Elon Musk - Time's person of the year

[Chuckanut]

Yes, he is controversial.

https://time.com/person-of-the-year-2021-elon-musk/

This is the man who aspires to save our planet and get us a new one to inhabit: clown, genius, edgelord, visionary, industrialist, showman, cad; a madcap hybrid of Thomas Edison, P.T. Barnum, Andrew Carnegie and Watchmen’s Doctor Manhattan, the brooding, blue-skinned man-god who invents electric cars and moves to Mars. His startup rocket company, SpaceX, has leapfrogged Boeing and others to own America’s spacefaring future. His car company, Tesla, controls two-thirds of the multibillion-dollar electric-vehicle market it pioneered and is valued at a cool $1 trillion.

In my mind Musk is one of those people who has to be watched for what he does not what he says. Anybody who hangs on his every word is hooked up to a bit of a Crazy Maker.

IMHO, one of the most fortuitous business mistakes ever made was trying to rip off Musk when he was in Russia trying to buy a few old ICBMs. On the flight back home, so the story goes, he sketched out his first design for a recoverable rocket booster and decided that it could be done. Maybe we should send those Russians a Thank You card for lighting a fire under this guy.

 

[Car-Guy]

He "seems" to be one of the brightest (innovative/visionaries) in history... I often wonder how much is "Musk" and how much is his money and people that make all of this happen.. I guess I'd give him credit for the "vision" but it's lot's of money and really smart people that work the details to make it happen...

I wonder what someone like Nikola Tesla could have accomplished if he had billions back in the day....

 

[jim584672]

Musk is a con artist.

 

[njhowie]

Musk is a con artist.

And yet, I don't see any other companies sending rockets or astronauts to the ISS. Boeing has made complete fools of themselves with their failures in the shadow of SpaceX's almost weekly successes.

How many decades have the auto manufactures quashed any discussion of EVs? Suddenly they're all looking to get in to the game? Some even saying they will not sell any ICE vehicles in the future.

Tesla is revolutionizing battery technology to provide power when the grid fails. Not only with home installs of Powerwalls, but large scale installs as well. He made an off the cuff offer to Australia to help with their power issues, they took him up on it, and he delivered.

The guy stretches the truth at times. That does not make a con artist. He's revolutionized industries and technology. In the end, he's delivered, and that's why he's the richest person on the planet. We all see the number of Teslas on the road, and there's more every time I notice. You'd have to be some con artist to get so many folks to fork over $50,000 to $100,000 a pop for a car that didn't live up to its hype.

 

[tulak]

Good for Musk.

I’m happy that we have people like him pushing tech forward. Reusable rockets, EVs, and then some of the fringe stuff like Hyperloop. Too bad we can’t clone him.

 

[MRG]

Polarizing guy.

In any case I'm glad we have a dreamer with a budget doing impossible things.

 

[aja8888]

And yet, I don't see any other companies sending rockets or astronauts to the ISS. Boeing has made complete fools of themselves with their failures in the shadow of SpaceX's almost weekly successes.

.

Boeing is run by bean counters, not visionaries or really good engineers.

 

[travelover]

Newsflash. People are complex. Henry Ford was a manufacturing genius and a shameless bigot and antisemite.

 

[kgtest]

If you want to know more insight into Musk, his first wife has put out a few YouTube video's on her failed marriage to him. She mentions to attain and sustain his levels of success comes with sacrifice, one of those being her marriage to him. She mentions in order to gain that level of success you absolutely need to rely on other people, which is sort of obvious. Earning cash and income is a literal pyramid scheme of simply effecting the most amount of people to gain the most amount of money. The more people you can effect, the more money you will earn. Similar theory to some of the big movie stars, they understand if they aren't a household name globally, they will never reach the multi-millions they dream of.

Elon Musk's first wife describes their relationship:

 

[W2R]

Musk is a con artist.

+1

Although I never met the man and know nothing about him, I do tend to agree. He really puts off some very strong "con man vibes", in my opinion.

So personally I wouldn't trust him as far as I can spit (and honestly, despite my years in Texas I never learned how to spit). Maybe I can't spit but I have seen enough con artists in my lifetime that I can recognize one a mile off.

 

[Midpack]

People like Musk and Jobs aren’t ordinary people, so maybe we shouldn’t judge them as such? They are smarter, more visionary, and hard working than most of us can begin to comprehend, self included of course. Musk has accomplished quite a bit, and he seems to understand the tech involved with Tesla and SpaceX in far greater detail than a simple money guy. Compare his command of EVs with any legacy automaker CEO, absolutely no comparison. He says controversial things sometimes, but nothing so offensive that I’d judge him on other than his actual accomplishments. His candor is refreshing compared to many high profile people with PR people pulling their strings. And anyone who thinks any of the legacy automakers, or legislators would have driven where the world is today on EVs, especially the US, is kidding themselves. Many legacy automakers are still in denial or way more talk than action (production and sales).

 

[Mr. Tightwad]

I liked it when he told Bernie Sanders "I keep forgetting you're still alive".

 

[W2R]

Oh, and then there's the following:

Musk has been the subject of criticism due to unorthodox or unscientific stances and highly publicized controversies. In 2018, he was sued for defamation by a British caver who advised in the Tham Luang cave rescue; a California jury ruled in favor of Musk. In the same year, he was sued by the US Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) for falsely tweeting that he had secured funding for a private takeover of Tesla. He settled with the SEC, temporarily stepping down from his chairmanship and agreed to limitations on his Twitter usage. Musk has spread misinformation about the COVID-19 pandemic and has received criticism from experts for his other views on such matters as artificial intelligence, cryptocurrency, and public transport.

I wouldn't PERSONALLY call that "smarter, more visionary, and hard working than most of us can begin to comprehend". Oh, well, I admit it's probably hard for many of us to comprehend how anybody could do so many stupid things and expect the hero-worship to continue unabated.

 

[Sojourner]

Musk is a con artist.

I watched this whole video, and I think "con artist" is quite a stretch. A con artist is a person who habitually lies to and cheats people out of their money (or other valuables, like their votes), while never delivering on any promises or living up to any of their own hype. Elizabeth Holmes (founder of Theranos, currently on trial for wire fraud) is a nearly perfect example of a world-class con artist. Musk, OTOH, has delivered on at least two major fronts: SpaceX and Tesla. Yes, he's had some crazy ideas, pulled some unseemly stunts, and made some big mistakes, but he has delivered on enough big, bold stuff to be entirely unworthy of the "con artist" label. If you actually think that Musk is a con artist, then what about Steve Jobs? Bill Gates? Go read about some of their shadier wheelings and dealings over the years.

And yet, I don't see any other companies sending rockets or astronauts to the ISS. Boeing has made complete fools of themselves with their failures in the shadow of SpaceX's almost weekly successes.

How many decades have the auto manufactures quashed any discussion of EVs? Suddenly they're all looking to get in to the game? Some even saying they will not sell any ICE vehicles in the future.

Tesla is revolutionizing battery technology to provide power when the grid fails. Not only with home installs of Powerwalls, but large scale installs as well. He made an off the cuff offer to Australia to help with their power issues, they took him up on it, and he delivered.

The guy stretches the truth at times. That does not make a con artist. He's revolutionized industries and technology. In the end, he's delivered, and that's why he's the richest person on the planet. We all see the number of Teslas on the road, and there's more every time I notice. You'd have to be some con artist to get so many folks to fork over $50,000 to $100,000 a pop for a car that didn't live up to its hype.

+1

 

[MuirWannabe]

A quirky hard driving visionary who gets things accomplished. I like him and cheer for him to succeed in his ventures. The fact he’s not always in lock step with the powers that be, only makes him more admirable in my book. As for Time magazine, I didn’t know they were still a thing.

 

[Sojourner]

We all see the number of Teslas on the road, and there's more every time I notice. You'd have to be some con artist to get so many folks to fork over $50,000 to $100,000 a pop for a car that didn't live up to its hype.

Exactly. A true con artist would be selling Teslas for $200k and the cars would be breaking down like lemons all over the roads.

 

[Gumby]

Just a reminder that the Time Person of the Year is who the magazine's editors consider to be the person who "for better or for worse... has done the most to influence the events of the year". They have not always been people you or I would consider to have been "good" people. Among other Persons of the Year have been Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Ayatollah Khomeini, Richard Nixon, Deng Xiaoping, and Vladimir Putin.

 

[Midpack]

Some people feel better about themselves by tearing down others who’ve accomplished more in a month than 99.99% of us will in our lifetimes. If they can find something questionable or controversial about a famous person, they feel that discredits everything else the person has accomplished - proof by exception. It’s how so many experts are discredited these days, often by people with little to offer themselves. It’s become a national sport in the US.

Would we actually be better off without Musk, Jobs, Gates, etc.?

 

[Gumby]

Famed science fiction writer Isaac Asimov had a wise observation about that --

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

 

[Letj]

ASD/Asperger’s seems a necessary ingredient. Our neurotypical brains don’t seem to yield to many like Musk.

 

[USGrant1962]

Just a reminder that the Time Person of the Year is who the magazine's editors consider to be the person who "for better or for worse... has done the most to influence the events of the year". They have not always been people you or I would consider to have been "good" people. Among other Persons of the Year have been Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Ayatollah Khomeini, Richard Nixon, Deng Xiaoping, and Vladimir Putin.

And then there are the persons who aren't a person!

 

[braumeister]

Newsflash. People are complex. Henry Ford was a manufacturing genius and a shameless bigot and antisemite.

A good point to keep in mind.

Isaac Newton was a great genius, but he spent years of his life working in alchemy and biblical chronology. How much more could he have achieved without those distractions?

Remembering that, I'm willing to give people like Musk a pass on most of his foibles.

 

[steelyman]

Maybe EVs should be the tech of the year.

I’m looking forward to a company that produces safe, affordable vehicles.

 

[MC Rider]

Famed science fiction writer Isaac Asimov had a wise observation about that --

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

It seems more people than ever are proud of their ignorance and not going to do a thing to educate themselves.

 

[ERD50]

I watched this whole video, and I think "con artist" is quite a stretch.

... but he has delivered on enough big, bold stuff to be entirely unworthy of the "con artist" label. If you actually think that Musk is a con artist, then what about Steve Jobs? Bill Gates? Go read about some of their shadier wheelings and dealings over the years.
...

Have not watched the video yet, but from what I know, I'd say "con artist" does fit some of the things he has done/said. But he has delivered on many things, so I would not say "con artists" over-all. But I'd say both can be true, they aren't mutually exclusive.

Look at his promises, over and over and over again for the self-driving (Autopilot) capability for Telsa. This isn't just the kind of over-promising and slipped schedules that often occur for product introductions, his claims were beyond the pale. No way they could have been made in good faith, he's too smart for that.

Same for some of his claims about the environmental positives to EVs. They took down one of the well-to-wheel charts, it was really using some bad numbers.

And he claims:

https://www.businessinsider.com/elo...-how-the-electric-car-got-its-revenge-2011-10

"You have enough electricity to power all the cars in the country if you stop refining gasoline," says Musk. "You take an average of 5 kilowatt hours to refine [one gallon of] gasoline, something like the Model S can go 20 miles on 5 kilowatt hours."

But if you put some rough numbers to that, based on gallons of gasoline refined in the US, and the total electrical production of the US, it sounds hard to believe that much could go to refining. And it is (hard to believe). Turns out the ~ 5 kWh is the total energy used to refine gasoline, and only a small % of that is from purchased electricity. Much of the energy comes from the petroleum itself, the products that can't be sold profitably. And of course, gasoline is only one product, if you eliminated gasoline you'd still need to refine for jet fuel, heating oil, etc. And while I think you can slant the process some for more/less gasoline, you will still get a fair amount of gasoline-like product.

Musk (or at least his staff), are too smart to not know this is false. It's a con game.

...

Quote:
Originally Posted by njhowie ...

How many decades have the auto manufactures quashed any discussion of EVs? Suddenly they're all looking to get in to the game? Some even saying they will not sell any ICE vehicles in the future. ...

+1

Are you sure about that? IIRC, the claims were something like all their vehicles, or all 'new models', will be 'electrified' by xxxx date. And 'electrified' includes hybrids, with an ICE.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g35562831/ev-plans-automakers-timeline/

The only one I see there is Jaguar" planning to be all EV by 2025". The others are mush-mouth, and still selling ICE to some markets (China for one).

"net zero" and "carbon free" are not the same (well, even if they do go 100% EV). Those are a shell game.

-ERD50