Pickle Ball?

[eytonxav]

I bought a Rally PXL at a great price, so no big deal if it does not work out. Might not be the best choice for a beginner, but it is one of the elongated types which based on a few days of playing makes sense to me based on shots that would have benefited from a little more reach.

 

[Dtail]

I bought a Rally PXL at a great price, so no big deal if it does not work out. Might not be the best choice for a beginner, but it is one of the elongated types which based on a few days of playing makes sense to me based on shots that would have benefited from a little more reach.

Sounds good, close to the Invicta specs but at a lesser price.
Enjoy it and let us know how it plays out for you.

 

[eytonxav]

Sounds good, close to the Invicta specs but at a lesser price.
Enjoy it and let us know how it plays out for you.

Will do. One other question is regarding the balls. We have been playing with the outdoor balls that came with a very cheap set of wood Paddles. They seem a little on the light side to me. I am curious if playing with decent quality balls makes any difference?

 

[Ready]

Will do. One other question is regarding the balls. We have been playing with the outdoor balls that came with a very cheap set of wood Paddles. They seem a little on the light side to me. I am curious if playing with decent quality balls makes any difference?

Most beginners play with Onix balls because they are virtually indestructible. But as you work on drop shots, dinks and adding spin to your shots you will quickly learn to hate those balls. They feel like you are playing with marshmallows.

The "premium" ball used in tournaments is the Dura 40. However, they break so easily that you might only get 3-4 games out of them before they develop cracks.

The Franklin X40 ball is almost as good as the Dura 40 and they last much longer and cost less. I bought a 100 pack of X40 balls on Amazon for $82 when they were on sale. You can buy 12 packs for a reasonably good price on Amazon as well. Almost everyone I play with now uses the X40 as their go to choice.

 

[eytonxav]

Most beginners play with Onix balls because they are virtually indestructible. But as you work on drop shots, dinks and adding spin to your shots you will quickly learn to hate those balls. They feel like you are playing with marshmallows.

The "premium" ball used in tournaments is the Dura 40. However, they break so easily that you might only get 3-4 games out of them before they develop cracks.

The Franklin X40 ball is almost as good as the Dura 40 and they last much longer and cost less. I bought a 100 pack of X40 balls on Amazon for $82 when they were on sale. You can buy 12 packs for a reasonably good price on Amazon as well. Almost everyone I play with now uses the X40 as their go to choice.

Thanks, I will buy some of the Franklin X40s.

 

[Dtail]

Most beginners play with Onix balls because they are virtually indestructible. But as you work on drop shots, dinks and adding spin to your shots you will quickly learn to hate those balls. They feel like you are playing with marshmallows.

The "premium" ball used in tournaments is the Dura 40. However, they break so easily that you might only get 3-4 games out of them before they develop cracks.

The Franklin X40 ball is almost as good as the Dura 40 and they last much longer and cost less. I bought a 100 pack of X40 balls on Amazon for $82 when they were on sale. You can buy 12 packs for a reasonably good price on Amazon as well. Almost everyone I play with now uses the X40 as their go to choice.

100% agree on the Onix, Dura and Franklin ball comments.
We use the Franklin balls exclusively in our recreational play and league play.
Please note that if you play indoors, there are specific indoor balls used.

 

[eytonxav]

Yesterday when playing there was a foursome playing next to us with very strong players. Looked as good as the pros on the YouTube vids. All were playing with Selkirks. I would feel good being half as good as these folks

I appreciate all advice from Dtail and Ready, thanks guys!

 

[Dtail]

Yesterday when playing there was a foursome playing next to us with very strong players. Looked as good as the pros on the YouTube vids. All were playing with Selkirks. I would feel good being half as good as these folks

I appreciate all advice from Dtail and Ready, thanks guys!

Sure.
The advice I will give you to improve your play at the fastest rate is the below.
1) Try to get to the net whenever possible, unless it looks like there is a hard slam coming at you due to a too high of a shot to the opponent.
The game is won at the net at the intermediate and advanced levels.
2) Develop your ability to hit the "3rd shot drop". You can find videos on this type of shot. It is one of the more difficult shots, but can be mastered with a soft touch.

 

[Ready]

Los Angeles just banned playing pickleball with any members outside of your household. I'm not sure how they intend to enforce it though. Has anyone else seen a pandemic related ban on pickleball in their community?

 

[Philliefan33]

Los Angeles just banned playing pickleball with any members outside of your household. I'm not sure how they intend to enforce it though. Has anyone else seen a pandemic related ban on pickleball in their community?

In the Spring when PA was in lockdown, the local townships effectively banned pickleball by locking the outdoor courts. All of the gyms were closed, so no indoor courts were available either. Most local outdoor courts opened by June.

Now we are allowed to play, but must wear masks. It is a bit distracting but we all agree that playing with a mask is better than not being able to play.

 

[Dtail]

Los Angeles just banned playing pickleball with any members outside of your household. I'm not sure how they intend to enforce it though. Has anyone else seen a pandemic related ban on pickleball in their community?

No outdoor or indoor bans on Pickleball here yet in the Tampa area. Back in March, there were indoor and outdoor bans.

 

[eytonxav]

Sure.
The advice I will give you to improve your play at the fastest rate is the below.
1) Try to get to the net whenever possible, unless it looks like there is a hard slam coming at you due to a too high of a shot to the opponent.
The game is won at the net at the intermediate and advanced levels.
2) Develop your ability to hit the "3rd shot drop". You can find videos on this type of shot. It is one of the more difficult shots, but can be mastered with a soft touch.

My partner and I are working on being better at number 1. I need to check out the drop shot you mentioned. One thing I am learning, shortening my backswing and using a little more wrist is helping my game. When I played tennis many years ago, I was mostly a power player, but that is not working out so far playing pickleball.

We play on an outdoor court that cannot be closed as there are no gates. My partner also put up a new strip mall and we lined out a court yesterday for indoor play on colder or rainy days. My new paddle arrived yesterday and I am anxious to try it out, hopefully later today.

 

[Ready]

The strategy of when to get to the net is different when you are serving vs receiving a serve. Most beginners don’t get to the net quickly enough when returning a serve but they move up to the net too quickly when on the serving side.

The goal when returning a serve is to return it slowly and deep, creating as much time as possible to get to the net before the opposing team can hit the third shot. This creates a wall with your partner and forces the opposing team to try and hit a drop shot in the kitchen so that you can’t attack the ball and keep them back.

On the serving side the goal is to drop the third shot in the kitchen and get up to the net before the opposing team can hit the fourth shot. This is the shot that will make you an advanced player. However, while you are learning this shot you are likely to hit the ball either too high or too deep, allowing your opponents to attack the shot. If they can attack it, you can’t move up to the net. You need to stay back, likely behind the baseline, and try again. But most people pop up their third shot and still run up to the kitchen anyway. Then the ball gets slammed at their feet and they have no room to react to it.

So when I’m drilling with new players I teach them to “read” the third shot and determine if it’s a good drop or if it’s too high. Then they make the decision together as a team whether to stay back or move up. Most important is for them to move together as a team. You don’t want your partner up at the net while you are in the back court. That splits up your team and leaves a big gap in the middle.

 

[eytonxav]

The goal when returning a serve is to return it slowly and deep, creating as much time as possible to get to the net before the opposing team can hit the third shot. This creates a wall with your partner and forces the opposing team to try and hit a drop shot in the kitchen so that you can’t attack the ball and keep them back.

This exactly what we try to do, the other aspects still need more work. It is definitely a game of strategy.

 

[Spanky]

I play Pickleball 6x weekly. The paddle definitely makes a difference. There are many good quality paddles in the 70-80 range which have a graphite surface and a honeycomb weave inside.
A popular beginner/intermediate racquet is the Onix Z5 model. The only negative is the pop off the racquet is a little louder than the typical racquet, which might not matter.
The top of the line racquets are ~150 and going higher. Some of these racquets are made by Paddletek/Selkirk and others.
I use a 150 price model from Selkirk and the vibration dampening and soft feel of the racquet makes a difference.
I would first see if you continue to like the game. Beware it can be obsessive over time.
If you have hand/eye coordination and played racquetball/tennis/ping pong in the past and are decent in any of those sports, you will pick up the game in no time.

Have fun and keep us updated.

The new Vanguard series from Selkirk is $199. Paddles are getting a lot more expensive. The manufacturers are claiming that they have spent a lot of money on R&D and therefore have to charge more.

There are many paddles in the $80 dollars are quite good. Champion's paddles are priced in $60 range. I think they are just good as others that cost about $80.

I play with Peddletek Element, which is no longer made. It has nice control and power. I bought it for $45 when it was on sales from Pickleball Central. DW likes to play with the latest and the greatest. I bought her the Peddletek Tempest Wave Pro 6 months ago. Now she wants to 'upgrade' to the Vanguard series from Selkirk, hoping to improve her game.

 

[Dtail]

This exactly what we try to do, the other aspects still need more work. It is definitely a game of strategy.

You should watch how the pros return the serve. They often hit the ball with a slice type return, which "floats" the ball somewhat in the back third of the court.
This allows more time to get the net much easier. If you can slice the ball, this shot is not too difficult, especially on the forehand.

 

[Dtail]

The new Vanguard series from Selkirk is $199. Paddles are getting a lot more expensive. The manufacturers are claiming that they have spent a lot of money on R&D and therefore have to charge more.

There are many paddles in the $80 dollars are quite good. Champion's paddles are priced in $60 range. I think they are just good as others that cost about $80.

I play with Peddletek Element, which is no longer made. It has nice control and power. I bought it for $45 when it was on sales from Pickleball Central. DW likes to play with the latest and the greatest. I bought her the Peddletek Tempest Wave Pro 6 months ago. Now she wants to 'upgrade' to the Vanguard series from Selkirk, hoping to improve her game.

I get your DW. LOL
I just bought the Vanguard last week. Love the paddle.

 

[eytonxav]

You should watch how the pros return the serve. They often hit the ball with a slice type return, which "floats" the ball somewhat in the back third of the court.
This allows more time to get the net much easier. If you can slice the ball, this shot is not too difficult, especially on the forehand.

I've been watching some slow motion video which I have found helpful. I do return some shots with a slice, but have not really done that on return of serve. I have experimented a few times with a slice serve and that is a killer shot if I hit it correctly and put it in the right spot. My fellow players get mad at me when I experiment on different ways to hit the ball, as my experimenting can sometimes cost our team points, LOL. My new Rally PXL paddle, cost me $49, is a big improvement vs the cheap wooden paddles we started with.

Are there any books or video lessons that would be worthwhile spending a few $s on? There are a few instructors in the area, but with Covid this is not a great time to book lessons indoors and outdoors the weather is getting colder and windier.

 

[Dtail]

I've been watching some slow motion video which I have found helpful. I do return some shots with a slice, but have not really done that on return of serve. I have experimented a few times with a slice serve and that is a killer shot if I hit it correctly and put it in the right spot. My fellow players get mad at me when I experiment on different ways to hit the ball, as my experimenting can sometimes cost our team points, LOL. My new Rally PXL paddle, cost me $49, is a big improvement vs the cheap wooden paddles we started with.

Are there any books or video lessons that would be worthwhile spending a few $s on? There are a few instructors in the area, but with Covid this is not a great time to book lessons indoors and outdoors the weather is getting colder and windier.

See below for some video lessons from In2pickle. The lead instructor for this site is Tony Roig and he is very detailed. He takes actual situations and analyzes what they did, what they should/could have done, etc.

https://in2pickle.com/pages/pickleball-videos

As for the slice return of serve, since you have this type of shot in your arsenal, you can use it on many returns without too much effort. Again the purpose is not to win the point on the return, but to get to the kitchen line much easier.

As for slice serves, I use them to some extent and more so if the wind is moving left to right when serving from the "ad court".
As you move up in level though, you will find most agile (even if older) players can get to these serves and thus if your "out" serves are more than 1 per game, it probably is not worth it.

 

[Ready]

One of the challenges of improving your skill level in pickleball is the better you get the fewer balls people will hit to you. Teams will try to pick on the weaker play to win a game, so if you start making too many shots they will direct the balls to your partner. If your partner is not as strong as you, it will eventually feel like you are standing around watching the game while your partner is playing singles.

This can be really frustrating during open play if I can’t find a strong partner to play with.

 

[eytonxav]

See below for some video lessons from In2pickle. The lead instructor for this site is Tony Roig and he is very detailed. He takes actual situations and analyzes what they did, what they should/could have done, etc.

https://in2pickle.com/pages/pickleball-videos

As for the slice return of serve, since you have this type of shot in your arsenal, you can use it on many returns without too much effort. Again the purpose is not to win the point on the return, but to get to the kitchen line much easier.

As for slice serves, I use them to some extent and more so if the wind is moving left to right when serving from the "ad court".
As you move up in level though, you will find most agile (even if older) players can get to these serves and thus if your "out" serves are more than 1 per game, it probably is not worth it.

Thanks for that link, looks like a good one.

 

[Spanky]

I get your DW. LOL
I just bought the Vanguard last week. Love the paddle.

That's nice. The reviews say it offers great control and possibly a game changer. Enjoy.

 

[Spanky]

One of the challenges of improving your skill level in pickleball is the better you get the fewer balls people will hit to you. Teams will try to pick on the weaker play to win a game, so if you start making too many shots they will direct the balls to your partner. If your partner is not as strong as you, it will eventually feel like you are standing around watching the game while your partner is playing singles.

This can be really frustrating during open play if I can’t find a strong partner to play with.

For a doubles game, you should always partner with someone who is at your level if possible.

 

[Dtail]

For a doubles game, you should always partner with someone who is at your level if possible.

In rec play this concept can be difficult at times depending who you play with.
Even in mixed double play when the partners are relatively equal, sometimes the female player is targeted by the male player especially if a hard hitter.

 

[eytonxav]

One of guys I play with found an instructor that does not charge for lessons and he spent some time with us yesterday. He showed us a lot of drills that were quite helpful. He also had a Selkirk Vanguard and Amped S2. I got to try his S2 for a few drills from the NVL and it was a huge improvement in control and being able to absorb a hot shot and just had an overall more solid feel vs my paddle. I can see why Dtail and Ready speak highly of these paddles. I did not get to try his Vanguard.