Entering the "dead zone" before ER

[Which Roger]

Can't help you, I'm a type C personality. I coasted the last 2 years -

Me too. But coasting can be more stressful than staying fully engaged. I'll never forget the day that my boss offered me "an important assignment that would be very visible to upper management". This was after I set my ER date but before I had told anybody. Yes, I was able to weasel out of the "opportunity".

 

[Aerides]

I'll never forget the day that my boss offered me "an important assignment that would be very visible to upper management". This was after I set my ER date but before I had told anybody. Yes, I was able to weasel out of the "opportunity".

Hah i got a few of those attempts in my final year or so. "Visibility" is code for "this is crap grunt work, no one wants it, and there's no upside".

Expert weaseling is necessary once on a glide path.

 

[Midpack]

I was FI in 2005, but didn't RE until 2011. I don't consider any of that the dead zone.

My motivation ebbed gradually and I didn't really lose interest until about 2009. I used that period to try things at work that I shied away from before, stretch goals of my own if you will. That kept the job rewarding, as I was able to achieve many of them.

I've always been pretty candid and direct, but I became even more so those last two years. Not belligerent or disrespectful, but VERY candid. For the most part, it was welcomed by my boss, peers, co-workers, etc.

The real unpleasant "dead zone" to me is the period between when you announce your retirement, and when you actually leave. I gave my boss 3 months notice but told him it was a courtesy and to keep it to himself until a month before my retirement date. He waited a couple days and informed the entire company I was leaving . That 3 months was torture, with all the questions and jealousy about early retirement (weeks is one thing, months is another) and co-workers and peers unsure about how to deal with me. I've described it in detail earlier, so I won't repeat the details, but it was an awful grind until the last week or two.

The lesson: Though many people will argue otherwise - no one is so indispensable they have to give months of notice, 2-4 weeks is plenty for 99%+ of us. CEO's, heads of state, Steve Jobs, Dalai Lamas and other seemingly irreplaceable people are replaced all the time. I watched my employees panic when we lost people, I downsized or replaced dozens of people, and yet we flourished every single time.

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

I'm not anywhere near my ER target, but I've almost certainly crossed my minimum threshold. I want to get a lot farther, but... I'm definitely constantly running scenarios now and thinking about how much do I really want to hit goal X of annual spending. It feels like it is impacting my motivation and enjoyment at work. :/

I'm still new here, so I don't really have a NW or annual spend target, but I'm still kind of where you are. I know we could retire today and survive, and even pay for college...if we ate ramen for every meal, too. And that's probably an exaggeration, but I want to get a lot farther and know that most of our biggest expenses are behind us. That's why we're completely debt-free except for a 0% car loan that was too good to pass up, we're doing everything we can to get ourselves in a good position to retire.

I'm pretty happy with my day-to-day work, it's not too stressful, yet it's sometimes interesting and challenging. At worst it's a bit boring, but not too tedious. But I'm done trying to impress and get promoted, because I really don't need the money or the stress.

 

[Lawrencewendall]

I'm torn between the "dead zone"and the OMY syndrome. I REALLY enjoy my j*b which involves national security, cyber security and national critical infrastructure but the numbers say I can walk away and experience this new found freedom everyone here talks about. I'm trying to dis-associate who I am from what I do but I've been doing this since I was 19. I do have numerous hobbies so boredom should not be an issue. Heck, I could spend half my days just cruising ER.

 

[workmyfingerstothebone]

Let it go

My last raise moved my annual salary to $130,000, I retired one month later at 57 in 2016. Money left on the table, most definitely, but we have enough money for a good 30+ years of retirement .



No regrets, would definitely do it again.

 

[Floridatennisplayer]

I am planning on bailing next June. I am dead mentally and emotionally from my job. High pressure medical device sales. I am a walking zombie. Been in sales now for 40 years and I am just trying to make it through the day. Now I am in full on survival mode.

 

[Floridatennisplayer]

And to the OP....once you hit 8 figures!!!! If I was anywhere near 10 million I would bail! I just hit 2M no debt and still nervous.

 

[pb4uski]

I think anyone that works longer than they need to are a bit crazy.

I concede it is hard when you are making the big bucks to hang it up and "leave so much on the table".... but retirement is so much better than working!

For me, while I enjoyed working and my colleagues, continued work was just enriching the federal and state governments (I paid more in taxes than the average family earned) and our heirs (but they'll likely get plenty anyway).... so why? I guess if I had been in a profession that helped people in need rather than just making rich people richer I might have felt differently.

Dawg, are you selling the business or just winding it down? How long will it take to evacuate?

 

[JoeWras]

I guess if I had been in a profession that helped people in need rather than just making rich people richer I might have felt differently.

+1

All the pressure to work Friday nights and weekends seems to pivot on some c-suite's compensation plan.

 

[Lukeee]

Gosh - leaving money on the table! At some point it's no longer about the money!

Totally agree with this.... the reason I’m here is because time became more important than money.

And quoting @freedom56 above

“1- Do not burn any bridges - you want to leave on good terms
2- Stay friendly with all co-workers
3- Get a count-down timer app to monitor your approaching end date
4- Make sure you have a lot of projects and hobbies lined up
5- Get your expenses under control. Don't buy stuff you don't need
6- In addition to your kids, you should plan time to help take care of your parents or in-laws - they will need help of some sort”

I agree to all except #3. I’m in the dead zone now too and looking at a countdown app seems to make time slow down.

#4 - I’ve been doing lots of home projects to fill time to the extent that my body is sore. Hobbies and wish list of things to do growing.

I would add a #7 of updating your bucket list. Mine has grown as ER means that you should be able to grow the list from 10-20+ as time isn’t as much a restraint.

 

[Perryinva]

Well, “leaving money on the table” can mean different things. I have a decent non COLA pension that grows fairly large amounts each year until I am 65. So the mental trick that requires the most work is that while it is easy to be FI for RE today, there is the case where high inflation erodes the pension value and I feel required to make sure the investment savings part is large enough to cover that possibility. This is one of the few forums that truly appreciates the damage that inflation can do. Most people on other boards can’t think future costs more that a few years down the road. You read all the time “My expenses are only $3k/mo, and SS plus my investments bring in $4K, so I am all set for the next 35 years.” At least here people understand that the topping off for contingency is not superfluous, but part of an integral safety margin, and that each extra year worked not only increases NW/income, but that same NW has to support you for one less year.

But that doesn’t help the dead zone feeling until I am 62, where I feel the added investments should enable me to be more comfortable regardless of what FIRECALC and ORP say about leaving today, even though I still feel that 62 is early.

 

[ER Eddie]

I have been vetting out much of my pre-ER analysis/strategies/jitters on this site recently as I get closer to launching at MY predestined ER date of 12/31/19 (age 55). I have run the math on WRs/AA structures/RE budgets and have spent some time trying to envision my post- ER life. In my case, my target date is somewhat arbitrary as it was based on a preset plan some years ago that included having all of my 4 kids college bought/paid for/out of the house and some wedding $$ in the bank (2 kids left to get married). My self-employed career has worked out well for me in being very lucrative and allowing me to support my family at a very nice lifestyle, yet sock away some dough. It does, however, require me to be fully engaged to reap maximum rewards ($) and I would be lying if I said I wasn't competitive and enjoyed closing deals and being one of the higher producing people in my industry. The few people in my industry who I have shared my ER plans with think I am crazy for leaving the business this early knowing the earning potential I am leaving on the table, so at this point, I just keep quiet. Up until recently (really the first of the year), I have been able to stay somewhat motivated to "hit" my numbers, but frankly, I am more or less where I need to be numbers wise at end of 2019 today. All of this has be sitting in somewhat of an uncomfortable/unmotivated/paralyzed "dead zone" which I am not comfortable with. In a sense, I feel like I am sitting around waiting for the end of 2019. Like many on this site, I have always been a big goal setter/planner and with a SAHW and 4 kids, I have always had plenty of motivation to go out and do battle every day for the sake of the cause! So now, as I dwell in this dead zone, there continues to be a little internal battle going on where perhaps my ego/sense of pride is telling me to get out there and slay it for the next 17 months while another part of me says, I got what I need, so just relax and coast in to the finish line.

Anyone else fall into this dead zone when they could smell the goal line? How did you Type A, higher income folks close out?

I have a couple thoughts. Some of them may have been expressed already.

1. Everyone needs a purpose and a sense of meaning in their life. You've been very driven in your career. If you let that go, you're going to need to find some other project or responsibility that gives you a sense of meaningful, productive activity. You can use the "dead time" to plan for that. What comes next?

2. If you get apprehensive as the retirement date approaches, you always have the option of downshifting to part-time, rather than stopping completely. That can be a way to transition gradually, rather than abruptly. Since you're self-employed, you can dial it back to whatever level suits you. Then you can cut out completely when you're ready. It gives you a little transition time. You can experiment with your new lifestyle and activities a little. And if work still provides any satisfaction, you can continue to benefit that way, as well as stacking up a bit more of a cushion.

 

[Lienlord]

I am @ 10 working days left in the office. I've been working only 25 hours per week since April, using FMLA and sick leave to assist my parents through various medical issues. But in Sept I will switch to continuous FMLA until my medical leave runs out in early Oct, and then let my boss know I won't be returning. We'd been FIRE for awhile but it wasn't until I started taking off early that I realized how ready I was. My wife says after being off work at noon each day she can't imagine me going to back to coming home late every evening like before.
But it has been hard to "maintain" these past months, and the next 10 working days will be full of mixed emotions. At 54, I'm at the top of my career and earnings, and realize I am turning a page that will never be turned back. My job tests every one of my skills and forces me to stay sharp, will informed and at the top of my game. I wonder what leaving it will do to those skills, and fear the thought of no longer being "The Man". But it comes with a price that no longer seems worth it.

 

[BoodaGazelle]

My original plan was to retire at 59 1/2, but I ended up working another year. At the risk of sounding flippant, there is really no magic formula. It all comes down to 1) how much money do you have, 2) how much do you spend now and in the future, 3) can you protect your money from dramatic losses during market downturns.

After now being retired for a little over a year, I am still coming to terms with what it means and that I can afford to do even more now than I did when I was working, thanks to having worked and saved for that reason.

I don´t believe there will ever be a totally anxiety free way to ER. But since it sounds like you have done everything that can reasonably be done and planned for, you should go for it. You can always go back to work and or do something completely new with your life.

 

[Dtail]

I am @ 10 working days left in the office. I've been working only 25 hours per week since April, using FMLA and sick leave to assist my parents through various medical issues. But in Sept I will switch to continuous FMLA until my medical leave runs out in early Oct, and then let my boss know I won't be returning. We'd been FIRE for awhile but it wasn't until I started taking off early that I realized how ready I was. My wife says after being off work at noon each day she can't imagine me going to back to coming home late every evening like before.
But it has been hard to "maintain" these past months, and the next 10 working days will be full of mixed emotions. At 54, I'm at the top of my career and earnings, and realize I am turning a page that will never be turned back. My job tests every one of my skills and forces me to stay sharp, will informed and at the top of my game. I wonder what leaving it will do to those skills, and fear the thought of no longer being "The Man". But it comes with a price that no longer seems worth it.

I had some similarities. Was at the top of my game and career and had 72 people reporting to me. Nevertheless, took a package (as would have been laid off eventually) but couldn't get another job. Discovered I could FIRE, so I did.
Part of how I got over not being the man was to cut all ties with my former colleagues and thus I don't need or want office updates and can concentrate on retirement.

 

[flyingaway]

I had some similarities. Was at the top of my game and career and had 72 people reporting to me. Nevertheless, took a package (as would have been laid off eventually) but couldn't get another job. Discovered I could FIRE, so I did.
Part of how I got over not being the man was to cut all ties with my former colleagues and thus I don't need or want office updates and can concentrate on retirement.

This is what I plan to do. I do not interact with other people very often at work.

 

[brett]

I was in that dead zone for two years. I was waiting for a golden handshake to come along. It did, and it was well worth the wait.

What did I do. First off, as others have said, my perspective on work changed when I finally realized that I could FIRE at any time. Not certain why, but it did change.

I focused on planning for retirement. I spent six months searching for a new FA. Dumped our stock broker, dumped our bank. We completely changed our personal financial management environment and saved (or avoided) a fair amount of cost.

The second thing we did was focus on what we would do to set ourselves up for retirement from a personal perspective. We made decisions to downsize and sell. So we spent some time preparing our home for sale. We also updated our travel bucket list.

Before I knew it our country management was changed and a package was on the way to me. It was like winning the lottery and well worth the wait. We sort of hit FIRE running as it were. Two years to get our heads around it and make some tentative plans. The big difference for me was that the person I reported to was 2000 miles away.

 

[JoeWras]

The golden handshake doesn't always come, and it getting rarer and rarer these days. You have to weigh the anxiety of waiting for it vs. going for it.

 

[flyingaway]

Well, “leaving money on the table” can mean different things. I have a decent non COLA pension that grows fairly large amounts each year until I am 65. So the mental trick that requires the most work is that while it is easy to be FI for RE today, there is the case where high inflation erodes the pension value and I feel required to make sure the investment savings part is large enough to cover that possibility. This is one of the few forums that truly appreciates the damage that inflation can do. Most people on other boards can’t think future costs more that a few years down the road. You read all the time “My expenses are only $3k/mo, and SS plus my investments bring in $4K, so I am all set for the next 35 years.” At least here people understand that the topping off for contingency is not superfluous, but part of an integral safety margin, and that each extra year worked not only increases NW/income, but that same NW has to support you for one less year.

But that doesn’t help the dead zone feeling until I am 62, where I feel the added investments should enable me to be more comfortable regardless of what FIRECALC and ORP say about leaving today, even though I still feel that 62 is early.

I was thinking that working one more year could support 3 years of retirement. My reasoning is similar to yours. By working one more year, I get to contribute one year expenses to the portfolio, the portfolio grows for one more year support, and I have one fewer year to support.

 

[W2R]

In a sense, I feel like I am sitting around waiting for the end of 2019. Like many on this site, I have always been a big goal setter/planner and with a SAHW and 4 kids, I have always had plenty of motivation to go out and do battle every day for the sake of the cause! So now, as I dwell in this dead zone, there continues to be a little internal battle going on where perhaps my ego/sense of pride is telling me to get out there and slay it for the next 17 months while another part of me says, I got what I need, so just relax and coast in to the finish line.

Anyone else fall into this dead zone when they could smell the goal line? How did you Type A, higher income folks close out?

Well, my income probably wasn't as high as yours, but I suppose I made up for it with raging out-of-control ambition combined with over-the-top work ethic.

What I did during those last months was take on the task of providing a smooth transition of my many roles for the agency. That's not easy if you put your all into it! I always did the best job I possibly could of everything, so I did the best job I possibly could of winding things up, transferring responsibility and the necessary documents and paperwork to the proper persons, and so on. Because my job had several facets and was pretty complex, it took months to unwind all of the complexity, get various parts transferred over to the appropriate assigned people, and then train and advise those who were "inheriting" various parts of it.

I decided to take all of my vacation time earned (plus maximum carry-over from the prior year) during the last year, rather than get paid for it. So, during the last few months I was spending a lot of time out of the office. After each mini-vacation of 1-2 weeks at a time, I would come back in, rescue those who needed rescuing, and train them on how to rescue themselves from similar situations once I was gone for good.

It was a great ego stroke for me to see how totally freaked out people got when something unexpected came up and they didn't have me to lean on any more. Many opportunities to say "Ha! Bet you didn't know I was dealing with all this, now did you! Here's what you need to do next time." It was also a good opportunity for the transfer of institutional knowledge.

As for new responsibilities, I turned them down because I had my hands full. Not only did I have the above, but also I was attending a lot of meetings in place of my supervisor.

So while I was doing different things, I wasn't relaxing and coasting in to the finish line. I was charging towards it at full speed, giving it my all. Which, after all, is consistent with how I choose to live my life.

 

[mystang52]

Many years ago, at midpoint of my career, I was on a business trip. One of the co-workers on the trip (an older woman) had told me during dinner that she was working by choice, and no longer needed work income. I remember thinking what a great feeling that must be, and then I reached that point myself at age 58. Or should I say, I realized I was at that point then, but had reached it a couple of years earlier.
Work hard, or coast, as you are comfortable doing until the end of 2019. But as others have said, the decision to ER should not be about the reduction in income. Whenever you ER there will be that same reduction in income. If you can live your ER lifestyle, may as well do it sooner rather than later.

 

[Perryinva]

While I agree that sooner is better than later, it is most definitely not true that there will always be “that same reduction in income “. The whole POINT for many people to delay until they do is so there specifically is no reduction in income, or even preferably an increase in income, to compensate for decay due to inflation and no “raises”. Naturally if your ER lifestyle will cost far less than your employed lifestyle, then you CAN leave much earlier before pre & post incomes match. But Many people are not of the mind that it is worth quitting the workforce at a cost that provides a less than desired retirement, simply to stop working, especially here.

Maybe you meant you can always find that “leaving money on the table” is a good excuse to not retire, in which case I agree. Once my NET retirement income is equal or a bit better than my current NET spendable, then more accumulation is harder to justify at the expense of the remaining days of life left. I am currently at about equal. 620 more days bumps me above with some contingency built in.

 

[audreyh1]

Well, “leaving money on the table” can mean different things. I have a decent non COLA pension that grows fairly large amounts each year until I am 65. So the mental trick that requires the most work is that while it is easy to be FI for RE today, there is the case where high inflation erodes the pension value and I feel required to make sure the investment savings part is large enough to cover that possibility. This is one of the few forums that truly appreciates the damage that inflation can do. Most people on other boards can’t think future costs more that a few years down the road. You read all the time “My expenses are only $3k/mo, and SS plus my investments bring in $4K, so I am all set for the next 35 years.” At least here people understand that the topping off for contingency is not superfluous, but part of an integral safety margin, and that each extra year worked not only increases NW/income, but that same NW has to support you for one less year.

But that doesn’t help the dead zone feeling until I am 62, where I feel the added investments should enable me to be more comfortable regardless of what FIRECALC and ORP say about leaving today, even though I still feel that 62 is early.

Each extra year worked means one less healthy younger year in retirement. Once you are FI, it’s a trade off.

 

[COcheesehead]

Each extra year worked means one less healthy younger year in retirement. Once you are FI, it’s a trade off.

^^^This is where my head is at. Many of the things I want to do require physical fitness and health. Having $X more dollars that will probably go unspent in my brokerage account isn't worth giving up some of the best years of my life.