smart cookie even though she doesn’t like dealing with investments. One son is able to help her in case of decline, but the other is clueless with financial matters. Most bills are set up for autopay and she just needs to make sure there is cash in the checking account. She has ADHD, but can focus on a task if needed. Her mom had dementia, so she is concerned she may get it, but her dad is still around at 90 and clear headed. Longevity is not a trait on my side of the family, so I keep her involved in taxes, Roth conversions and such.

 

[jebmke]

Or you might consider hiring a good handyman or handywoman. A lot easier than trying to figure those things out on your own.

DWs plan is to just move to a nice large condo and make it all someone else's problem.

I was joking. We bought know where everything is and how it works, for the most part. She is the only one who knows where the key to the wine cabinet is -- but I all but quit drinking years ago so I'll be OK.

 

[mystang52]

All,

.... I have tried to simplify over the years to make it easier for her. I have reduced to a single provider (Vanguard) and reduced to 8 funds (the four corners of the 9 squares of size vs growth/value for US and International). Plus Fixed Income and Cash. That gives 10 asset classes that have to be rebalanced each year. But then there are 4 accounts (Brokerage, Traditional IRA, Inherited IRA, ROTH IRA) that have to be considered in that rebalancing. There is cash flow planning to cover at least a 5 year horizon due Fixed Asset ladder (CDs in our case)....
Over the years I have developed 3 different generations of spreadsheets to do this. Each getting sequentially simpler. But the current version has 7 main tabs: Introduction & Instructions, Current Assets, Annual Monthly Planning, Withdrawal Planning, Available Cash Planning, Asset Allocation
What do you plan to do or actually do?

Admittedly, I'm financially conservative. With that disclaimer, I think you are at a point where your finances remain too complex. Maybe we gave up a few points of total return, but a few years ago we simplified our finances to just a couple of funds (and T Bills) within Vanguard. All of our non-retirement funds are in just 2 banks. We only use 3 credit cards; they all have closing date at end of month. On first of the month, I sit with DW as she pays all of the bills - we don't wait for the paper credit card bill - and our monthly budget.
Finally, I put together a multi-page simple English document, for her to refer to in event of my death. 1st page is Table of Contents. She can do quite well reading just the first 3 pages, everything else is supporting details. Keep it simple, make it easy to read, especially keeping in mind there will be an emotional aspect after your death.

 

[freckles1061]

That will probably cost more than a Money Manager!

THIS! esp if you live in a HCOL area where the costs of home maintenance are astronomical! My husband took care of all of that and after he passed it has been a nightmare keeping up with all of it. Although I love my home, I'm selling soon because the cost of maintenance is too much for me. I always handled the finances but would have trouble finding the water shut off. He did all of that but didn't know how to pay a bill. Think there is a lesson in there for all married couples

 

[kyzymurgist]

Best advice from this thread so far is to find a great handyman and lawn service. I always take care of everything around the house and it will be stressful to find good help.

As for finances, I'm trying to simplify as fast as makes sense. Still have one rental property and a complicated SDIRA to unwind but have accounts cut by 2/3 and down to a fairly simple 4 fund portfolio with clear instructions on how to manage it without a FA.

In case of death document still needs updated and lots of practice in our future. But DW has the master password memorized!

 

[TheWizard]

Best advice from this thread so far is to find a great handyman and lawn service. I always take care of everything around the house and it will be stressful to find good help.

As for finances, I'm trying to simplify as fast as makes sense. Still have one rental property and a complicated SDIRA to unwind but have accounts cut by 2/3 and down to a fairly simple 4 fund portfolio with clear instructions on how to manage it without a FA.

In case of death document still needs updated and lots of practice in our future. But DW has the master password memorized!

What if your financial institutions lock your accounts once you pass away, regardless of who knows your password(s)?

 

[sengsational]

Are there 3 states for your financial accounts? 1) You're alive and they have no reason to think otherwise, 2) Your status is somehow in question but they have no documentation, 3) they have a death certificate.

If it's just 2 states, (1 and 3), then getting unexpected locked out isn't likely because you'd know if you sent the death certificate or not.

My sister calls these companies for medical, financial, utilities, etc and they say "We can only talk to Mike" and she says "I am Mike, and I'm telling you I want X." Unless they have the voice ID software, it works every time.

 

[Lewis Clark]

State 2 does exist. Institutions have their own policies on how to respond to a State 2 situation.

 

[calmloki]

We all do the best we can - and maybe most of us have an exaggerated view of our own importance. The world will carry on, your partner will do what they do. Probably won't be what you think is optimum, but "when I move from here to ghost, what's gonna matter most.." (32,000 days, Emerson Hart).

My gal would do real well on most anything - if there was something she wasn't better than most on it would be discarded and worked around or she would do the research and become an expert. Just her style. Or she would reach out - lord knows she's racked up some credits in life.

 

[target2019]

All,

I spend much of my financial-thinking time on - after I'm gone. How will my wife manage her finances. Like most of you, I do it myself today. There will come a time when either I can't do it or I'm not here to do it. What then? I'm not a fan of paying for a financial planner but I don't know if she has the interest in doing it herself. She has participated in the planning the last couple of years, but I manage things at a very detailed level that she won't have to and I think it makes it seem too overwhelming. I have tried to simplify over the years to make it easier for her. I have reduced to a single provider (Vanguard) and reduced to 8 funds (the four corners of the 9 squares of size vs growth/value for US and International). Plus Fixed Income and Cash. That gives 10 asset classes that have to be rebalanced each year. But then there are 4 accounts (Brokerage, Traditional IRA, Inherited IRA, ROTH IRA) that have to be considered in that rebalancing. There is cash flow planning to cover at least a 5 year horizon due Fixed Asset ladder (CDs in our case). And Withdrawal planning (which accounts to pull from), which, is pretty set now as we get close to RMD land. But she has to choose a withdrawal level for the year considering performance (account balances) and CPI in concert with needs planning.

Over the years I have developed 3 different generations of spreadsheets to do this. Each getting sequentially simpler. But the current version has 7 main tabs: Introduction & Instructions, Current Assets, Annual Monthly Planning, Withdrawal Planning, Available Cash Planning, Asset Allocation (This is pretty set), and Rebalance. She can, with a little assistance, do this now (we've had to go to monthly walk throughs as an annual walk through was difficult to recall). But what happens when there is something non-standard or the speadsheet fails or becomes outdated?

So at this point I either have to realize that this is a bridge to far, get even simpler, figure out a way to connect her to a fee-only planner that is content to wait maybe years, or lately I have been considering involving one or all of our kids (I would pay them to do this and they have the ability). I really don't know what to do.

What do you plan to do or actually do? I would especially like to hear from the spouse that had to take over or maybe an offspring who took over for a parent. What worked or didn't work for you? This has to be a very common occurrence for this group of self-money managers.

Another recent thread about these issues is https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/about-death-and-money-121366.html

Our approach is described a bit in that thread. We're doing similar things as you are. However, we're in two institutions (down from a handful). Our investments were always planned to an asset allocation. We may have 2 or 3 funds in various accounts. I've combined most of my retirement into SEP-IRA/Roth at Vanguard, and Rollover-IRA at Schwab.

Over the last 10 years I've tried to take into account my wife's perspective. We've both become more knowledgeable.

Slowly we are including our daughter in parts of this knowledge. She is the Executrix, and is willing to take on financial duties too. She married a tax CPA, so she'll review decisions with him before acting.

I don't think my spreadsheets will be of much use after. There's too much there that is not required to actually manage the situation that shall come...

 

[DrRoy]

DW doesn’t manage the investments but I discuss with her what we have and what I do with it. She did used to work at a bank and manage our checking account.
She now manages the autopay stuff. When I asked her the question, she said that she would figure it out.

 

[maestro]

I've been noting lately that having plenty of money solves a lot of issues........

I've been noticing lately that plenty of money can also cause a lot of heartache, too. What to do, what to do....

 

[TheWizard]

I've been noticing lately that plenty of money can also cause a lot of heartache, too. What to do, what to do....

Baloney
Just do bigger QCDs or whatever.
End of heartache...

 

[indiajust]

After several years use and exposure to Schwabs RoboTraded and rebalanced accounts, I advocate for setting an anchor position in such accounts to solve the problem you face.

They have intelligent advisor that is best for taxable because of its automated tax loss harvesting, quarterly fees. Then they have the roboetf mix (that includes gold allocation) which has a bit of cash drag and extremely low etf fees only. I use both.

Every time I screw up and make an own goal, I alter my account allocation towards more of the robo's and less of the brokerage. I spend from the brokerage so the glide path is certain. Plus nervous transfers if the volatility looks worse than the smooth ride I get from the Robo's. Easier to predict and manage taxes too.

I prefer to transfer inherited IRA in 5 years, so I am paying out 1/5, 1/4, 1/3, 1/2, 1/1. Did roth rollovers faster too, less accounts to manage.

 

[Raygun99]

My biggest fear is that even after all of the planning, DW falls for some SCAM or "trusted" helper and kids don't find out until it's too late. Heck, it could happen to me too. The bad guys never stop getting smarter!