Opinion: The moment I realized we’re saving too much for retirement

[dirtbiker]

A recommended article came up on my news feed that really made my blood boil. Bill Perkins, net worth $55 million, is telling people to save less for retirement, and spend the money on experiences now.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aol.com/amphtml/opinion-ve-doing-retirement-planning-142751339.html

Like that's the message we need to send out to a nation that is largely unprepared for retirement as it is.

You can see my comments under "Gravel Rider."



FWIW, I'm in bed sick with the flu while the rest of the family is celebrating Thanksgiving. I may just be a bit testy.

 

[Kings over Queens]

I didn't read the article, and while it's easy for a guy with a 55 million dollar net worth to spend more on experiences, the message is valuable. I wish I had.

Die with Zero, right?

Feel better.

 

[dirtbiker]

If I die with zero, than i would have failed financially. I care less about leaving money to heirs (and may leave most to charity, depending how my children are doing financially) than I do the stress of knowing I'm approaching zero.

 

[Kings over Queens]

If I die with zero, than i would have failed financially. I care less about leaving money to heirs (and may leave most to charity, depending how my children are doing financially) than I do the stress of knowing I'm approaching zero.

It transcends money.

Die with zero regrets. Die with zero in your experience bucket.

I don't know if you've read the book. It resonated with me.

 

[Fermion]

Let me pose you a question.

Who is happier today? Steve Jobs, Bruce Willis or the 66 year old guy who seems quite agile while loading in my packages at the UPS store?

 

[dirtbiker]

It transcends money.

Die with zero regrets. Die with zero in your experience bucket.

I don't know if you've read the book. It resonated with me.

I don't plan to read the book. I know how to gain experiences. I'm quite good at vacationing and spending money. I don't need a book to tell me that. Buckling down and making the unsexy choice to prioritize saving money instead of spending it is the hard part. And if we look at the state of the average American retirement, most people don't need to be told to spend their money instead of saving it.

 

[dirtbiker]

Let me pose you a question.

Who is happier today? Steve Jobs, Bruce Willis or the 66 year old guy who seems quite agile while loading in my packages at the UPS store?

I don't understand how that is applicable to this discussion. We're all going to die someday. Who happens to be living and of sound mind at the present moment seems to be rather arbitrary. A better question, if you're trying to make the point I believe you're trying to make, would be to ask who led the most fulfilling life at the end of each of their lives. And I would have no way of answering that question, as I knew none of them personally, and don't know what in life fulfilled them individually.

 

[Car-Guy]

Let me pose you a question.

Who is happier today? Steve Jobs, Bruce Willis or the 66 year old guy who seems quite agile while loading in my packages at the UPS store?

If those are my only choices, I pick the 66 year old guy working at UPS. Completely different answer if you'd add Musk into the mix.

 

[Fermion]

I don't understand how that is applicable to this discussion. We're all going to die someday. Who happens to be living and of sound mind at the present moment seems to be rather arbitrary. A better question, if you're trying to make the point I believe you're trying to make, would be to ask who led the most fulfilling life at the end of each of their lives. And I would have no way of answering that question, as I knew none of them personally, and don't know what in life fulfilled them individually.

I actually did not read the article you linked so I am not sure what was making your blood boil.

If you are upset that someone who is 50 years old and only has $30,000 saved up wants to retire and have experiences, I get why that seems a foolish thing.

If someone is 50 years old and has $800,000 saved up it starts to get not as foolish. Maybe they have to get the UPS store job at 66, maybe not.

If they have $2 million and continue to work, they are gambling they won't be Jobs or Bruce.

 

[Bigdawg]

I did not read the article. I have read Die With Zero. Additionally, I have listened to mutiple Bill Perkins interviews. I wanted to get a full picture of his thought process. Many folks, including some on here, have saved too much for Retirment. Obviously please save enough to cover your foreseeable expenses. But if you die with say 10 million investable at age 85 then you probably saved too much. Balance that out with experiences. I believe no one gets it perfect. American's in general don't save enough. The point of his book which you said you won't read is to live life and experience your experiences at the appropriate age to maximize those experiences. One example I've heard him talk about is taking the inexpensive (go cheap) vacation when younger instead of saving for the same vacation (better accommodations, etc...) at a later date when you won't get as much enjoyment. To each is own. Get well and enjoy some left over turkey when you feel better.

 

[Fermion]

If those are my only choices, I pick the 66 year old guy working at UPS. Completely different answer if you'd add Musk into the mix.

I don't know if I would want to be Musk.

a) I would not be able to pronounce my own kid's name

b) Someone would need to keep me from opening my mouth on social media

 

[Car-Guy]

I'd take that chance. But still would probably do a lot of things different than he does.


And if anyone cared or commented....

 

[dirtbiker]

I actually did not read the article you linked so I am not sure what was making your blood boil.

If you are upset that someone who is 50 years old and only has $30,000 saved up wants to retire and have experiences, I get why that seems a foolish thing.

If someone is 50 years old and has $800,000 saved up it starts to get not as foolish. Maybe they have to get the UPS store job at 66, maybe not.

If they have $2 million and continue to work, they are gambling they won't be Jobs or Bruce.

You took longer to reply to a discussion about an article you didn't read than it would have taken you to read the article. How can you expect to have a meaningful discussion about an article you didn't read?

 

[Fermion]

You took longer to reply to a discussion about an article you didn't read than it would have taken you to read the article. How can you expect to have a meaningful discussion about an article you didn't read?

I trusted your ability to summarize it.

 

[athena53]

Let me pose you a question.

Who is happier today? Steve Jobs, Bruce Willis or the 66 year old guy who seems quite agile while loading in my packages at the UPS store?

I agree. That headline is VERY misleading. I listened to a podcast interview with the author and it really reinforced some of my thinking about enjoying money and giving some away now, but in the almost-10 years since I retired my investments are still increasing at over 2%/year after withdrawals.

BUT- Priority 1 is not outliving my savings and leaving my family scrambling to take care of me when I'm senile and incontinent or finding a Medicaid nursing home that isn't a horror show. Second is providing for the education of the 3 grandchildren and third is leaving a legacy. DS, my only child, says whatever I leave will go to his kids.

But, whatever I withdraw during the year I feel free to give away and BTD by year end.

 

[dmpi]

If you died with zero you probably died with less than zero with others left to pick up the pieces and close your estate out. At least...that's my experience.

 

[Fermion]

Ok, I skimmed over it.

It is exactly what I thought it would be.

"But when people are planning the biggest, longest vacation of their lives — their retirement — most don’t do any of that. They’re thinking about how to save money, where to invest these savings, and how to minimize their tax burden, and yet they have only a vague sense of how they want to spend their free time or what their health will enable them to do as they age.

That’s the big error people make in planning for retirement: They’re focusing on the money, without nearly enough thought to the activities that they will actually be doing."


I could sum it up as "firecalc may show 100% but your knees are now only at 50%"

 

[dirtbiker]

I trusted your ability to summarize it.

Fair enough.

And being sick in bed is apparently making me snarky. My apologies.

 

[target2019]

It's funny to me how every mention of the book brings on a debate. He's wrong, he's right, he's got a point, he's a hedge fund manager!

Warren promises to give 99% away after he dies.

I wonder what Bill's plan is?

There just might be a middle road.

 

[target2019]

Fair enough.

And being sick in bed is apparently making me snarky. My apologies.

There's been a few threads about the book itself. Time for a snack, I think.

 

[Kings over Queens]

I don't plan to read the book. I know how to gain experiences. I'm quite good at vacationing and spending money. I don't need a book to tell me that. Buckling down and making the unsexy choice to prioritize saving money instead of spending it is the hard part. And if we look at the state of the average American retirement, most people don't need to be told to spend their money instead of saving it.

You're right.

You are testy.

Hope you feel better and soon.

 

[Gumby]

Some people prefer to travel the world and rack up life experiences. Others prefer the familiarity and comfort of home. Some are more willing to live on the edge financially. Others prefer the security of a fat wallet.

In my book, all of these people are "right" --- for themselves. So I will live out my remaining days in ways that I prefer and others can live out their remaining days in ways they prefer. And each and every one of us can be happy with our choices.

 

[W2R]

FWIW, I'm in bed sick with the flu while the rest of the family is celebrating Thanksgiving. I may just be a bit testy.

Sorry you are feeling so crummy today! What a terrible time to come down with the flu. Hope you can get lots of rest and manage to recover quickly.

As for the article, I enjoy reading other people's ideas and if/when I don't agree with what they say, then I just blow it off and do what I think is sensible.

 

[lucky penny]

Ok, I skimmed over it.

It is exactly what I thought it would be.

"But when people are planning the biggest, longest vacation of their lives — their retirement — most don’t do any of that. They’re thinking about how to save money, where to invest these savings, and how to minimize their tax burden, and yet they have only a vague sense of how they want to spend their free time or what their health will enable them to do as they age.

That’s the big error people make in planning for retirement: They’re focusing on the money, without nearly enough thought to the activities that they will actually be doing."


I could sum it up as "firecalc may show 100% but your knees are now only at 50%"

I appreciate all the points you've made on this post. I retired "late" by most standards but really wasn't ready till then. Being retired would be my new job & I vowed to be good at it. It's been a while now, & I can & will do better.

 

[Teacher Terry]

Like most things in life finding a healthy balance is probably best. By 54 my dad was too sick to enjoy his retirement so I started to travel occasionally in my 40’s but I also saved money for retirement. I have been finishing my bucket list the past 2 years because approaching 70 you don’t know how many healthy years are left. In 2007 at 53 I climbed to the top of the leaning tower of Pisa. I probably couldn’t do that now.