Coronavirus - Health and preparedness aspects - II

[audreyh1]

Right, who knows how many people with the virus touched it prior to you, which would have transferred to to your finger, even if the milk container had been virus free prior to that. One weak link in the chain, and you're SOL.

Several medical/public health folks have pointed out that you are far more likely to catch the virus by person to person contact rather than from touching a contaminated surface, so certainly take precautions when handling public stuff, but all you can really do is wash your hands frequently and avoid touching your face.

 

[audreyh1]

I saw a photo taken in China in which people were using toothpicks to press elevator floor buttons.

I have been through airports - paper towels are useful for pushing elevator buttons or holding railings. You can pick some up each bathroom visit, then discard when you get through to your gate or wherever.

In general I avoided putting my hands on railings and poles. If I had to, I leaned my back against a railing.

A pen is also useful for elevator buttons. Or disposable chopsticks!

 

[Fermion]

Several medical/public health folks have pointed out that you are far more likely to catch the virus by person to person contact rather than from touching a contaminated surface, so certainly take precautions when handling public stuff, but all you can really do is wash your hands frequently and avoid touching your face.

So go to Wal-mart in something like this?

 

[Fermion]

I mean the hand cart is a bit over the top I guess.

 

[audreyh1]

So go to Wal-mart in something like this?

If you would want to wear such a thing, I think it means don't go out shopping anymore!

 

[tmm99]

I went to Costco last week in Ontario, Canada and a Costco worker asked me if I wanted her to wipe down the handle of my shopping cart. I said yes, but this happened after I brought the cart inside the store (where they check your membership.) I was like, she should have been asking where the carts are kept *before* I touched the handle, but anyway, it was a nice gesture...

 

[Kwirk]

I mean the hand cart is a bit over the top I guess.

And, the eyes are kind of exposed. One cough or sneeze...

 

[ziggy29]

I went to Costco last week in Ontario, Canada and a Costco worker asked me if I wanted her to wipe down the handle of my shopping cart. I said yes, but this happened after I brought the cart inside the store (where they check your membership.) I was like, she should have been asking where the carts are kept *before* I touched the handle, but anyway, it was a nice gesture...

At the food bank where I volunteer, we were using disinfectant wipes on the cart between each use.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

You are not wrong. Even seeming to take extreme precautions I would get contaminated. You also forgot that when I pressed the button on the credit card terminal at the self checkout to say "Ok" on accept charges, I picked up a tiny bit of virus on my index finger.

Essentially we are screwed, just don't know it yet.

While we are going to avoid crowds for awhile, my focus is more on trying to build up a good immune response to have a light case. I spent the morning researching best diets for autoimmune disorders, since that what the experts say the lung symptoms resemble. I hope if I eat healthier than the standard American diet and get more exercise, that can't hurt and may help.

 

[TromboneAl]

Tissue as Barrier??

Last night NBC had an expert show how he uses a tissue when opening doors, touching subway poles, etc. Also, I read that this was what Howard Hughes did.

It seems to me that a tissue wouldn't offer much protection. It's porous and absorbent.

I guess I'm wrong.

 

[sengsational]

Essentially we are screwed, just don't know it yet.

I read your milk between the knees post as tongue in cheek.

One reason I don't think it's quite as bad as some people think is the flight attendant "canary" doesn't seem to be falling prey.

One would presume that they're getting exposed regularly (since the virus moves large distances with aircraft), yet I've only heard of three attendants reportedly infected (just a post on this board with no link in the post, so still not confident of that bit of data).

Also, I haven't heard of flight attendants wearing masks but the United email said

This includes handing beverages directly to customers instead of allowing customers to touch a tray and ensuring all flight attendants wear gloves during service.

I'm not a big 'glove guy' because, other than remind you not to touch your own face, they probably convey the virus every bit as well as the skin on your fingers.

But the point is that, even being in the confined space of an aircraft, without a mask, there hasn't been a huge number of reports of flight attendants getting sick, and I think that's good news for transmissibility through airborne droplets.

So if the 'casual contact' vector (as 'proven' by flight attendant population's good fortune) is weak, then we're back to the cone of shame being the best prevention. Short of that, decontamination areas (the trunk of the car, a table near the entry of your house, etc) where objects (phone, key fob, purchased items) are wiped-down is probably going to be about the best prevention one can do (in addition to the standard CDC stuff of frequent hand washing, etc).

 

[TromboneAl]

Plenty of paper products at Costco today (limit 2). Not crowded either.

 

[braumeister]

I carefully take off the gloves and toss them, putting on a new pair (this is tricky as I have to hold the milk between my knees because I didn't want to touch a shopping cart or basket).

I read your milk between the knees post as tongue in cheek.

Maybe not. When I was a teenager, the priests used to tell the girls that an aspirin tablet was the most effective form of birth control. "Just hold it between your knees."

 

[Kwirk]

I think a dry tissue used briefly for opening a door and disposed without further use would be much better than directly touching a door knob. Perfect? I dunno.


Thoughtful use of gloves can also be a near equivalent to hand washing. Wash your hands, don gloves, contaminate gloves, carefully remove gloves and, voila, clean hands. Hand washing isn't possible in every situation and sanitizers are in short supply. Despite lubricating lotions my skin does not tolerate frequent washings.

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

I have been through airports - paper towels are useful for pushing elevator buttons or holding railings. You can pick some up each bathroom visit, then discard when you get through to your gate or wherever.

In general I avoided putting my hands on railings and poles. If I had to, I leaned my back against a railing.

A pen is also useful for elevator buttons. Or disposable chopsticks!

Since I wear long sleeved sweaters or sweatshirts for pretty much all of flu season, I've been in the habit for many, many years of pulling my sleeve down over my hand for things like that. Sure, I could cross-contaminate things from my sleeve to other surfaces, but I am mainly concerned about my hands. In the summer, I'll use the "knife edge" of my hand for the elevator buttons at work -- try touching your face with that part of your hand! It's very awkward, not something you'd do without thinking about it.

And, from working in a biologics lab, I wash my hands often, but in particular whenever I get home from the office or errands or whatever, and before handling food.

 

[timo2]

All that said, I don't think we should look at one mortality rate since it really depends so much on your age, immune system and presence or absence of other chronic conditions.

Absolutely. Using an overall number is really misleading. The Chinese Data showed sharp rises in mortality each 10 year group after 60.

 

[braumeister]

We now have the first confirmed case here in the heartland (what the rest of you call flyover country). Ten people in Kentucky have been tested so far, with just the one positive result.

The governor has declared a state of emergency "to allow access to greater resources to respond to the virus."

It's just a matter of time until we're all exposed, but personally I think the authorities are responding well so far.

 

[Fermion]

There should be some virus killing glove developed...maybe little tiny UV emitting sources all over it or some form of non staining disinfectant imbedded in the surface.

 

[braumeister]

There should be some virus killing glove

Set phasers to Disinfect.

 

[GenXguy]

The cone of shame and mask shown in the earlier pictures still have the eyes exposed. I watched a special on the Coronavirus, and they stated that the droplets containing the virus can travel 6 feet when someone cough or sneezes. So, if you have your eyes, nose, or mouth exposed, it's best to maintain a 6 foot or further social distance. By the time you hear someone cough or sneeze next to you, you've probably already been contaminated before you can take evasive action, although it would be best to move quickly because additional sneezing or coughing is likely.

 

[timo2]

I know other people posted information about what over 60 year old people should not do. What I found interesting in this article was the interviews with some 'experts' and how they had altered their behavior. The experts were Dr. William Schaffner, a Vanderbilt University professor and longtime adviser to the CDC, and Michael Osterholm, the former state epidemiologist for Minnesota,

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/06/heal...xF3nNl_X1yqz0DiKSoGN6-w9Q-7fCSFBpf7aIBz21TDv8

 

[W2R]

Thanks, everyone, for all the info and useful links related to coronavirus in one's 70's!

I accidently said I was 72, but actually right now I am 71. I was thinking that by the time COVID-19 fully reaches Louisiana, it might be June and I will have had my 72nd birthday. But, I'm not there yet and definitely do not wish to rush things.

They are saying 60, but that is a somewhat arbitrary, round number. The data seem to show that the curve starts bending somewhere in the 50s and really starts climbing in the 70s.

That said, age and "chronic conditions" are not independent variables, so it's hard to know how much of it is purely age and how much of it is because older folks tend to have more conditions that put them at greater risk.

So true. I think that everybody I know who is in my age group has some sort of chronic condition, whether it's blood pressure, Type 2, cholesterol, or something else.

Oh well. I talked to F about all this over lunch and right now he thinks it is overblown, at least so far. He points out that elections are coming up and the news media tend to get a little wacky around elections. I guess so but I would rather not take any undue risks. He also says that those cancelling their international travel seem to be booking travel to New Orleans instead, so business is booming at his part time "fun job".

 

[GenXguy]

I bet we could come up with some engineered shock collar device which detects if someone is about to touch their face and gives them a small shock. Maybe you would need to wear a RFID ring on each hand or something? Or better, the collar has a tiny camera with image recognition that can identify hands?

I've thought of this same thing, although I was just thinking of some audio that alerts you when your hand gets too close to your face. You might even train yourself not to touch your face so that you wouldn't need to use it all the time after using it for a while. Someone should develop one. I searched a little and didn't find any such thing to exist today.

Edit: Found this webpage that gives tips on avoiding touching your face:

https://www.self.com/story/how-to-stop-touching-your-face

 

[audreyh1]

Since I wear long sleeved sweaters or sweatshirts for pretty much all of flu season, I've been in the habit for many, many years of pulling my sleeve down over my hand for things like that. Sure, I could cross-contaminate things from my sleeve to other surfaces, but I am mainly concerned about my hands. In the summer, I'll use the "knife edge" of my hand for the elevator buttons at work -- try touching your face with that part of your hand! It's very awkward, not something you'd do without thinking about it.

And, from working in a biologics lab, I wash my hands often, but in particular whenever I get home from the office or errands or whatever, and before handling food.

I used my elbow through my jacket a couple of times when I didn't have anything else handy. I'm short - so I'm sure that helps.

 

[ncbill]

I tutor high school kids. Two days ago, I was contacted by a parent letting me know that one of her work colleagues tested positive to Covid-19 and 5 more of her colleagues are under mandatory quarantine. She decided to self-isolate for 14 days and asked me to switch to remote tutoring via email and FaceTime. It works rather well and I made the switch for all the kids I tutor. It eliminates a big source of exposure for me.

We both also tutor at-risk middle school kids (who have the misfortune of attending some of the lowest performing local schools) weekly and are wondering how long it can continue once the virus shows up here locally...I expect within the next week or two.

And I wonder if the current situation will finally shut down those nasty buffet restaurants.