The first million takes the longest to achieve

For those of you not including your home in your Net Worth, are you excluding your mortgage as a liability as well. If not, you would probably end up with a negative net worth in the beginning.

Also think about the impact of making a specific mortgage payment would have on your net worth. If you include the value of the house, it is a wash. If you exclude the value of the house, it decreases your net worth.

Saying that, I do not attempt to include cars and other property. Mainly those depreciate and would be impossible to sum up anyway.
 
For those of you not including your home in your Net Worth, are you excluding your mortgage as a liability as well. If not, you would probably end up with a negative net worth in the beginning.

In my case we are mortgage free for 20+ years. We payed off house in 5 years and we are still living in it.

I don't include anything besides invested assets. No cars, no real estate etc etc. Only invested assets are earning me money. Cars, houses etc are consuming our money :)
 
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I plotted our portfolio growth...

Happy Easter!
 

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To sum up the NW / investable assets debacle:

Net worth is what you would have left after you sold everything you owned and paid all of your bills. So this not only includes the equity in your home, but also cars, home furnishings, tools, jewelry, etc, etc, etc.

In business, a company's balance sheet is total assets minus total liabilities. To my knowledge, all business accounting is based on net worth.

But many of us here do our financial analysis based on our portfolios of investable assets. So for these purposes, it makes sense to not include the home you live in or personal items. The reasoning for this in retirement is that investable assets are those that generate retirement income. And withdrawal rate for retirement income is based on investable assets.


OP in the first post of this thread mentioned portfolio value. But again, everyone can calculate whatever way they want.
 
I plotted our portfolio growth...

Happy Easter!

WOW!!! I like that! So, number 5 would be ~3 years in the making, number 6 would take ~ 2 years, and 7&8 would take ~ one year.

I'm I reading that projection chart, right?
 
ClosetGamer posted -
18 yrs
2 yrs
2 yrs
1 yr ...

Yes, compounding is amazing, particularly if you also have growing income but avoid lifestyle creep.
__________________

I just finished reviewing Quicken and these are almost identical to my numbers (except my first took 16 years, just portfolio without home). I believe for me, the rapid subsequent growth after the long first million was due to the fact that my accumulation mostly occurred during the great financial crisis of 2000 to approximately 2012. Funny, but at the time, I felt like I wasn’t making any retirement traction, but still kept regularly investing in my index funds despite the portfolio declines or slow growth. Then, it was like a boomerang when the market picked up and recovered after 2012, allowing for the quick compounding growth. I now look back and that God for that long bear market. It just goes to prove once again how bear markets are great times for accumulators.
 
In my case we are mortgage free for 20+ years. We payed off house in 5 years and we are still living in it.

I don't include anything besides invested assets. No cars, no real estate etc etc. Only invested assets are earning me money. Cars, houses etc are consuming our money :)
Yes I agree, cars and houses do consume money in order to maintain them. However, in my case, my house/real-estate has increased in value at least 3 fold in the past 15 years and the last vehicle I bought just 90 days ago has appreciated in vault by about 10k.

The way I look at it is, I do need a house to live in and a car to drive, but I could sell them both and buy something far less expensive to accomplish the same result. (Roof over my heard and transportation) and pocket the appreciated value as profit.

Same with my collectables. They were/are investments. And like equities, I made money on some, and lost on others.


Another thought, do you deduct future/unpaid taxes from investments/assets in calculating your NW? :)
 
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So to you first 1M includes equity in you home. To me it never did.

I agree with Onda and only included Investible Assets in my post above.
Please note that the OP did NOT MENTION Net Worth, only portfolio...
 
To sum up the NW / investable assets debacle:

Net worth is what you would have left after you sold everything you owned and paid all of your bills. So this not only includes the equity in your home, but also cars, home furnishings, tools, jewelry, etc, etc, etc.

In business, a company's balance sheet is total assets minus total liabilities. To my knowledge, all business accounting is based on net worth.

OP in the first post of this thread mentioned portfolio value. But again, everyone can calculate whatever way they want.
+1 And to me everything I own is part of my portfolio/NW.
 
In my case we are mortgage free for 20+ years. We payed off house in 5 years and we are still living in it.

I don't include anything besides invested assets. No cars, no real estate etc etc. Only invested assets are earning me money. Cars, houses etc are consuming our money :)

Correct, the exception being if you own rental real estate aside from your primary residence, then yes, that's included in Investible Assets...
 
The power of compounding can't be ignored. Neither can the fact that the subsequent millions are not worth as much as the first. Although I do not hear anyone complaining about adding subsequent millions to their net worth/investable accounts.

I don't watch the numbers close enough to tell any stories of the years to add. I know for sure that compounding worked, and was a lot faster when working vs spending down in retirement. So what? We have enough. More than many do, less than others. Not worried about it, I don't track net worth any more than general numbers. The only thing I spend the most time on is retirement investment accounts. That is what matters to me. Other net worth items like housing, and expensive items like cars, are not income generating; at least until they are sold for potential increase.
 
26 years to reach $1 million
9 more years to reach $2
6 years have past and I'm still not at $3 million.
I thought I was doing great until I saw this thread!
You are doing great. Again, nominal numbers are deceiving. People with larger portfolio tend to have larger expenses. All you should care about is (your spending)/(your portfolio) number.
 
26 years to reach $1 million
9 more years to reach $2
6 years have past and I'm still not at $3 million.
I thought I was doing great until I saw this thread!


OHHH you are doing very well!!!
You are in a league of a small percentage that are as well off as you are and still working on the next.
There is so many factors how soon the next one comes and no one ways of getting there are equal.
 
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OHHH you are doing very well!!!
You are in a league of a small percentage that are as well off as you are and still working on the next.

Yes.

I do worry a bit that this thread is sending wrong signals to members of the forum who have great plans, portfolios and FIRE programs but don't have these sorts of assets/net worth.

If you have a solid pension, you have a great FIRE plan even if you don't have a zillion dollars. Same thing for if you're younger and still building or working towards a skinnier FIRE because that's what you want.

If your portfolio is 30x the net of your (expenses - non-portfoio income sources) you are in great shape. If that's what you're working towards, keep going.

I have a brother who will have a small union pension while his wife will have a city govt pension. They will have a paid off house and smallish nest egg. They don't live extravagantly and will be fine when they retire.
 
The first million took "forever" - 21-22 years. Second million approximately 4 years. Then roughly three years for the next...and so on...

Similar to your assessment, the last million was under 3 years (impacted by negative returns in 2022).

Noting that I'm still working and adding contributions. However, the impact of these contributions is fairly small relative to overall NW.

Adding the years for context

2012
2016
2018
2020
2023
2024

Time to slow down the accumulation focus, drop to RPT, and start living
 
Yes.

I do worry a bit that this thread is sending wrong signals to members of the forum who have great plans, portfolios and FIRE programs but don't have these sorts of assets/net worth.

Good point - these kinds of threads tend to devolve into a game of comparison instead of educational illustration of how folks got to where they are.
 
ClosetGamer posted -
It just goes to prove once again how bear markets are great times for accumulators.

This is such a powerful message, and one which I wish I'd heard in these terms years ago. Yes, I knew that DCAing would get me more in lower markets, but just the way this is phrased is like a head slap ah-ha insight to me.
 
I remember back in Jan 2000, I was trying to decide if I could take an early retirement offer from my employer at age 50, a nice COLA'd government pension. I had a bit short of 1 million in savings at the time but also had 18 month old and 4 year old sons. Decided that with the pension and a 4% withdrawal rate, I could make it happen. I took the offer.


Next two years worked as a consultant for a government contractor and finally broke $1million mark in mid 2002.


For those early years I was definitely frugal and never withdrew more than 2.5%


After surviving the Great Recession, I started easing up with the spending and enjoying life watching my sons grow. Always had some type of part-time seasonal jobs at a CPA firm. Last employment was April 2018.

Hit $2 million in 2013, $3 million in 2020, $4 million at EOY 2023. Sons graduated from college in 2020 and 2021 with no debt.


Life is good.
 
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I don't use my home or ranch in any equation for wealth but that is me. I really don't think there is a right way or wrong way. When gauging and measuring one's financial numbers use what you feel is the right way for you.

+1

I just track net worth.
For me this includes: investments, house, rental, other property, cars, but not the stuff inside houses.

Mind you we don't live in CA with a $1M+ house, so the house doesn't add much percentage to our overall value. :facepalm:
 
I remember back in Jan 2000, I was trying to decide if I could take an early retirement offer from my employer at age 50, a nice COLA'd government pension. I had a bit short of 1 million in savings at the time but also had 18 month old and 4 year old sons. Decided that with the pension and a 4% withdrawal rate, I could make it happen. I took the offer.


Next two years worked as a consultant for a government contractor and finally broke $1million mark in mid 2002.


For those early years I was definitely frugal and never withdrew more than 2.5%


After surviving the Great Recession, I started easing up with the spending and enjoying life watching my sons grow. Always had some type of part-time seasonal jobs at a CPA firm. Last employment was April 2018.

Hit $2 million in 2013, $3 million in 2020, $4 million at EOY 2023. Sons graduated from college in 2020 and 2021 with no debt.


Life is good.

Sounds like you kinda Coast FIRE'd into $4M all while raising a family, putting kids thru college, and enjoying life - impressive!
 
Good point - these kinds of threads tend to devolve into a game of comparison instead of educational illustration of how folks got to where they are.

I agree but there are also plenty of "I started over with nothing at 50" stories on these Boards, and people who retired without these levels of assets but are happily retired and living modestly.

I know what you mean, though- when I was in my 30s and married to the Financial Train Wreck and trying to raise a small child in my spare time, I couldn't bear to see the cover stories in Money magazine- all those smug couples with the $500K paid-for house with a swimming pool and fully-funded education accounts for their toddlers. It was not my reality.
 
I agree but there are also plenty of "I started over with nothing at 50" stories on these Boards, and people who retired without these levels of assets but are happily retired and living modestly.

I know what you mean, though- when I was in my 30s and married to the Financial Train Wreck and trying to raise a small child in my spare time, I couldn't bear to see the cover stories in Money magazine- all those smug couples with the $500K paid-for house with a swimming pool and fully-funded education accounts for their toddlers. It was not my reality.

+100!:)
 
I agree but there are also plenty of "I started over with nothing at 50" stories on these Boards, and people who retired without these levels of assets but are happily retired and living modestly.

I know what you mean, though- when I was in my 30s and married to the Financial Train Wreck and trying to raise a small child in my spare time, I couldn't bear to see the cover stories in Money magazine- all those smug couples with the $500K paid-for house with a swimming pool and fully-funded education accounts for their toddlers. It was not my reality.

LOL, Believe it or not, those Money Magazine stories would drive me CRAZY too! For one thing, felt like it took a long time before I was gaining any traction money-wise and those magazines were like salt on an open wound. And for another, they would never give you enough detail to quite figure out how those people were able to achieve the lifestyle they had at a reasonably young age. There was always something missing - and the way my brain works, it cannot stand when there is something missing.

The other day, I was thinking about how impossible achieving that Money Magazine lifestyle seemed back in my 20's and early 30's. And so many people my age at the time in NYC seemed to be living this charmed, carefree existence. None of it made any sense. How could people afford things like nice clothes, or owning a decent car in NYC, much less owning a home. I recall buying my first interview suit (on a credit card of course) on sale at a department store - I did not dare spill anything on it it seemed so expensive (maybe ~$150).

Anyhow, seemed like a lot of well-to-do parents were financing the Money Mag lifestyle for their adult children. And when I was on my co-op building's board, I got to see first hand just how true that was - at least in NYC. As a landlord, I've also seen how true it is - both situations where you get an inside look at where the money is really coming from. And of course, much was financed on credit cards, then as it is now.

I had none of those advantages (except for the credit cards). It's a miracle I figured out how to save and retire someday. I do credit DW with a lot of wisdom in that department. We struggled mightily in the beginning, drowning in student loans, burning the midnight oil to complete grad degrees and start careers in the most expensive town this side of the world.

Anyhow, to your point on people happily retired on more modest assets, I have have huge respect for that. I know I way overshot the landing zone - more than a few reasons for my OMY syndrome, fear and ignorance being two of them. I see and read about lots of folks happily in a state of non-work, early enough in life to enjoy their freedom from servitude to a paycheck, on far less than I could have possibly imagined possible. Those examples on this forum have been very educational and enlightening.
 
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