Moved into CCRC today

[jgman]

Glad I found this post. Need to find my 88 year old father a place to move. He has trouble with his eyesight....hopefully this won't prevent him from moving to a CCRC. He has LTCI.....can he use this to pay some of the entrance and or monthly fees....anyone know?

 

[harllee]

Glad I found this post. Need to find my 88 year old father a place to move. He has trouble with his eyesight....hopefully this won't prevent him from moving to a CCRC. He has LTCI.....can he use this to pay some of the entrance and or monthly fees....anyone know?

LTC insurance payment depends on his condition. My mother has dementia and heart failure but her LTC insurance is refusing to pay because she is not bad off enough (I am appealing the decision). The LTC insurance requires that she not be able to perform 2 out of 5 activities of daily living. Mother can still go to the bathroom, feed herself, get out of bed, so they say she does not qualify. Probably if he can qualify for LTC insurance then he would not pass the entrance tests at a CCRC like mine (Class A that has strict entrance requirements). All the CCRCs in my area have long wing lists so you will need to look for one with no waiting list.

 

[donheff]

Glad I found this post. Need to find my 88 year old father a place to move. He has trouble with his eyesight....hopefully this won't prevent him from moving to a CCRC. He has LTCI.....can he use this to pay some of the entrance and or monthly fees....anyone know?

LTC insurance payment depends on his condition. My mother has dementia and heart failure but her LTC insurance is refusing to pay because she is not bad off enough (I am appealing the decision). The LTC insurance requires that she not be able to perform 2 out of 5 activities of daily living. Mother can still go to the bathroom, feed herself, get out of bed, so they say she does not qualify. Probably if he can qualify for LTC insurance then he would not pass the entrance tests at a CCRC like mine (Class A that has strict entrance requirements). All the CCRCs in my area have long wing lists so you will need to look for one with no waiting list.

I have Federal LTC which is monitored by OPM so probably a bit more accommodating than most but, as Harlee points out, they all require documentation that you need the care assistance. Assuming your father is currently in OK shape and can enter in independent or assisted living, the CCRC will likely look positively at his LTC since it indicates that he will have additional resources to cover some or all of the costs for a later move to their nursing or dementia units if he needs that.

 

[jgman]

LTC insurance payment depends on his condition. My mother has dementia and heart failure but her LTC insurance is refusing to pay because she is not bad off enough (I am appealing the decision). The LTC insurance requires that she not be able to perform 2 out of 5 activities of daily living. Mother can still go to the bathroom, feed herself, get out of bed, so they say she does not qualify. Probably if he can qualify for LTC insurance then he would not pass the entrance tests at a CCRC like mine (Class A that has strict entrance requirements). All the CCRCs in my area have long wing lists so you will need to look for one with no waiting list.

Thanks! He is in good shape physically and mentally, other that his limited eyesight, so he won't qualify for LTC right now. Have several CCRCs locally that have vacancies. Just need to visit and see which one is the best fit.

 

[jgman]

I have Federal LTC which is monitored by OPM so probably a bit more accommodating than most but, as Harlee points out, they all require documentation that you need the care assistance. Assuming your father is currently in OK shape and can enter in independent or assisted living, the CCRC will likely look positively at his LTC since it indicates that he will have additional resources to cover some or all of the costs for a later move to their nursing or dementia units if he needs that.

Excellent and thanks!.

 

[braumeister]

This might help.

Can I Use My Long-Term Care Insurance in a CCRC?

 

[jgman]

This might help.

Can I Use My Long-Term Care Insurance in a CCRC?

This was helpful. I believe the CCRCs around here are Type A life care facilities. Since he has the LTC and is in good health overall, a Type C facility may make more sense. I'll have to see whether the CCRCs also provide Type C style arrangements.

 

[ChrisC]

This was helpful. I believe the CCRCs around here are Type A life care facilities. Since he has the LTC and is in good health overall, a Type C facility may make more sense. I'll have to see whether the CCRCs also provide Type C style arrangements.

There are also Type B contracts in which CCRCs will gladly take LTCi. These facilities also require a entrance fee and offer discounted rates for skilled nursing care if needed on campus. Here are two of them in my area, each has a different business model for its CCRC, but the contacts are characterized as a Modified B type contract in the NC Reference Guide for CCRCs. https://thecypressofcharlotte.com/; https://www.southminster.org/

You know, there are some CCRCs that offer different types of contracts for their residents -- not all are restricted to one contract type for incoming residents. At least in the Charlotte, NC area, this chain of non-profit CCRCs offers multiple contracts, Type A, Type B and perhaps a modified Type B that closely resembles Type C contracts:https://www.actsretirement.org/

 

[jgman]

There are also Type B contracts in which CCRCs will gladly take LTCi. These facilities also require a entrance fee and offer discounted rates for skilled nursing care if needed on campus. Here are two of them in my area, each has a different business model for its CCRC, but the contacts are characterized as a Modified B type contract in the NC Reference Guide for CCRCs. https://thecypressofcharlotte.com/; https://www.southminster.org/

You know, there are some CCRCs that offer different types of contracts for their residents -- not all are restricted to one contract type for incoming residents. At least in the Charlotte, NC area, this chain of non-profit CCRCs offers multiple contracts, Type A, Type B and perhaps a modified Type B that closely resembles Type C contracts:https://www.actsretirement.org/

Good to know...thanks! My father is considering cancelling his LTC as the rates keep going up. They offered him a buyout. I suggested if the buyout is reasonable, take the buyout and cancel LTC, and enroll in a Type A CRCC contract.

 

[harllee]

Good to know...thanks! My father is considering cancelling his LTC as the rates keep going up. They offered him a buyout. I suggested if the buyout is reasonable, take the buyout and cancel LTC, and enroll in a Type A contract.

That might make sense depending on the numbers. I am having no success claiming my mother's LTC insurance even though she is in bad shape physically and mentally and has to have caretakers. Wish I could cash it out and take a lump sum but that is not an option.

 

[jgman]

That might make sense depending on the numbers. I am having no success claiming my mother's LTC insurance even though she is in bad shape physically and mentally and has to have caretakers. Wish I could cash it out and take a lump sum but that is not an option.

I am a retired fed, 58 years old, divorced/no kids, and was going to start looking into getting a LTC policy. But after considering the cost of LTC and the potential difficulty in claiming it, I think the Type A CCRC with no LTC is a better option for me.

 

[ChrisC]

I am a retired fed, 58 years old, divorced/no kids, and was going to start looking into getting a LTC policy. But after considering the cost of LTC and the potential difficulty in claiming it, I think the Type A CCRC with no LTC is a better option for me.

Just a counter point here, I'm a retired Fed at 69.75 years old and wife at 72. We've had Federal LTCi policies since 2003. The policies afford us with options for LTC, including residence in a CCRC, which I didn't know about when we took out the LTCi policies but we heard about CCRCs when we retired 10 years ago. You learn new stuff all the time if you keep an open mind and research stuff. For instance, I just found out about Early Admission programs at some CCRCs and recently one of the largest CCRCs in my area is offering "at-home" care services for those wishing to age-in-place who may need LTC at home. https://aldersgateathome.org/.

LTCi provides one with greater options than being anchored or locked into a specific facility though I guess if you find the one CCRC that is best for you, then that's certainly the best option for you.

Just because you hear about publicized cases of difficulty in claiming LTCi benefits (and I've never heard of this occurring with Federal LTCi), I wouldn't rule out taking out a LTCi policy. Of course, age and other events might overtake your ability to obtain favorable underwriting treatment for LTCi: the Federal LTCi has taken a pause on issuing new policies and who knows what medical underwriting standards might get in the way of coverage.

 

[Huston55]

LTC insurance payment depends on his condition. My mother has dementia and heart failure but her LTC insurance is refusing to pay because she is not bad off enough (I am appealing the decision). The LTC insurance requires that she not be able to perform 2 out of 5 activities of daily living. Mother can still go to the bathroom, feed herself, get out of bed, so they say she does not qualify. Probably if he can qualify for LTC insurance then he would not pass the entrance tests at a CCRC like mine (Class A that has strict entrance requirements). All the CCRCs in my area have long wing lists so you will need to look for one with no waiting list.

Isn't dementia a qualifying condition to collect LTCI?

For example, it qualifies an insured to collect LTCI in California.

"An 'impairment of cognitive ability' means you need 'substantial supervision due to severe cognitive impairment'."

 

[harllee]

Isn't dementia a qualifying condition to collect LTCI?

For example, it qualifies an insured to collect LTCI in California.

"An 'impairment of cognitive ability' means you need 'substantial supervision due to severe cognitive impairment'."

Not for my mother's LTCI policy--that policy requires she be unable to perform 2 out of 5 activities of daily living. In any event she has not been diagnosed with "severe" cognitive impairment yet. Severe cognitive impairment requires you be at risk of harming yourself or others and she is not at that stage. Her dementia is moderate, her main issue is heart failure.

 

[youbet]

Not for my mother's LTCI policy--that policy requires she be unable to perform 2 out of 5 activities of daily living. In any event she has not been diagnosed with "severe" cognitive impairment yet. Severe cognitive impairment requires you be at risk of harming yourself or others and she is not at that stage. Her dementia is moderate, her main issue is heart failure.

What is it that you are looking for your mother's LTCI to pay? Assistance while she remains in her independent living apartment? The charges for her to be in an assisted living apartment? The charges for her to be in skilled nursing?

 

[harllee]

What is it that you are looking for your mother's LTCI to pay? Assistance while she remains in her independent living apartment? The charges for her to be in an assisted living apartment? The charges for her to be in skilled nursing?

Right now I would like the LTCI to pay for mother's caretakers (policy provides for a certain amount to be paid for caretakers daily). Soon I think she will have to move to a higher level of care--either assisted living or skilled nursing and I want the LTC policy to pay the cost of that. The insurance company has been dragging their feet--first they said they could not find her policy, then they said they could not find the documents I faxed them, then they ruled her ineligible with no explanation. I think they are dragging it out so she will de before they have to pay anything.

 

[youbet]

Right now I would like the LTCI to pay for mother's caretakers (policy provides for a certain amount to be paid for caretakers daily). Soon I think she will have to move to a higher level of care--either assisted living or skilled nursing and I want the LTC policy to pay the cost of that. The insurance company has been dragging their feet--first they said they could not find her policy, then they said they could not find the documents I faxed them, then they ruled her ineligible with no explanation. I think they are dragging it out so she will de before they have to pay anything.

Did the documents they conveniently lost include a doc's certification that there are at least two ADL's she can no longer perform?

I agree with your "dragging it out" feelings.

 

[harllee]

Did the documents they conveniently lost include a doc's certification that there are at least two ADL's she can no longer perform?

I agree with your "dragging it out" feelings.

Yes, I have sent it to them a second time. Now we are arguing over whether mother is unable to do 2 ADLs. Doctor says cannot take a shower on her own because she has been falling but the insurance company says she can give herself a sponge bath. Doctor also says she cannot prepare her own meals but insurance company says the ADL does not include meal preparation, so long as she can use a spoon and fork she does not qualify.

Mother's long term care insurance (that she has paid for for 35 years) appears to me to be worthless. it looks like it will only pay if she is in a coma.

 

[Act2]

Harllee, how frustrating! I’m so sorry you are going through this.

I had frustration initially getting my Dad’s LTC carrier to pay but once they started paying it was smooth through the rest of his life. They, too, “lost the paperwork“ a couple times.
They were very picky about the ADL’s being exactly as defined in the policy, and I guess that’s going to always be the case about what is or is not covered. Once he moved to memory care he clearly qualified and the LTC carrier finally came through.

 

[harllee]

Some of the things we have been doing at the CCRC: Scottish country dance class, signed up at the fitness center and took a tour, signed up for yoga at the fitness center, DH has a ping pong game lined up, we have dinners scheduled with new friends several nights in the dining room, went to Sunday informal discussion in the pub and meet a lot of people, went to a movie in the very nice cinema, toured the library and checked out books, arranged for the weekly housekeeping(Yah!). As Barney and Andy in Mayberry said "it just go, go, go" and being extroverts we are loving it. We have 2 couples that we have known a long time (around our age) coming for drinks in the pub and dinner in the main dining room and we will give them a tour of our apt. The wives of both couples want to get on the waiting list here but the husbands are reluctant. We hope this will give the husbands a push toward the waiting list. We have at least 10 friends already on the waiting list.

 

[Teacher Terry]

Having friends that live there too will really be fun especially as everyone gets older.

 

[harllee]

Having friends that live there too will really be fun especially as everyone gets older.

My best friend from college is on the waiting list. We will have a GREAT time if she ever gets to move in.

 

[braumeister]

I'm on the waiting list at four different, widely separated CCRCs, and I think I would be very happy at any of them. But the lists move slowly, so it will be years in the future.

I've tried to interest a number of friends in at least considering a CCRC, but so far haven't managed to generate any interest at all. "Too far in the future, not enough certainty, I like where I am, I won't ever need that, etc., etc."

It seems you have to be a particular kind of person to consider that kind of lifestyle. I don't know exactly what that means -- lifestyle, health status, relative affluence, personality type, something else?

 

[Jerry1]

It seems you have to be a particular kind of person to consider that kind of lifestyle. I don't know exactly what that means -- lifestyle, health status, relative affluence, personality type, something else?

I share that concern. A CCRC makes sense when you think of getting older and needing help but the lifestyle prior to that time of needing help is the concern I have. Being an introvert, I like my space. Even the thought of sharing a wall in a condo is unappealing to me. However, I recognize that believing I can live my years out at home is a wishful thought and not a plan. I’m watching my dad (92) go through that right now. Though, he did pretty well until a couple years ago.

At 62/67, me and DW are having some serious discussions and this thread is very helpful. DW’s aunt is going into assisted living and we’ll be watching that. While I’d like to live out my days at home, I think the ability to get reliable help will make it difficult to impossible. Simple things like getting a reliable lawn and snow removal service are difficult. I can’t imagine how difficult it will be to get and retain reliable person needs help.

 

[Katiek]

I share that concern. A CCRC makes sense when you think of getting older and needing help but the lifestyle prior to that time of needing help is the concern I have. Being an introvert, I like my space. Even the thought of sharing a wall in a condo is unappealing to me. .....

I've only visited a few but I think they each had some separate "cottages" that didn't share walls. They tended to be bigger so the cost was somewhat higher, but that may not be true everywhere. The other consideration is that they each had at least a small walk outdoors to the main building, so if you lived in an area with bad weather , you'd have at least some walk outside to get to the dining/fitness facilities etc. But in nice weather locations, that's much less of an issue.


Also, while each had some charge for food, they gave a credit that you could use for take out if you wanted to eat in your own apartment. There's no avoiding that you're living around other people and to the extent you want to use the facilities etc, you'd deal with that, but I'm sure lots of people don't go to all the activities.