Keeping House of Elderly Parent out of Probate

[Cobra9777]

how do you know if it is undisputed until it goes thru probate? I recently signed my rights away on a will for a relative. I was not named in the will, but legally had an interest. If I hadn't signed they would have sent registered mail to make sure all possible interested parties were notified. I would assume you need all these people notified before anyone can be determined as "undisputed". This may go beyond "close" family.

I would expect if a car is put in a living trust, then it could be retitled to the beneficiary at death outside of probate.

I don't know the answer to your question. I was told by an estate attorney that all heirs have to sign the affidavit indicating that they are the only known heirs of the deceased. And it has to be notarized. But no other documentation is required.

My former boss at Megacorp did this when his Dad passed a couple years ago. He also inherited the house (via TOD deed) and a few fairly large financial accounts via TOD/POD/beneficiary designation. But the remaining estate was not probated because it only consisted of two vehicles and a house full of furniture and other personal effects. He is an only child and he's the only one who signed the affidavit.

 

[CountryGal]

I have no idea why avoiding probate would be such a big deal? It really isn't complicated if the estate itself is simple (a few accounts, house/property).

Having done this for a simple estate in PA.. avoiding or limiting the lawyer fees would be part of the big deal, in my opinion.

My folks estate was no more than 200k including the house and IRA. Between filing early estate with state to get a discount. Filing estimated estate and then actual estate tax info, made the lawyer fees high. To compound that the lawyer did not have ANY office staff and did all the work himself. He also was not computer literate and had trouble "fitting" my excel spreadsheets into his "word" format.

 

[RE2Boys]

Having done this for a simple estate in PA.. avoiding or limiting the lawyer fees would be part of the big deal, in my opinion.

My folks estate was no more than 200k including the house and IRA. Between filing early estate with state to get a discount. Filing estimated estate and then actual estate tax info, made the lawyer fees high. To compound that the lawyer did not have ANY office staff and did all the work himself. He also was not computer literate and had trouble "fitting" my excel spreadsheets into his "word" format.

PA has an inheritance tax (not estate tax). I prepared the inheritance tax return myself, ran it by the lawyer, I was the doer, lawyer the advisor, paid him on an hourly basis.

 

[sengsational]

Thanks, all, for fleshing-out so many options. I always learn so much from the collective wisdom on this board! I'll post back here to let you know how it goes.

 

[jim584672]

In NY there is a Life Estate deed. The title transfers on death. The owner technically no longer owns the property but has a right to live in it until death. This is a way to avoid estate recovery.

 

[sengsational]

In NY there is a Life Estate deed. The title transfers on death. The owner technically no longer owns the property but has a right to live in it until death. This is a way to avoid estate recovery.

That's the first thing I checked, but we don't have that in NC.

 

[Brat]

To gift a home may be subject to gift tax. I wouldn't do that.

Establish a living trust that is congruent with your parent's wishes then change the title of the house the same as the title of the trust.

Yes, you will pay an attorney to do that but you would likely incur more attorney fees if you don't.

 

[sengsational]

I think I'll buy some Nolo books today on estate planning and living trusts. Not that I will try the DIY approach, but I think it will help me pick out an appropriate lawyer.

 

[Gill]

I haven't read every post in this thread, but the answer is very simple. A will leaving the property to the two of you is the answer with contingency provisions if one of you predecease. Probating the will and transferring title of the house is no big deal.
Gill

 

[sengsational]

Thanks Gill. I've interviewed a few estate lawyers, and they're tending to agree that putting the house and/or cars into a living trust isn't worth the trouble and expense as compared to just doing probate. Apparently in NC real estate doesn't necessarily need to go through probate. I need clarification on that bit, but I've found a guy who knows the specific NC county probate people, and he says they're easy to work with.

 

[Brat]

That is a huge relief.

 

[akidagain2018]

"Keeping House of Elderly Parent out of Probate"

Sometimes the way we state a problem limits the range of solutions to things that are really not optimum. I would suggest that you state your problem in terms of the result you want, not talking about the process to get to the result. I think your problem is to arrange for the transfer to occur in the simplest and most tax-efficient way. The process (i.e. avoiding probate) is really irrelevant.

& BTW, that basis step up (assuming he has a low basis in the house) is A Very Big Deal. Usually, selling or giving the house to the heirs prior to death is A Very Bad Idea. A good trusts & estates attorney can make sure this doesn't get screwed up.

I agree with these points. Avoiding probate for ease, and privacy to the amount / value of assets being distributed are valid reasons to avoid probate. This can be done by establishing a living trust for Dad, heirs are the two siblings. If the only asset were one home, and the two beneficiaries/heirs, the house would transfer at stepped up fv, new basis for heirs. They could own it jointly thereafter. But they'd have to work out financially supporting it, who could would live in it. Could be problems depending on the sibs. Or, as I did with my mom's house, I bought out my siblings at time the estate was settling, two still living at the time vs four at time of my mom's will drafting. She had little in assets so probate wasn't a big concern. I have a living trust for privacy reasons, as did my late sister. All this stuff is routine for a specialty estate attorney.

 

[MarieIG]

Thanks Gill. I've interviewed a few estate lawyers, and they're tending to agree that putting the house and/or cars into a living trust isn't worth the trouble and expense as compared to just doing probate. Apparently in NC real estate doesn't necessarily need to go through probate. I need clarification on that bit, but I've found a guy who knows the specific NC county probate people, and he says they're easy to work with.

I recall Suze Orman telling horror stories about real estate and probate in California. But that would differ significantly from state to state.

I suspect, but do not know, that the form of the deed (for example reflecting rights of survivorship) may dictate whether real estate goes through probate. Hopefully your attorney will give you more information. Good luck!

 

[Cassidywoods]

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