Millions are "Unretiring"

[ncbill]

The unexpected part of the house painting was that they'd planned to do it themselves, as they did 15 years ago, but my friend had a bike accident last year and had to have a hip replacement. That's limited her physically. I am sympathetic to their having to pay more for medical than they'd anticipated. Our healthcare system is a mess, and many, many people are blindsided by astronomical out-of-pocket costs (the #1 cause of personal bankruptcy, IIR).

OP was hypothesizing IIR as to reasons for unretirement. My friend is an example of someone who quit or was laid off during COVID and aspired to retire -- maybe even announced it -- but then realized it wasn't financially feasible.

Yeah, even though ACA can be nearly free in terms of the monthly premium those on it need to keep in mind the (2023) out-of-pocket max is over $9,000 per person!

Then at 65 that switches once on Medicare (w/ traditional Medigap plan)...more expensive monthly premiums but much lower maximum OOP.

 

[Koolau]

A friend of mine is making good money doing this and I looked up which medical issues exclude you and unfortunately if you are on a beta blocker for a heart issue it’s not wise to do it or donate blood.

No expert on issues with plasma though I donated in my youth. I was never deferred for blood donation due to beta blockers.

Well I was kind of joking. The mad money is nice, but I don't do it for the money. I do it because platelets are desperately needed, especially by cancer patients since many treatments wipe them out. It takes many, many units of whole blood to make up a single platelet donation. Additionally, some patients need single-source platelets instead the aggregate. Platelet apheresis is a sacrifice. It takes 60 to 120 minutes, depending on my count and whether I'm willing to give triples. It is only 1% of blood so the process takes time to extract the sliver in the centrifuge column.

Plasma is easy to give in comparison. The column is so large (55%) they can split it off in no time.

Geez, now I sound like I'm tooting my horn and falling on my sword for humanity. Back to un-retiring.

Yeah, I used to stop taking my 81 mg ASA 2 days prior to blood donation to insure the platelets could be used.

By all means, toot your horn (or others of us will toot it for you!) Donating blood is a sacrificial gift (time, slight pain, scar tissue) that saves lives. I wish more people would take the time to give the gift of life. If I'm proud of anything I've done in life, it would be blood donations. I'm so disappointed that I can no longer donate. I think I got to almost 150 units. (Now look who's tooting!! - Sorry about that.)

Returning you now...

 

[Teacher Terry]

You can donate blood and plasma if you take beta blockers for HBP. If you take them for a heart issue you can not as you may experience a adverse reaction.

 

[Chuckanut]

OP was hypothesizing IIR as to reasons for unretirement. My friend is an example of someone who quit or was laid off during COVID and aspired to retire -- maybe even announced it -- but then realized it wasn't financially feasible.

I've known a few people who jumped into this boat without thinking it through. The two biggest issues are 1.) Not taking inflation into account over the 15-30 years of their retirement, and 2.) Not taking periodic big expenditures into account such as the need to replace the old gas-hog jalopy with a newer gas-hog car, or perhaps an EV.

 

[GaryInCO]

I took SS shortly after my full retirement age so I am carefully monitoring my work so I can avoid the dreaded tax torpedo.

Forgive my ignorance, but... what is this torpedo of which you speak? I thought once you reached FRA you could earn any amount without penalty.

 

[frank]

I also was wondering about the tax after retirement at full retirement age. I thought you could earn as much as you want without affecting your ss income. I usually am not much of a budget kind of guy. usually I look at my net worth every so often and if it is going down, I will adjust. usually it is increasing. I do some part time work for research companies if they have a project that interests me, but mostly for something to do.

 

[Koolau]

You can donate blood and plasma if you take beta blockers for HBP. If you take them for a heart issue you can not as you may experience a adverse reaction.

They never asked me why I take beta blockers - and I do have heart issues as well as HBP. It may differ from area to area. We are chronically low on donations so maybe they don't worry about it.

 

[Surewhitey]

I've been busy reading the 6 pages, so here's our plan (DW just doesn't know it yet).

I've trimmed back to half time compared to 4 years ago. She still "likes" her j*b. It's very flexible. We have a 6 year old and 8 month old GB's & live 1 street over, so we're likely here for a while. Based on basic expenses, we're at a 2% WR of assets, with travel, closer to 3%.

Options are moving out of the city & to 1 car which would drop 25% of the basic costs. We've done this before and are on the same page if needed.

We really have balance in our lives so a little w*rk is a good thing. Plus I get to help neighbors and friends with projects when I feel like giving back.

One of my curiosities is living in a small home off-grid and being more self sufficient. Maybe in the future cards...

 

[Gumby]

Forgive my ignorance, but... what is this torpedo of which you speak? I thought once you reached FRA you could earn any amount without penalty.

Turbo29 can certainly speak for himself, but I thought he was referring to earning less than the amount where your social security starts getting taxed (which generally would be $32k minus 1/2 of your social security (if you are MFJ))

 

[MarieIG]

We don't really have a formal back-up plan and I tried to get our ducks in a row before we retired.

Our biggest expense was, and continues to be, taxes. We could "reduce" them temporarily by not doing Roth conversions this year, but I don't see the point. We could take my SS early while continuing to postpone DH's, but we're not there yet (and that is contraindicated with the Roth conversions).

There is some flexibility in discretionary items. For example, DH wanted to buy me a new car this year, I didn't want it anyway (I like the vintage Honda), and he eventually backed off about that.

Our "unexpected" expenses turned out to be DH's parents who over extended themselves (again) and count on DH to bail them out.

 

[Bigdawg]

Our "unexpected" expenses turned out to be DH's parents who over extended themselves (again) and count on DH to bail them out.

^Definitely discretionary. Not easy to say no, but I would try.

 

[MarieIG]

^Definitely discretionary. Not easy to say no, but I would try.

I wouldn't let them go cold or hungry (i.e. would send the a monthly supplement to FIL's pension) but there is a sense of entitlement. Last year was to pay property taxes on a third piece of property and pay a lawyer to get it ready for sale (and then FIL changed his mind about selling it). Most recently, FIL brought a 4k hearing aide because the one covered by the government didn't work, and then BIL called DH to wire him the money to pay for it

I hit the roof because they didn't even have the courtesy to run it by us first. I would have wanted to investigate if we could have bought the same model here (the US) cheaper. I would have caved if we couldn't find it but still!

 

[Music Lover]

I wouldn't let them go cold or hungry (i.e. would send the a monthly supplement to FIL's pension) but there is a sense of entitlement. Last year was to pay property taxes on a third piece of property and pay a lawyer to get it ready for sale (and then FIL changed his mind about selling it). Most recently, FIL brought a 4k hearing aide because the one covered by the government didn't work, and then BIL called DH to wire him the money to pay for it

I hit the roof because they didn't even have the courtesy to run it by us first. I would have wanted to investigate if we could have bought the same model here (the US) cheaper. I would have caved if we couldn't find it but still!

They own 3 properties and are hitting you up for money?

 

[MarieIG]

They own 3 properties and are hitting you up for money?

Yes. A two family home in town with my BIL and his wife living upstairs; a small beach house; and a piece of property with olive trees. They live in Europe. FIL spent a lot of money on BIL over the years, and it is my understanding that his old age government pension (like our SS) was reduced due to the country's fiscal mess. My DH is a very good man and he is soft-hearted. I feel like the Wicked Witch of the West.

 

[W2R]

Yes. A two family home in town with my BIL and his wife living upstairs; a small beach house; and a piece of property with olive trees. They live in Europe. FIL spent a lot of money on BIL over the years, and it is my understanding that his old age government pension (like our SS) was reduced due to the country's fiscal mess. My DH is a very good man and he is soft-hearted. I feel like the Wicked Witch of the West.

Seems to me they are trying to take advantage of you and your DH.

Anyway, IMO these are not nice people, and your DH may never figure that out because they are his parents. Either way, you most definitely are NOT the Wicked Witch of the West.

 

[MarieIG]

Seems to me they are trying to take advantage of you and your DH.

Anyway, IMO these are not nice people, and your DH may never figure that out because they are his parents. Either way, you most definitely are NOT the Wicked Witch of the West.

Thank you.

 

[Calico]

Seems to me they are trying to take advantage of you and your DH.

Anyway, IMO these are not nice people, and your DH may never figure that out because they are his parents. Either way, you most definitely are NOT the Wicked Witch of the West.

I agree 100%.

If the FIL has spent so much money on the BIL over the years, seems like it's time for the BIL to step up and help.

OP: why is your BIL asking your husband to pay?

 

[skyking1]

I agree with you both on the above. Unfortunately we can't pick family so much, and they can collectively be a big load of baggage.

 

[pjigar]

Our backup plan has several layers as well:

0. Start with 3% SWR and enjoy life.
1. We already have some froth in almost every category so we can trim back during cyclic economic environment as necessary.
2. If we go in to an extended recession/depression/inflation then discretionary spending will be cut which is about 40% of the total expense.
3. If we really go down as a country with no sign of recovery then turn acreage into a working farm. Farming has been my dream for life and I dabble on a small scale garden that can feed us partly. Farming would be profitable when all other economic activities collapse for good.
4. If SHTF then I got ammo and tools to use it.


Old age scenario: If we lose mobility and/or need extended nursing care AND we are out of money then sell the acreage.



Did we miss any scenarios?

 

[EastWest Gal]

I'm in the unfortunate position that I can't unretire.. I did love my job, and they are still trying to get me back even after 8 months. My problem is insurance... If I work PT.. most would end up going to ACA premiums. At times I wonder if I should have stayed one more year....

That’s exactly why I unretired two times. They kept needing me and begging me. In fact the first time I unretired was three days after I retired, but to a much easier part time position. I worked as a contracted self-employed physician, and our ACA premiums were a line item deduction on top of the standard or itemized deduction, so it was quite helpful protecting and building the nest egg. Spiking premiums and the fact that the ACA was one Senate vote away from being wiped out in 2017 sent me back to employed status for another year and a half.

However, when I went back the second time the job stress was unbearable and I felt like I was losing skills and had lost interest in keeping them up.

With the ACA changes in 2021 and this year, there won’t be an ACA cliff until 2026. Less May go to premiums than you think. That may affect your decision.

 

[MarieIG]

I agree 100%.

If the FIL has spent so much money on the BIL over the years, seems like it's time for the BIL to step up and help.

OP: why is your BIL asking your husband to pay?

Supposedly because he has no savings.

BIL has lived in his parents home his entire life. A few years ago, he called DH and told him that the parents were getting older and since DH knew how to take care of old people (from helping with my parents), we should take the parents in. Thank goodness, that did not fly, and DH did tell BIL that he had to help the parents. But in any event DH's parents do not want to live with us. They only visited us infrequently when the kiddos were young and they could travel in spite of DH buying the plane tickets, were vocal about being bored here, don't speak English and their social circle is there.

 

[11522914]

Our backup plan has several layers as well:

0. Start with 3% SWR and enjoy life.
1. We already have some froth in almost every category so we can trim back during cyclic economic environment as necessary.
2. If we go in to an extended recession/depression/inflation then discretionary spending will be cut which is about 40% of the total expense.
3. If we really go down as a country with no sign of recovery then turn acreage into a working farm. Farming has been my dream for life and I dabble on a small scale garden that can feed us partly. Farming would be profitable when all other economic activities collapse for good.
4. If SHTF then I got ammo and tools to use it.


Old age scenario: If we lose mobility and/or need extended nursing care AND we are out of money then sell the acreage.



Did we miss any scenarios?

Pretty much 0,1 & 2 are our plan too. 3 & 4 I spend no energy thinking about it at all as I don't realistically think it will happen. If it does I'll deal with it in real time.

Old age scenario: Sell the house.

 

[Out of Steam]

Without our excess COVID risk, I would consider part-time or seasonal work. The real-world 30% price increases since the pandemic began have been sobering.

Reality is that we can afford to do what we want, including some international travel, by economizing on things like cars and delaying home modifications until we both have Social Security coming in.

 

[Out of Steam]

Forgive my ignorance, but... what is this torpedo of which you speak? I thought once you reached FRA you could earn any amount without penalty.

For someone not using their retirement accounts to meet annual expenses in their 60s, it is more likely the higher SS payments starting at 70 plus RMDs pushing them into high tax brackets and/or triggering extra charges for Medicare Part B under IRMAA.

For those of middle-class or higher incomes, Social Security becomes a complex program. In my case, with a public pension that includes years where I didn't pay SS, the questions are extremely complex.

 

[Turbo29]

Turbo29 can certainly speak for himself, but I thought he was referring to earning less than the amount where your social security starts getting taxed (which generally would be $32k minus 1/2 of your social security (if you are MFJ))

That's exactly what I was referring to. Work too much and I will be paying a 40.7% marginal rate on each dollar for the next $10K or so in income.

https://www.kiplinger.com/article/t...orried-should-i-be-about-the-tax-torpedo.html

Back to the subject of "unretiring," they will allow me to work up to 19.99hr/wk but I cut it off at 15-16hr/wk. That amount gets me out of the house for a while, but not too much.