Another Vanguard problem

[MarieIG]

Well for those who are still using the mutual fund platform each mutual fund is an account, right?

Fidelity must think they can generate enough in revenue to pay the transfer incentives.

I used to use the mutual fund platform, and was able to hold multiple funds in one account. If you have a traditional IRA and Roth IRA however, these would need to be separate accounts from your taxable.

 

[Texas Proud]

I learned today one of the consequences of no longer receiving a printed statement from a mutual fund company. Today, the trustee of my mother’s estate discovered a lost account. In 2012, TD Ameritrade stopped sending any statements of my mother’s account, and no email or other communications. In 2018, she passed. The trustee distributed all known assets, but was unaware of TDA since no statements for years. Schwab took over the account and emailed the trustee today of the account which transferred over, in the amount of $182K. If it hadn’t been for Schwab, the trustee would never have known of this “lost” account.

Interesting... I am not sure why it was not sent to the state...


I checked the state lost account site to see if there was any with my mom's name... found one in New York...



I think it is always a good thing for the executor check states where the person lived for lost accounts....

 

[swakyaby]

@ RunningBum, you make good points. My mother never moved, TD Ameriprise simply stopped sending any paper statements or tax forms in 2012. By then, her memory was failing, so my brother the co-trustee of the family living trust was collecting all financial statements and filing them in separate notebooks for easy reference and for tax purposes. He assumed the TDA account had been closed since there had been no statements for many years. I suspect that the statements stopped coming because something triggered the fraud dept at TDA and all communication ceased. Only when the account was acquired by Schwab this year did the trustee receive notice of the account’s existence.

 

[Texas Proud]

@ RunningBum, you make good points. My mother never moved, TD Ameriprise simply stopped sending any paper statements or tax forms in 2012. By then, her memory was failing, so my brother the co-trustee of the family living trust was collecting all financial statements and filing them in separate notebooks for easy reference and for tax purposes. He assumed the TDA account had been closed since there had been no statements for many years. I suspect that the statements stopped coming because something triggered the fraud dept at TDA and all communication ceased. Only when the account was acquired by Schwab this year did the trustee receive notice of the account’s existence.

I wonder why the IRS never sent a notice about income not being claimed on a tax return... we are talking over 10 years of income on a boatload of money...


I think you now have an income tax problem... need to go back and amend 10 plus years of tax returns... I do not think the stature of limitations apply as the income was not claimed..

 

[RetiredAt55.5]

Well for those who are still using the mutual fund platform each mutual fund is an account, right?

No, that's not true.

You can own more than 1 mutual fund in the same account (up to 20 in fact).

An account contains all the funds sharing the same physical mailing address and account type (e.g., Roth IRA, Traditional IRA, Rollover IRA, Joint, Individual, etc.).

 

[Gumby]

That's how mine have worked for the past 39 years. One Vanguard account, multiple mutual funds.

 

[swakyaby]

I wonder why the IRS never sent a notice about income not being claimed on a tax return... we are talking over 10 years of income on a boatload of money...


I think you now have an income tax problem... need to go back and amend 10 plus years of tax returns... I do not think the stature of limitations apply as the income was not claimed..

Yes, there are a lot of taxes and penalties to look forward to.

 

[easysurfer]

No hijack attempt here.

But thought I'd test the water with Fidelity chat as I do have a question about transferring assets from VG to Fido should I decide to go that route the future. Question is, if switching over (all I have are Trad IRA, Roth IRA, Mutual Funds), do I need to open accounts ahead of time at Fido as holding places?

The chat didn't get far. First rep said I need to log on to show I have an account with them. Fair enough. I told them I have a HSA with them. Logged, in. Then the rep said to get more info about HSA transfers, call a number (gave me number). I clarified, my question wasn't about HSAs, but about transferring other assets. Then the rep gave me Fido's general number and said "call that." Oh well .

 

[JoeWras]

No hijack attempt here.

But thought I'd test the water with Fidelity chat as I do have a question about transferring assets from VG to Fido should I decide to go that route the future. Question is, if switching over (all I have are Trad IRA, Roth IRA, Mutual Funds), do I need to open accounts ahead of time at Fido as holding places?

The chat didn't get far. First rep said I need to log on to show I have an account with them. Fair enough. I told them I have a HSA with them. Logged, in. Then the rep said to get more info about HSA transfers, call a number (gave me number). I clarified, my question wasn't about HSAs, but about transferring other assets. Then the rep gave me Fido's general number and said "call that." Oh well .

Answer: yes. Open blank accounts first. It can be a matter of minutes ahead if you already have a main account established.

I'm going to say since you don't have a main brokerage account yet, it may (I don't know the answer) slow you down.

Last week when I did my transfer, I opened up my IRA account and minutes later initiated the transfer of my IRA from VG. It was all done in a few days.

Like you, I started with an HSA and it was my only Fidelity account for a few years. Opening the subsequent accounts has been an easy online process.

 

[Koolau]

No hijack attempt here.

But thought I'd test the water with Fidelity chat as I do have a question about transferring assets from VG to Fido should I decide to go that route the future. Question is, if switching over (all I have are Trad IRA, Roth IRA, Mutual Funds), do I need to open accounts ahead of time at Fido as holding places?

The chat didn't get far. First rep said I need to log on to show I have an account with them. Fair enough. I told them I have a HSA with them. Logged, in. Then the rep said to get more info about HSA transfers, call a number (gave me number). I clarified, my question wasn't about HSAs, but about transferring other assets. Then the rep gave me Fido's general number and said "call that." Oh well .

Ah HA! SO FIDO isn't perfect after all.

Again. Kinda nice to hear that that (maybe) V isn't the worst of the big houses. I'm sure it's all a matter of personal experience. (Like I'm gonna whine about the $25 fee for paper reports at V.)

 

[easysurfer]

Answer: yes. Open blank accounts first. It can be a matter of minutes ahead if you already have a main account established.

I'm going to say since you don't have a main brokerage account yet, it may (I don't know the answer) slow you down.

Last week when I did my transfer, I opened up my IRA account and minutes later initiated the transfer of my IRA from VG. It was all done in a few days.

Like you, I started with an HSA and it was my only Fidelity account for a few years. Opening the subsequent accounts has been an easy online process.

So, you mean to open accounts with zero balances to transfer into? For example, if I have a VG Total Stock Index to open an equivalent Fido Total Stock Index with zero balance?

Thought I came across somewhere on Fidelity saying that if you don't have comparable account at the time, that one would be opened. But may just be wishful thinking .

Kind of begs the questions too. I want to do in-kind transfers. How do I know the blank accounts are eligible for in-kind? According to Fidelity? According to me? Is there some sort of method to cross off the say yes, in-kind?

 

[Phroig]

First open a Fidelity brokerage account, then transfer your assets in. You can hold most Vanguard index funds, but it’ll cost you to buy more. No charge to reinvest distributions. Many admiral managed funds can’t be transferred. Go to the Fidelity website and enter the ticker symbol to check.

 

[easysurfer]

First open a Fidelity brokerage account, then transfer your assets in. You can hold most Vanguard index funds, but it’ll cost you to buy more. No charge to reinvest distributions. Many admiral managed funds can’t be transferred. Go to the Fidelity website and enter the ticker symbol to check.

When I sign into my Fidelity HSA. I see a brokerage account number. Doesn't that mean I already have a brokerage account? I'd have no problem just getting Fido accounts similar to the Vanguard ones. If admiral managed funds can't be transferred, then what? I just looked at my accounts. All of them are admiral managed .

At this point trying to get ducks in line before any real action.

 

[Phroig]

When I sign into my Fidelity HSA. I see a brokerage account number. Doesn't that mean I already have a brokerage account? I'd have no problem just getting Fido accounts similar to the Vanguard ones. If admiral managed funds can't be transferred, then what? I just looked at my accounts. All of them are admiral managed .



At this point trying to get ducks in line before any real action.

You’ll need a separate taxable brokerage account. Ditto IRA/Roth. Any mutual funds that can’t transfer will have to be sold.

 

[easysurfer]

You’ll need a separate taxable brokerage account. Ditto IRA/Roth. Any mutual funds that can’t transfer will have to be sold.

Thanks for the reply. But my enthusiasm to switch over seems to have dropped a bit .

 

[Phroig]

Thanks for the reply. But my enthusiasm to switch over seems to have dropped a bit .

I just checked, and you may be able to hold the investor class at Fidelity. You can try to convert your managed funds from admiral to investor class and then transfer. Note that admiral index funds will transfer. You should call Fidelity, and ask about specific funds.

 

[easysurfer]

I just checked, and you may be able to hold the investor class at Fidelity. You can try to convert your managed funds from admiral to investor class and then transfer. Note that admiral index funds will transfer. You should call Fidelity, and ask about specific funds.

Thanks again. Something I don't intend to do today but good to know.

 

[JoeWras]

Regarding the transfer...

If you go to Fidelity's site and "start a transfer", it will walk you through the steps. If you don't have a brokerage or IRA account, it will literally point you to a button to open one.

If you have the account you choose it.

Then you tell it where you want the assets to come from. You'll pull down "Vanguard <x>" where the <x> is brokerage or mutual fund. You'll also give them your VG account number.

Fido's computer is smart enough to know if you'll have issues from there. For instance, a mutual fund account may throw up some blocks. I don't know, I didn't do it.

I had VG brokerage, so it asked me to proceed. Asked me do I want a full xfer. I said NO. So then it asked me which assets and I started typing them in. I only transfered my ETFs like "VTI" and Treasury CUSIPs. Those are easy. Should you type in something like "VTSAX", it may give you more options or tell you it is good to go. I don't know. It will know it is a VG mutual and determine if it is transferable in kind or not.

I got a warning about residuals, i.e. fractions of a share of ETFs. It didn't apply for me except in my IRA. Partial shares won't transfer in-kind and will be automatically sold.

So, yeah, there are things to look for. The process gave a lot of information as I went along, with points to "bail" along the way.

I will admit this: I've been thinking about this for about a year and decided after much reading here and on BH, that I'd only transfer my ETFs and Treasurys to keep it simple. You may complicate things trying to transfer certain VG mutual funds. Some easily transfer, some don't. So I took the uncertainty out of the equation.

 

[easysurfer]

Regarding the transfer...

If you go to Fidelity's site and "start a transfer", it will walk you through the steps. If you don't have a brokerage or IRA account, it will literally point you to a button to open one.

If you have the account you choose it.

Then you tell it where you want the assets to come from. You'll pull down "Vanguard <x>" where the <x> is brokerage or mutual fund. You'll also give them your VG account number.

Fido's computer is smart enough to know if you'll have issues from there. For instance, a mutual fund account may throw up some blocks. I don't know, I didn't do it.

I had VG brokerage, so it asked me to proceed. Asked me do I want a full xfer. I said NO. So then it asked me which assets and I started typing them in. I only transfered my ETFs like "VTI" and Treasury CUSIPs. Those are easy. Should you type in something like "VTSAX", it may give you more options or tell you it is good to go. I don't know. It will know it is a VG mutual and determine if it is transferable in kind or not.

I got a warning about residuals, i.e. fractions of a share of ETFs. It didn't apply for me except in my IRA. Partial shares won't transfer in-kind and will be automatically sold.

So, yeah, there are things to look for. The process gave a lot of information as I went along, with points to "bail" along the way.

I will admit this: I've been thinking about this for about a year and decided after much reading here and on BH, that I'd only transfer my ETFs and Treasurys to keep it simple. You may complicate things trying to transfer certain VG mutual funds. Some easily transfer, some don't. So I took the uncertainty out of the equation.

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I really only entertained making the switch about a couple months ago.

To me, I pretty much don't even recognize VG anymore.

I'm not much for ultimatums. All I really need are the mutual funds and the $25 fee per fund unless I have $5 Million is pretty much like if a spouse said "You better be home each night by 6 pm or else!" Translation: The else would be time to get them divorce papers ready .

 

[Texas Proud]

I transferred some VG to Schwab and it was pretty easy... I had transferred an account to Fidelity before and it was also easy...



The only thing that tripped me up was my cash account... I had money in a MM account that was not the broker cash account and it would not transfer... I had to go back into VG and 'sell' the shares and then it transferred... this was to Schwab but I bet it is the same with Fidelity...


I just want to see what is the max cash I can get for my transfer... anybody have a link?

 

[easysurfer]

I took a step back earlier today. Watched youtube videos like "What is a brokerage account?" Was helpful for me to watch.

I'll probably take the dive at the switching over before end of the year.

 

[RetMD21]

...I'm not much for ultimatums. All I really need are the mutual funds and the $25 fee per fund unless I have $5 Million is pretty much like if a spouse said "You better be home each night by 6 pm or else!" Translation: The else would be time to get them divorce papers ready ....

If the funds are available as ETFs it's easy to convert and move. If you want to keep funds you can easily convert to a Vanguard brokerage account, move them there, and just pay one fee.

Folks are saying that you can have one mutual fund account (not brokerage) holding multiple funds. I looked at my old time Vanguard consolidated statement from 2003 and see that I had different account numbers for each fund.

In any case, Vanguard effectively treats funds in mutual fund accounts as separate accounts charging the $25 fee per fund.

 

[JoeWras]

If the funds are available as ETFs it's easy to convert and move.

Yeah, forgot to mention that. If convertible, that's best done before switching to another brokerage.

 

[MarieIG]

Yeah, forgot to mention that. If convertible, that's best done before switching to another brokerage.

If the funds are in a taxable account and have gains, I would call to have a Vanguard employee convert those mutual funds which have ETF equivalents, to confirm no capital gains are triggered.

 

[JoeWras]

If the funds are in a taxable account and have gains, I would call to have a Vanguard employee convert those mutual funds which have ETF equivalents, to confirm no capital gains are triggered.

I thought you had to call to do the conversion. Did they add an on-line option?